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C4IGrant
10-02-13, 11:40
I just received in a batch of S&W M&P's and wanted to cover some of the changes.

1. Trigger bar: The latest version has a Letter "H" stamped into the side of it.

2. Slide catch/release: Has a bump on the right side that presses against the trigger bar giving the shooter a positive click during reset

3. Sear: This is now a Performance Center Sear.

4. Barrel: The twist rate happened some time ago, but it appears that that the slide to barrel hood fit is much better than what I have seen in the past. You still aren't going to get the same groups as a custom fitted barrel, but the guns should produce 3-5" groups @ 25yds. More than good enough for a service pistol.

For those interested, here are the latest M&P's we got in: http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=209301


http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/SW/M&P_H_Stamp_SlideCatch.jpg

http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/SW/M&P_PC_Sear.jpg


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streck
10-02-13, 11:47
That's good to know. I really wanted to like the one I bought last year but did not want to spend the money fix what should have worked from the factory.

I may have to try a new one again.

Auto426
10-02-13, 11:53
Good to see some information like this. I was sort of considering an M&P as my first polymer pistol, but I didn't feel like trying to figure out the maze of different SKU's and the various updates and changed that have taken place in the past half dozen months.

C4IGrant
10-02-13, 12:00
Good to see some information like this. I was sort of considering an M&P as my first polymer pistol, but I didn't feel like trying to figure out the maze of different SKU's and the various updates and changed that have taken place in the past half dozen months.

This is the BEST M&P I have seen S&W produce and at the $430 price tag, nothing beats it IMHO.


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PD Sgt.
10-02-13, 12:16
This is good to hear. I currently have a 9mm compact on back order (LE), and I am hoping it comes with the upgrades.

Grant, do you know if these upgraded parts, particularly the trigger bar and slide stop, are in the pipeline yet? I would really be interested in upgrading a few of my older M&Ps.

C4IGrant
10-02-13, 12:22
This is good to hear. I currently have a 9mm compact on back order (LE), and I am hoping it comes with the upgrades.

Grant, do you know if these upgraded parts, particularly the trigger bar and slide stop, are in the pipeline yet? I would really be interested in upgrading a few of my older M&Ps.

I think the trigger bars are, but not the slide catch. I have tried to get them, but no joy as of yet.


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streck
10-02-13, 12:22
Now they just need to get the magazines flowing.

C4IGrant
10-02-13, 12:24
Now they just need to get the magazines flowing.

We just got word that the mag issues should be resolved shortly.


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PD Sgt.
10-02-13, 12:27
I think the trigger bars are, but not the slide catch. I have tried to get them, but no joy as of yet.


C4

Thanks. I will keep an eye out.

Auto426
10-02-13, 12:32
This is the BEST M&P I have seen S&W produce and at the $430 price tag, nothing beats it IMHO.


C4

I do like the M&P's best when it comes to the more mainstream polymer guns, but I am thinking that I will like the HK P30 better. The grip was love at first grab, and I was surprised by the paddle magazine release and how easy it was for me to use. I am just a little unsure of the LEM trigger at this point, otherwise I probably would have purchased one by now.

C4IGrant
10-02-13, 12:34
I do like the M&P's best when it comes to the more mainstream polymer guns, but I am thinking that I will like the HK P30 better. The grip was love at first grab, and I was surprised by the paddle magazine release and how easy it was for me to use. I am just a little unsure of the LEM trigger at this point, otherwise I probably would have purchased one by now.

I like HK's pistols (a lot). It is however double the price of the M&P. This coupled with the AWESOME trigger options from Apex, it is a hard gun to beat.


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streck
10-02-13, 12:38
It's hard to compare the M&P to H&K with price difference. Either the M&P works great for you at <$450 or you want to pay for the extras that come with the H&K.

And if you qualify for the Military/LEO rebate, the S&W drops to <$400.

Kenneth
10-02-13, 13:23
It's hard to compare the M&P to H&K with price difference. Either the M&P works great for you at <$450 or you want to pay for the extras that come with the H&K.

And if you qualify for the Military/LEO rebate, the S&W drops to <$400.

Who sends out the rebate and how do you get it?

streck
10-02-13, 13:26
S&W Nation's Finest: LINK (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Category4_750001_750051_757803_-1_757797_757797_image)

bigrobbierob
10-02-13, 13:55
We just got word that the mag issues should be resolved shortly.


C4

Grant, what was the issue with magazine availability?

streck
10-02-13, 14:04
There was no availability.

C4IGrant
10-02-13, 14:19
Grant, what was the issue with magazine availability?

They could not get enough to keep up with their gun sales.

If you sell all your mags then you cannot ship guns.



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PatrioticDisorder
10-02-13, 14:35
Grant you have M&Ps at $430? WOW, that is literally impossible to beat! I now wish I'd bought my M&Ps from you.... Kinda wish I was in the market for one right now, but I will refer people to G&R, good to know.

C4IGrant
10-02-13, 14:44
Grant you have M&Ps at $430? WOW, that is literally impossible to beat! I now wish I'd bought my M&Ps from you.... Kinda wish I was in the market for one right now, but I will refer people to G&R, good to know.

Yep, sure do. Lots of options too (sights, Apex components, polishing work and fitted barrels)!


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streck
10-02-13, 15:03
Grant,

Do you plan to test fire any of the new guns for accuracy to see how they compare to previous builds?

I am seriously interested at this price point but need more confidence that they fixed it this time....

Also, how does the trigger feel? Is the reset pronounced? Is it less gritty?

slappy
10-02-13, 15:19
As an example of one, my newest M&P 9 has a much more pronounced reset than my older 3 do. Not gritty at all and the accuracy is somewhat improved with myself likely still being the issue there.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

bigrobbierob
10-02-13, 15:24
Thank you Grant. I didn't know that was the case.

And mag availability has been the main reason I haven't gone to the M&P9 yet. Theres been Glock mags-O-plenty.

C4IGrant
10-02-13, 16:06
Grant,

Do you plan to test fire any of the new guns for accuracy to see how they compare to previous builds?

I am seriously interested at this price point but need more confidence that they fixed it this time....

Also, how does the trigger feel? Is the reset pronounced? Is it less gritty?

We might. I can pretty much tell with a feeler gauge though. ;)

I did check a gun today with a slide to barrel fit of .002! That is awesome.

The triggers are little gritty, but with some simply polishing, you are good.

Trigger set is pretty good, but not as pronounced as a Glock (which is a good thing IMHO).


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TheJawn
10-02-13, 17:40
$430 base price WTF.

Clint
10-02-13, 18:57
Grant, any word on the availability of Compact 9s?

Heavy Metal
10-02-13, 19:40
if I didn't know better, I would swear Smith listens to you Grant!!!

Five_Point_Five_Six
10-02-13, 19:45
$430 base price WTF.

My thoughts exactly. Looks like my HK fund might take a hit...

Koshinn
10-02-13, 20:11
I just got rid of my 9fs... Seriously tempted to get another.

Do they come with the CORE grip inserts?

walkin' trails
10-02-13, 21:05
I had to go check mine that was probably manufactured in June and it has the H trigger bar. I'm not skilled enough to tear it down to check the sear, but the trigger is acceptable and smoothed out after 200 rounds.

cmkirkham
10-02-13, 21:38
Just checked my 9FS with a test fire date of 10.05.2012 and it has the H-marked trigger bar, bump on the right side slide catch, and a barrel to frame fit tolerance of 0.004". Barrel has two machined dots on the underside. Can't say anything about the sear on this one, as it has the Apex sear and I don't seem to have the original sear.

My 9c has with a test fire date of 12.11.2012 has each of those same items, including the Performance Center sear. Barrel to frame tolerance is tighter than 0.004", but I can't find my thinner feeler gauges at the moment.

Redbeardsong
10-02-13, 21:54
Yes, the new M&P's are much improved. We started seeing these changes last fall in the LE Smiths, and now the commercial guns have followed suit. My 9fs I got last December has these features and a very good trigger, but I've felt some more recent ones with terrific triggers with a crisp break and very little overtravel.

straterman
10-02-13, 22:34
Sounds like s&w is finally getting there shit together! Im so happy to hear this

Michael2007
10-02-13, 22:53
Magazines have been filtering out steadily. Through distributors like Midway. I've got my five now which makes me happy.

ruchik
10-02-13, 22:56
Magazines have been filtering out steadily. Through distributors like Midway. I've got my five now which makes me happy.

I just recently spent $530 on two mags (10 round mags at that in California). But on the plus side, it came with a free gun!

Michael2007
10-02-13, 22:57
For a while people wanted like 55 bucks a mag for used mags and 44mag.com had them for 99 each

Omega Man
10-03-13, 00:26
The trigger on my M&P FS9 that i picked up last year has a smooth as butter pull and a pronounced reset. Way better than an out of box Glock trigger.

C4IGrant
10-03-13, 08:27
Grant, any word on the availability of Compact 9s?

They are on order. That is the best I an tell you.


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C4IGrant
10-03-13, 08:27
if I didn't know better, I would swear Smith listens to you Grant!!!

LOL. Sometimes. ;)


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C4IGrant
10-03-13, 08:28
I just got rid of my 9fs... Seriously tempted to get another.

Do they come with the CORE grip inserts?

No. PC won't share them. :mad:



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streck
10-03-13, 10:54
Grant,

Sorry to drop this here but after searching through multiple threads, I didn't see definitive answer as to what two dimples on the barrel denotes. Has it been announced officially? I know that one dimple is the twist rate....

C4IGrant
10-03-13, 11:58
Grant,

Sorry to drop this here but after searching through multiple threads, I didn't see definitive answer as to what two dimples on the barrel denotes. Has it been announced officially? I know that one dimple is the twist rate....

I believe they use that to ID the CNC machine it came from.


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streck
10-03-13, 12:00
Thanks!

warpedcamshaft
10-03-13, 12:34
I'm glad that S&W was able to fix the M&P 9mm full-size line based on customer feedback.

From my viewpoint, this says a lot about the company... I only hope other manufacturers can learn from S&W.

ASH556
10-03-13, 12:47
This is exciting news! I have a 9mm M&P @ Smith right now for accuracy issues. Maybe they'll just sub all these new parts into it and fix it!

youreacrab
10-03-13, 13:08
Are your mp9 compacts also updated?

C4IGrant
10-03-13, 13:10
Are your mp9 compacts also updated?

We have not received any in yet. We will update this thread when we do.


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Pi3
10-03-13, 13:29
I would be interested in an update 9c with safety when you get some in. Is it worth trying without the apex upgrades?

C4IGrant
10-03-13, 13:29
I would be interested in an update 9c with safety when you get some in. Is it worth trying without the apex upgrades?

I don't think we have any coming with the TS (sorry).

You can certainly try it. I would suggest polishing it up though.


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Redbeardsong
10-03-13, 14:16
The recent compacts that I've seen have the new trigger and reset as well.

Gary1911A1
10-03-13, 15:19
I purchased a two dimple barrel and it dropped right into my older M&P9. I test fired it yesterday with S&B and Federal Eagle both 115FMJ. I'm pleased to report 4" groups with both types of ammo from a seated rest at 27 yards. My M&P trigger is smooth, but no reset. Think I'm going to keep this pistol now.:)

Unkle Kurt
10-03-13, 22:21
Grant,

Is $430 with or without tax?

Is there an additional shipping charge?

MCS
10-04-13, 07:30
Any improvements on the .45 trigger?

Nightstalker865
10-04-13, 07:37
Going to be ordering one of these very soon. Grant, you are terrible on our bank accounts!

On the options drop down I see that polishing is a choice. I lists it with apex parts though. Will you do the polish job on the factory internals only?

C4IGrant
10-04-13, 07:48
Grant,

Is $430 with or without tax?

Is there an additional shipping charge?

Ohio residents pay sales tax. Shipping is $20.



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C4IGrant
10-04-13, 07:49
Going to be ordering one of these very soon. Grant, you are terrible on our bank accounts!

On the options drop down I see that polishing is a choice. I lists it with apex parts though. Will you do the polish job on the factory internals only?

Yes, we can polish the factory parts.


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C4IGrant
10-04-13, 10:06
9mm Compacts and 40 FS M&P's came in today. They all have the updated fixes and the samples I checked, had pretty good barrel to slide fit.



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jerrysimons
10-04-13, 11:57
Yes, we can polish the factory parts.


C4

Can you please explain the APEX options?
Does the FFS kit overlap with the DCAEK? Do you have to have both, what does each do? Can you use them With the stock trigger face or do you also need the AEK?

Thanks!

C4IGrant
10-04-13, 14:39
Can you please explain the APEX options?
Does the FFS kit overlap with the DCAEK? Do you have to have both, what does each do? Can you use them With the stock trigger face or do you also need the AEK?

Thanks!

I would go to the Apex website and familiarize yourself with their products: https://apextactical.com/store/product-list.php?pg1-cid11.html

You can also watch their YT videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/apextactical



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Alex V
10-04-13, 15:20
When I got my M&P9 a few weeks ago the difference in trigger press and reset was incredible from my father's M&P9 from 2010 or 2009.

Grant, wish you had more of those 15rd 9mm mags... :( THey are perfect for us in NJ


Can you please explain the APEX options?
Does the FFS kit overlap with the DCAEK? Do you have to have both, what does each do? Can you use them With the stock trigger face or do you also need the AEK?

Thanks!

I had a thread asking about the differences a while back. Good info in there.

I went with the FSS kit and love it! Worth every penny!

C4IGrant
10-04-13, 16:07
I had a thread asking about the differences a while back. Good info in there.

I went with the FSS kit and love it! Worth every penny!



https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=138842



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txf15crewchief
10-04-13, 17:08
Thank you for all the updates and information Grant... you should've received some of my money earlier today for one of these.

packinaglock
10-04-13, 17:49
This is good to hear. I currently have a 9mm compact on back order (LE), and I am hoping it comes with the upgrades.

Grant, do you know if these upgraded parts, particularly the trigger bar and slide stop, are in the pipeline yet? I would really be interested in upgrading a few of my older M&Ps.
Same here, I have three I'd like to upgrade.

Nightstalker865
10-04-13, 18:22
Just placed my order with ya Grant.

Polished internals, I-dot sights, and the DCAEK for the mods.

Can't wait to feel it compared to my M&P40 with only the DCAEK installed.

vicious_cb
10-04-13, 19:09
I didn't really want to make a new thread so Ill just put this here.

One of the tabs on my M&P slide stop just broke off yesterday, ~15k rounds fired, the one on the serial number side of the gun so its still perfectly functional. I contacted Smith CS today and they want me to send it in for repairs with a turn around time of ~2 weeks, not to mention the trouble of removing my Apex DCEK parts then reinstalling them. I asked if they would just send me a replacement slide stop but I was told it was a restricted item which is funny since I see them on Grants website.

Now the question is if the newer generation slide stop with new flange will work on the older generation, ~2009 M&Ps.

C4IGrant
10-04-13, 21:07
I didn't really want to make a new thread so Ill just put this here.

One of the tabs on my M&P slide stop just broke off yesterday, ~15k rounds fired, the one on the serial number side of the gun so its still perfectly functional. I contacted Smith CS today and they want me to send it in for repairs with a turn around time of ~2 weeks, not to mention the trouble of removing my Apex DCEK parts then reinstalling them. I asked if they would just send me a replacement slide stop but I was told it was a restricted item which is funny since I see them on Grants website.

Now the question is if the newer generation slide stop with new flange will work on the older generation, ~2009 M&Ps.


Was it the left or right side that broke? Just so you know, the slide release is 3-5k PM part. So you needed to change it out a long time ago.

All catches are compatible so you are good.

Question, do you have the old SHB with the small sear plunger??


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vicious_cb
10-04-13, 22:53
Was it the left or right side that broke? Just so you know, the slide release is 3-5k PM part. So you needed to change it out a long time ago.

All catches are compatible so you are good.

Question, do you have the old SHB with the small sear plunger??


C4

Right side tab broke. I have the old style with the small hole.

Just wondering if the auto forwarding would cause accelerated wear but its weird since it happened to the opposite side that catches the slide.

C4IGrant
10-05-13, 09:41
Right side tab broke. I have the old style with the small hole.

Just wondering if the auto forwarding would cause accelerated wear but its weird since it happened to the opposite side that catches the slide.

I would just buy the new SHB and slide catch from us and install it yourself. Trust me when I say that you want away from the small hole SHB.

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Ranger45
10-05-13, 10:17
Thanks for the updates, Grant! I picked up my M&P9 from a LGS on August 26. The gun has an HAC**** serial number, and was test fired in May 2013. I was happy to see that it has all of the improvements you mentioned in your OP. I'm still learning the gun, but eventually would like to add night sights and a DCAEK (and of course, a few extra mags!)

Nightstalker865
10-05-13, 10:29
Grant, do you have any idea when you will be getting any of the new generation slide catches in?

C4IGrant
10-05-13, 11:57
Grant, do you have any idea when you will be getting any of the new generation slide catches in?

No idea.


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Pi3
10-05-13, 16:54
Thanks for the updates, Grant! I picked up my M&P9 from a LGS on August 26. The gun has an HAC**** serial number, and was test fired in May 2013. I was happy to see that it has all of the improvements you mentioned in your OP. I'm still learning the gun, but eventually would like to add night sights and a DCAEK (and of course, a few extra mags!)

Are you saying that the new trigger is still not good enough, that an upgrade to the DCAEK is needed? How is accuracy? Have you done any 25 yard 10 shot groups?

theblackknight
10-05-13, 17:05
For me these changes took way longer then I was willing to deal with, but I still hope they fix the whole line as I'm still shootings M&P's for work.

The Dumb Gun Collector
10-05-13, 18:52
Factoring in price, the M&P is, in my opinion, the best combat handgun available. If price is absolutely no object, maybe the HK is better. But given the superiority of the laser grips on the M&P, and the better selection of sights (ok, barely) it is hard to recommend anything over the M&P. weirdly, none of the shops around here push them.

I am glad to see they continually improve them.

PatrioticDisorder
10-05-13, 22:36
I would just buy the new SHB and slide catch from us and install it yourself. Trust me when I say that you want away from the small hole SHB.

C4

Grant, specifically what advantages do the new sear housing have over the old?

RWH24
10-05-13, 22:51
Grant, Any of the M&P 9mm LE guns coming soon?

A Kentucky Competitor has 2 models, with or with out Trijicon NS's.

Not that big of a rush so I can wait on you.
My Sigx2, Shield & Springfield XDm should hold 'em off for a little while.:dance3::D

opngrnd
10-05-13, 23:55
Grant, specifically what advantages do the new sear housing have over the old?

Please allow me to piggyback onto this. Were the small hole SBH's phased out at some point, or are they still standard in one type or the other, such as Thumb Safety or non-Thumb Safety models?

C4IGrant
10-06-13, 14:48
Are you saying that the new trigger is still not good enough, that an upgrade to the DCAEK is needed? How is accuracy? Have you done any 25 yard 10 shot groups?

Personally, I don't find ANY mass produced trigger to be "good enough" for me. I always add parts, polish or file on them in some way.

Do you NEED to do this to the M&P? Nope. Does it help to polish or add an Apex Striker block to it? Yes.




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C4IGrant
10-06-13, 14:49
Grant, specifically what advantages do the new sear housing have over the old?

If you have a SHB with the small sear plunger, your odds go up greatly that you will have a dead trigger at some point. This is a no go and needs to be fixed ASAP.



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C4IGrant
10-06-13, 14:50
Grant, Any of the M&P 9mm LE guns coming soon?

A Kentucky Competitor has 2 models, with or with out Trijicon NS's.

Not that big of a rush so I can wait on you.
My Sigx2, Shield & Springfield XDm should hold 'em off for a little while.:dance3::D

LE guns are in stock.

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C4IGrant
10-06-13, 14:51
Please allow me to piggyback onto this. Were the small hole SBH's phased out at some point, or are they still standard in one type or the other, such as Thumb Safety or non-Thumb Safety models?

Yes. About 1.5-2 years ago they were switched out for ones with the larger sear plunger.


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Jaysop
10-06-13, 19:32
Yes. About 1.5-2 years ago they were switched out for ones with the larger sear plunger.


C4

Forgive my ignorance, what is the best way to tell if you have the old or the new without have examples if of side by side? Specifically a thumb safety version?


Also has anyone contacted S&W about possibly having new parts installed in older models? I have a 2/12 test fire date 9mm that never shot all to great.
It has the second version of the barrels installed from the factory.

C4IGrant
10-06-13, 20:37
Forgive my ignorance, what is the best way to tell if you have the old or the new without have examples if of side by side? Specifically a thumb safety version?


Also has anyone contacted S&W about possibly having new parts installed in older models? I have a 2/12 test fire date 9mm that never shot all to great.
It has the second version of the barrels installed from the factory.

Pull it out and look at it.

I don't think they will install newer parts in your gun UNLESS there is a real issue (broken part, etc).


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TyGuy
10-06-13, 21:18
Once they get these issues nailed down, and improve that awful trigger, they'll have a true Glock killer, and I'm a glock shooter.

Jaysop
10-06-13, 21:51
Pull it out and look at it.

I don't think they will install newer parts in your gun UNLESS there is a real issue (broken part, etc).


C4

I was thinking more like purchase the new parts if they turn out to be worth it in terms of accuracy.

What I meant by questioning how I would know was what were the distinguishing features. I guess ill google some pics of the two in the AM.

PatrioticDisorder
10-07-13, 08:09
Once they get these issues nailed down, and improve that awful trigger, they'll have a true Glock killer, and I'm a glock shooter.

You may want to the thread, M&Ps have been fixed for several months now.

C4IGrant
10-07-13, 08:48
Once they get these issues nailed down, and improve that awful trigger, they'll have a true Glock killer, and I'm a glock shooter.

I am not sure what issues you are referring too. If you read my post, they HAVE improved the problems.

In many regards, the Glock trigger is the hardest trigger to shoot WELL (especially for new shooters).



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SiGfever
10-07-13, 08:57
I had an M&P 40c for a while that I sold to my son-in-law who also has a full size M&P 40. It was a very smooth shooting and accurate pistol, never a single issue with the pistol. I only sold it to fund a P2000SK. In hind sight I would have kept the 40c and saved up for the P2000SK. Oh well, my son-in-law loves it so it has a good home, it is his EDC.

USA
10-07-13, 11:41
In addition to adding bump to improve feeling of reset, S&W has also reinforced the slide lock so that it does not break as easily.

If you look at the top of the curved part on either, you will notice it is thicker than prior versions. Prior versions were smooth. Current versions have some kind of extra weld on top, that adds strength to the curved part.

Pi3
10-07-13, 11:56
Is any m&p made after 10-01-13 going to have the improvements?

C4IGrant
10-07-13, 12:42
Is any m&p made after 10-01-13 going to have the improvements?

I would assume so, but it is always best to check (or buy from a dealer that knows what to look for).


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Gary1911A1
10-07-13, 12:49
I am not sure what issues you are referring too. If you read my post, they HAVE improved the problems.

In many regards, the Glock trigger is the hardest trigger to shoot WELL (especially for new shooters).



C4

I have a habit of riding the Glock Trigger to reset. My M&P9 doesn't have any reset like a Glock. I use to think this was a problem, but after watching a recent episode of TacTV, I remember LAV and Ken Hackathorn discussing the Glock reset and how in a real shoutout it might lead a panicking shooter into more likely snatching a follow up shot off target. Still thinking this over, but I believe I'll leave that feature of my M&P alone.

C4IGrant
10-07-13, 12:50
I have a habit of riding the Glock Trigger to reset. My M&P9 doesn't have any reset like a Glock. I use to think this was a problem, but after watching a recent episode of TacTV, I remember LAV and Ken Hackathorn discussing the Glock reset and how in a real shoutout it might lead a panicking shooter into more likely snatching a follow up shot off target. Still thinking this over, but I believe I'll leave that feature of my M&P alone.

When I teach a pistol class, I dedicate an entire section on the difficulties of shooting a Glock well.

IMHO, the Glock is the most difficult gun to shoot (well) of all the polymers. Since you brought up Ken and LAV, they tend to agree with my opinion on this subject.



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ruchik
10-07-13, 16:09
Just as an FYI for those who are wondering how far back the updates apply, I just received an M&P 9 made 8/29 of this year. So my gun was made about 5 weeks ago. It has a trigger bar stamped with an "S", and the slide lock lever appears to be the older generation with no bumps in it. It does have the larger sear plunger and spring.

Nightstalker865
10-07-13, 16:13
I sure hope all the ones Grant received have the updated parts! Sounds like S&W are still sending out mixed batches. I looked at one in Gander today and it didn't have the updated parts. It was an early Sept date too.

C4IGrant
10-07-13, 16:14
I sure hope all the ones Grant received have the updated parts! Sounds like S&W are still sending out mixed batches. I looked at one in Gander today and it didn't have the updated parts. It was an early Sept date too.

Yes they do.


C4

Nick S
10-07-13, 16:23
Grant

Do you have the newest gen triggers and slide releases in stock for sale?

Thanks

Nick

packinaglock
10-07-13, 16:58
Factoring in price, the M&P is, in my opinion, the best combat handgun available. If price is absolutely no object, maybe the HK is better. But given the superiority of the laser grips on the M&P, and the better selection of sights (ok, barely) it is hard to recommend anything over the M&P. weirdly, none of the shops around here push them.

I am glad to see they continually improve them.

I have a CT laser for my gen4 glocks and one for my M&P and I have to agree, I like the set up for the M&P better.

PatrioticDisorder
10-07-13, 17:41
Just as an FYI for those who are wondering how far back the updates apply, I just received an M&P 9 made 8/29 of this year. So my gun was made about 5 weeks ago. It has a trigger bar stamped with an "S", and the slide lock lever appears to be the older generation with no bumps in it. It does have the larger sear plunger and spring.

That's really baffling because an LGS had a big M&P sale in August and ever M&P I fondled had the updated parts & early July manufacturing dates now I'm hearing an early September & August manufactured gun don't have the updated parts.... I'm thinking Smith maybe got one last batch of old parts and decided to throw those in the gun, which is pretty weak on their part if they actually did that knowing how unpopular the trigger on the older models was...

C4IGrant
10-07-13, 18:27
Grant

Do you have the newest gen triggers and slide releases in stock for sale?

Thanks

Nick

Trigger, yes.


C4

ruchik
10-07-13, 19:52
That's really baffling because an LGS had a big M&P sale in August and ever M&P I fondled had the updated parts & early July manufacturing dates now I'm hearing an early September & August manufactured gun don't have the updated parts.... I'm thinking Smith maybe got one last batch of old parts and decided to throw those in the gun, which is pretty weak on their part if they actually did that knowing how unpopular the trigger on the older models was...

That's what I'm guessing too. The trigger feel was exactly the same as my M&P made in 2009. Doesn't matter to me as I planned on dropping in Apex kits anyhow. I also forgot to mention that my latest one test fired on 8/29/13 has the updated striker assembly.

Pi3
10-10-13, 12:09
Personally, I don't find ANY mass produced trigger to be "good enough" for me. I always add parts, polish or file on them in some way.

Do you NEED to do this to the M&P? Nope. Does it help to polish or add an Apex Striker block to it? Yes.




C4

Off topic, but what did you do to improve your G19 trigger?

C4IGrant
10-10-13, 12:38
Off topic, but what did you do to improve your G19 trigger?

Check out the tacked threads (4 part series) here: https://www.m4carbine.net/forumdisplay.php?f=28


C4

vicious_cb
10-10-13, 19:34
Update on my broken slide stop. Smith send me a new slide stop but after close inspection I believe it is the old style slide stop without the raised bump on the right hand tab.

Nightstalker865
10-17-13, 10:18
Received mine from Grant on Mon. Took it to the range yesterday and put 300 flawless rounds through it. Very impressed with the trigger work. It has a cleaner feel than my other M&P's with drop in Apex kits.

M&P9 FS test fire date 9-20-13

Mods done by Grant:

Ameriglo Pro I-Dot sights
Apex DCAEK kit
Polished internals

C4IGrant
10-17-13, 11:32
Received mine from Grant on Mon. Took it to the range yesterday and put 300 flawless rounds through it. Very impressed with the trigger work. It has a cleaner feel than my other M&P's with drop in Apex kits.

M&P9 FS test fire date 9-20-13

Mods done by Grant:

Ameriglo Pro I-Dot sights
Apex DCAEK kit
Polished internals

Cool! Glad you like it.


C4

Pi3
10-17-13, 11:56
Received mine from Grant on Mon. Took it to the range yesterday and put 300 flawless rounds through it. Very impressed with the trigger work. It has a cleaner feel than my other M&P's with drop in Apex kits.

M&P9 FS test fire date 9-20-13

Mods done by Grant:

Ameriglo Pro I-Dot sights
Apex DCAEK kit
Polished internals

1. How distinct is the reset? How is over travel?
2. How is accuracy? Did you shoot any 25 yard groups?
3. How is the auto forwarding?

Clint
10-17-13, 12:39
Hi Grant,

I received the 9c yesterday, thanks for the great service.

The fit between the front of the hood and the slide was .004" as measured with a feeler gauge.


It seems to me that the updated components obsolete much of what's outlined in the only M&P trigger job guide I could find.
http://www.burwellguns.com/misc/M&Ptriggerjob.pdf

Is there a guide available that covers polishing and cleanup of the updated components, similar the that for the Glock?

I already cleaned up the ramped portion of the trigger bar that moves the striker block. That greatly smoothed up the initial take up portion of the pull and makes for a pretty good trigger.

What else do you recommend?

C4IGrant
10-17-13, 16:11
Hi Grant,

I received the 9c yesterday, thanks for the great service.

The fit between the front of the hood and the slide was .004" as measured with a feeler gauge.


It seems to me that the updated components obsolete much of what's outlined in the only M&P trigger job guide I could find.
http://www.burwellguns.com/misc/M&Ptriggerjob.pdf

Is there a guide available that covers polishing and cleanup of the updated components, similar the that for the Glock?

I already cleaned up the ramped portion of the trigger bar that moves the striker block. That greatly smoothed up the initial take up portion of the pull and makes for a pretty good trigger.

What else do you recommend?


I have been thinking of doing a polish tutorial (like I did with the Glock), but haven't had the time.

The SB is really the number one thing that needs rounded and polished. We also polish the trigger bar interface with the Sear, the Sear itself (front and back) and the side of the trigger bar that rubs against the slide release and the frame.



C4

M&P45
10-17-13, 20:04
Yep, sure do. Lots of options too (sights, Apex components, polishing work and fitted barrels)!


C4

I have been on the waiting list for a fitted barrel for months. Has any progress been made in getting these in?

C4IGrant
10-17-13, 22:04
I have been on the waiting list for a fitted barrel for months. Has any progress been made in getting these in?

Yep, we are working our way through the list.


C4

Nightstalker865
10-17-13, 22:29
1. How distinct is the reset? How is over travel?
2. How is accuracy? Did you shoot any 25 yard groups?
3. How is the auto forwarding?

Reset is audible and tactile. It is greater than my M&P pro with the Apex RAM installed. I did not notice much over travel at all. The take up is even less than my other M&P's. I'm extremely impressed with the trigger.

I didn't get a chance to shoot for any groupings, as we were running steel all day. I had no issues running the plate rack at 25 yards though. We ran several drills on the move and from different positions and the gun is a great shooter. I can't say enough about how impressed I am with the trigger. I sold my Gen 4 G17 to buy this gun and I'm very pleased with the change.

I had no issues with auto forwarding. This was quite a surprise to me. With the exception of my shield, every M&P I've ran drills with will auto forward on the reload. This one didn't do it once on me. I had a total of 12 mags that were used throughout the day and it didn't hiccup or auto forward with any of them.

I have been a glock guy for many years. These new M&P's on the market have changed my outlook. I have sold 3 glocks this year and all have been replaced with M&P's.

tr1kstanc3
10-18-13, 17:18
Has S&W changed the sears in their firearms since they began producing the M&P's? My question is I have a M&P Pro 9mm sear from ~2009 that has since been replaced by an APEX kit, but I would like to use the Pro sear in my 9mm Shield if possible. Just checking here first for advice.

m4brian
10-18-13, 17:44
I waited to post this, as I wanted to see what the LOOSEST barrel in my M&Ps would do. This M&P 9 was purchased last year, and I replaced the sear and spring with APEX. The trigger is now fairly nice, with a fairly clean break. The barrel to slide fit is the loosest on any gun I own including another MP9 and my G19. Here is a recent target:

http://images.yuku.com/image/jpeg/187353b7dae3f7560abf9ce46ae6e8cfc7580f8.JPG

This is 15 rds, 20 yards off-hand slow fire with Tulabrass 115 gr - bottom rung ammo. While not stellar, it is as decent as my CZ Compact at the same range session. The CZ barrel slide fit is excellent. I am satisfied that my MP9s are sufficiently accurate with crap ammo. Actually, I am pleasantly surprised at the result. I need much more shooting with this gun, and I believe it will get a tad better in time.

My MP 45 Midsize wanted to make ONE hole with a buddy's SWC at 7 yds. reloads.

C4IGrant
10-18-13, 19:17
Has S&W changed the sears in their firearms since they began producing the M&P's? My question is I have a M&P Pro 9mm sear from ~2009 that has since been replaced by an APEX kit, but I would like to use the Pro sear in my 9mm Shield if possible. Just checking here first for advice.

Yes, but the Apex Sear is still better.


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cfrock
10-20-13, 09:36
I have been thinking of doing a polish tutorial (like I did with the Glock), but haven't had the time.

The SB is really the number one thing that needs rounded and polished. We also polish the trigger bar interface with the Sear, the Sear itself (front and back) and the side of the trigger bar that rubs against the slide release and the frame.



C4

Grant

Would love to see an M&P polishing tutorial. You have got to get around to that.

Do you happen to have the spring and cap for underneath the rear sight available for purchase? I lost mine in the garage when it got launched. Smith has told me they would send me a new set for free but I'm still waiting 2 months later.

I'm dying to take out my 9L with apex trigger to the range.

Campion
11-05-13, 10:06
I just received my mp9 after 6 months of waiting, it has a born on date of 9/13 and has all the new parts. I'm want to put the DCAEK in it with their polymer trigger.

My understanding is smith was able to get the tactile reset by putting a bump on the slide stop and the trigger bar rubbing against it gives you the felt reset. With the apex parts moving reset further back then the factory, is or has anyone, experienced issues with the apex sear and new slide stops? Or does the apex sear give you enough reset so the trigger bar hits the slide stop and you still have that felt reset.

Also, I was reading on Hilton Yam's site MSW his upcoming run of m&p are going to feature a new apex sear. Anyone heard about this sear?

Thanks

C4IGrant
11-05-13, 10:19
I just received my mp9 after 6 months of waiting, it has a born on date of 9/13 and has all the new parts. I'm want to put the DCAEK in it with their polymer trigger.

My understanding is smith was able to get the tactile reset by putting a bump on the slide stop and the trigger bar rubbing against it gives you the felt reset. With the apex parts moving reset further back then the factory, is or has anyone, experienced issues with the apex sear and new slide stops? Or does the apex sear give you enough reset so the trigger bar hits the slide stop and you still have that felt reset.

Also, I was reading on Hilton Yam's site MSW his upcoming run of m&p are going to feature a new apex sear. Anyone heard about this sear?

Thanks

Not really sure what you are asking. All Apex DCAEK's are compatible with the new M&P's.


C4

Campion
11-05-13, 11:20
Not really sure what you are asking. All Apex DCAEK's are compatible with the new M&P's.


C4

I guess what I'm asking is if the Apex sear gives enough reset where the trigger bar engages the slide stop and gives you the tactile reset, or because of the reduced reset with these sears do you lose a little of the positive reset feel?

C4IGrant
11-05-13, 11:22
I guess what I'm asking is if the Apex sear gives enough reset where the trigger bar engages the slide stop and gives you the tactile reset, or because of the reduced reset with these sears do you lose a little of the positive reset feel?

The sear has nothing to do with felt reset.


The felt reset comes from the new slide release kicking the trigger bar over.


C4

Campion
11-05-13, 12:11
The sear has nothing to do with felt reset.


The felt reset comes from the new slide release kicking the trigger bar over.


C4

I understand that, I guess I'm having a hard time asking this question, sorry for the confusion. I'm concerned/wondering with the slightly different geometry on the Apex sear, will the sear reset before the trigger has let out enough that the slide release hits the trigger, kicking it over.

My understanding is that the Apex sear gives you a shorter reset then the factory sear. Im concerned that I would put in this sear and get two resets if you will. As I released the trigger, the sear would reset, then I'd have to release the trigger out further to have the slide stop engage the trigger bar. So i'm kinda asking how well mate or time up with the new S&W parts.

Thanks

USA
11-05-13, 12:25
Based on my understanding, you will not have two resets.

On Apex sear, by changing point of reset, all it is doing is changing or moving point when trigger bar re-engages sear by changing shape of lobe.

S&W put notch in slide lock that applies pressure on trigger bar, thereby making the re-engagement of trigger bar to sear more positive or distinct (more umph).

So, based on above, just because Apex changed lobe to change point of reset does not change fact that slide lock still applying pressure on trigger bar to make reset more distinct when trigger bar does finally re-enage sear.

The trigger bar can still only re-engage sear when it clears lobe, wherever that may be depending on whose sear you are using.

Hope this helps and makes sense.

C4IGrant
11-05-13, 12:26
I understand that, I guess I'm having a hard time asking this question, sorry for the confusion. I'm concerned/wondering with the slightly different geometry on the Apex sear, will the sear reset before the trigger has let out enough that the slide release hits the trigger, kicking it over.

My understanding is that the Apex sear gives you a shorter reset then the factory sear. Im concerned that I would put in this sear and get two resets if you will. As I released the trigger, the sear would reset, then I'd have to release the trigger out further to have the slide stop engage the trigger bar. So i'm kinda asking how well mate or time up with the new S&W parts.

Thanks

We build these packages everyday. Nothing to worry about. Install the parts you want.


C4

30 cal slut
11-05-13, 12:40
Grant,

do you know if the same improvements have been made to the Shield line?

C4IGrant
11-05-13, 12:42
Grant,

do you know if the same improvements have been made to the Shield line?

The shield actually had most of these improvements BEFORE the full size guns.


C4

30 cal slut
11-05-13, 12:44
thanks good to know.

not to side-track - but other than the extraction issues on winchester brass .. if you were to trick up a stock 9mm shield for EDC, what would you do with your personal gun?

(you can see where i'm going with this, gonna place an order with you in the not too distant future). ;)

Campion
11-05-13, 12:53
Based on my understanding, you will not have two resets.

On Apex sear, by changing point of reset, all it is doing is changing or moving point when trigger bar re-engages sear by changing shape of lobe.

S&W put notch in slide lock that applies pressure on trigger bar, thereby making the re-engagement of trigger bar to sear more positive or distinct (more umph).

So, based on above, just because Apex changed lobe to change point of reset does not change fact that slide lock still applying pressure on trigger bar to make reset more distinct when trigger bar does finally re-enage sear.

The trigger bar can still only re-engage sear when it clears lobe, wherever that may be depending on whose sear you are using.

Hope this helps and makes sense.

Makes perfect sense now thanks for clearing that up for me.

C4IGrant
11-05-13, 13:06
thanks good to know.

not to side-track - but other than the extraction issues on winchester brass .. if you were to trick up a stock 9mm shield for EDC, what would you do with your personal gun?

(you can see where i'm going with this, gonna place an order with you in the not too distant future). ;)

I built one for my wife. We did a polish job, DCAEK and Ameriglo Shield Sights. Trigger is 4.5LBS and is smooth.


C4

RWH24
11-05-13, 16:30
Okay, for the record..

M&P 9 PRO 5", 1-11-12
M&P 9 PRO 4.25", 4-1-11
Shield 9mm, 9-11-12

The oldest M&P, PRO 4.25" has an "H" trigger bar like the other 2 and like Grant posted the picture of.
None of the 3 have an audible reset click.
Both PRO's were acquired gently used and was told just shot, no tinkering to them.
The PRO 5" has the smoothest trigger of the 3.
Can't give an accuracy review yet, but soon I hope.

slappy
11-08-13, 10:06
An update on my personal experiences with the M&P

I picked up a new 9 FS last week, put about 300 rounds through it yesterday. This is my third FS 9 and seems to be the most accurate. I wasn't convinced my other two had any issues aside from myself, but this one has me thinking. I shot my oldest after the new one and had noticeably larger grouping. I really wanted to believe that my shooting had just improved but my M&P 45 and this new 9 have me thinking otherwise. Happy to say this one is a keeper so far.

Pi3
11-08-13, 10:23
What size groups at what distance?

slappy
11-08-13, 10:30
What size groups at what distance?

Old was producing 5" plus groups at 25 yards. New is reigning in 2-2.5" groups at 25 yards. I've always been able to group that we'll with my M&P 45. I'll take some photos next range trip for comparison.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Pi3
11-08-13, 10:47
Thanks. I have been waiting on this report. I think it is safe to get a new 9fs now. It looks like SW is finally coming around.

RWH24
11-08-13, 11:10
An update on my personal experiences with the M&P

I picked up a new 9 FS last week, put about 300 rounds through it yesterday. This is my third FS 9 and seems to be the most accurate. I wasn't convinced my other two had any issues aside from myself, but this one has me thinking. I shot my oldest after the new one and had noticeably larger grouping. I really wanted to believe that my shooting had just improved but my M&P 45 and this new 9 have me thinking otherwise. Happy to say this one is a keeper so far.
Your new FS 9, Is it off the shelf or has it had any APEX or polishing done to it?

Desert Dog
11-08-13, 11:46
Have they resolved the magazine follower issue that cropped up with the latest batch of magazines that shipped?

slappy
11-08-13, 11:50
Your new FS 9, Is it off the shelf or has it had any APEX or polishing done to it?

Off the shelf with a tiny bit of polishing on my part. It's an example of one, but it's certainly doing better than I ever expected.

RWH24
11-17-13, 20:10
Off the shelf with a tiny bit of polishing on my part. It's an example of one, but it's certainly doing better than I ever expected.
Thank You

m4brian
11-18-13, 11:40
An update on my personal experiences with the M&P

I picked up a new 9 FS last week, put about 300 rounds through it yesterday. This is my third FS 9 and seems to be the most accurate. I wasn't convinced my other two had any issues aside from myself, but this one has me thinking. I shot my oldest after the new one and had noticeably larger grouping. I really wanted to believe that my shooting had just improved but my M&P 45 and this new 9 have me thinking otherwise. Happy to say this one is a keeper so far.


Is there a notable difference in barrel/slide play between the two?

slappy
11-19-13, 18:54
It is a slight difference but the new one seems tighter upon lockup.

curlysir
01-04-14, 20:18
I purchased a M&P40 Pro today with a date of 10-30-13 and it does NOT have the slide catch release with the bump. Does have the H trigger bar.

Dacam
01-10-14, 02:58
I recently purchased a new version M&P 9mm with the upgraded parts(H) trigger bar and hump. I also have a Apex FSS and Ram kit coming in.
Im finding out that the Ram kit will not work with the newer version guns. With the FSS, what parts should I install and what parts in the kit
should I leave out because I will see no benefit? I will also do a polish job but kinda confused on what internal parts are not needed.
Thanks for the help.

USA
01-10-14, 10:44
I recently purchased a new version M&P 9mm with the upgraded parts(H) trigger bar and hump. I also have a Apex FSS and Ram kit coming in.
Im finding out that the Ram kit will not work with the newer version guns. With the FSS, what parts should I install and what parts in the kit
should I leave out because I will see no benefit? I will also do a polish job but kinda confused on what internal parts are not needed.
Thanks for the help.

Dude, it's up to you. Define benefit? The FSS replaces the trigger, sear and USB. The trigger and sear affect pre travel and over travel. The FSS trigger also just feels different because stock trigger hinged. The USB takes out grittiness in take up although stock USB will become less gritty over time or with polish. The trigger spring affects pull weight. What are you hoping to achieve with FSS? Since it sounds like you are unfamiliar with gun and trigger, you should probably leave it stock until you learn it or just change everything out. The USB was not updated by S&W. The trigger and sear are personal preference. The FSS is described to change stock trigger to single action 1911. None of the updates by S&W were meant to achieve that same goal so your question hinges on what you were hoping to achieve when you bought FSS.

Dacam
01-10-14, 14:09
Dude, it's up to you. Define benefit? The FSS replaces the trigger, sear and USB. The trigger and sear affect pre travel and over travel. The FSS trigger also just feels different because stock trigger hinged. The USB takes out grittiness in take up although stock USB will become less gritty over time or with polish. The trigger spring affects pull weight. What are you hoping to achieve with FSS? Since it sounds like you are unfamiliar with gun and trigger, you should probably leave it stock until you learn it or just change everything out. The USB was not updated by S&W. The trigger and sear are personal preference. The FSS is described to change stock trigger to single action 1911. None of the updates by S&W were meant to achieve that same goal so your question hinges on what you were hoping to achieve when you bought FSS.

Thanks for the enlightened post.

.45fmjoe
01-20-14, 21:03
Grant, have you noticed any parts changes in the Shield? I bought one of the first made and while the trigger and reset are very good, the one my dad just bought last week has the same trigger but a perfect tactile reset. New slide stop, perhaps?

C4IGrant
01-21-14, 08:38
Grant, have you noticed any parts changes in the Shield? I bought one of the first made and while the trigger and reset are very good, the one my dad just bought last week has the same trigger but a perfect tactile reset. New slide stop, perhaps?

I am sure there have been, but none that I can tell. They pretty much nailed it on day one utilizing the lessons learned on its full size brother.



C4

brickboy240
01-21-14, 11:04
The Shiled I borrowed actually had a very decent trigger. Nope...it was not a match trigger but one I could totally live with. 10 times better than the full size 9 and 45 M&Ps I had shot.

Since Glock is not going to bring out a single stack really thin 9mm...I might end up with one of these. I was actually pleasantly surprised.

Nice size, too....I can totally hide this no matter what I wear.

-brickboy2420

Wake27
01-27-14, 06:38
So the accuracy and trigger problems have pretty much been taken care of? The military pricing on these is just too good to pass up.

Kenneth
01-27-14, 06:41
From talking with Grant he said the LE guns have a positive reset and the barrels have been re done for accuracy. The pricing is pretty good. I just got a M&P9 FS with trijicon HD's for under $600 shipped.

Wake27
01-27-14, 08:21
Just the LE guns? Or those are the only ones you talked about?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

C4IGrant
01-27-14, 08:39
So the accuracy and trigger problems have pretty much been taken care of? The military pricing on these is just too good to pass up.

IHMO, yes.

C4

RWH24
01-27-14, 20:06
From talking with Grant he said the LE guns have a positive reset and the barrels have been re done for accuracy. The pricing is pretty good. I just got a M&P9 FS with trijicon HD's for under $600 shipped.
Mine was 605 shipped from Grant with HD's and his internal polishing. Despite MJ, You can't "Beat It!"
Contemplating an M&P9C now even though I have a Shield 9.
My LEO FS is getting smoother and has a more tactile reset than my 2 year old M&P PRO 5" 9mm.

C4IGrant
01-29-14, 13:05
The new style S&W M&P Slide Catches are now in stock!

http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=42427


C4


http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/SW/42427_REVA.jpg

LibertyNeverDies
01-29-14, 15:30
Not to derail the thread, but has SW said anything about the release of a Shield without a TS?

Christopher
01-29-14, 16:15
The new style S&W M&P Slide Catches are now in stock!



C4IGrant,


If i order a M&P 9 from you will this be on the M&P 9's you have in stock? Or will this be $15 more & you could install it? Thanks in advance.

C4IGrant
01-29-14, 16:15
Not to derail the thread, but has SW said anything about the release of a Shield without a TS?

No, but I do know that it will be an LE only thing I believe.


C4

C4IGrant
01-29-14, 16:16
C4IGrant,


If i order a M&P 9 from you will this be on the M&P 9's you have in stock? Or will this be $15 more & you could install it? Thanks in advance.

Comes standard on the M&P's we stock.


C4

Kenneth
01-29-14, 16:22
Comes standard on the M&P's we stock.


C4


NEVERMIND. Found my answer.

Christopher
01-29-14, 16:44
Comes standard on the M&P's we stock.


C4

Awesome, thanks.

OldState
01-29-14, 17:36
The new style S&W M&P Slide Catches are now in stock!

http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=42427


C4


http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/SW/42427_REVA.jpg

Do these fit the 45's?

Outlander Systems
01-29-14, 18:23
Grant, when are you getting guide rod assemblies for the .45 back in stock? I'd like to order one...or three.

steve462x0
02-12-14, 21:49
after reading all of this I will have to check my pro series core 9 and 40c I bought last friday for the new parts

C4IGrant
03-12-14, 16:33
We have the newest barrels in. If someone has a 9mm FS that doesn't shoot, you can send your slide to us and we will match a barrel (as best we can).



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Nick S
03-12-14, 16:34
any 5" OEM barrels?

C4IGrant
03-12-14, 16:34
any 5" OEM barrels?

None.


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rushca01
03-13-14, 09:45
M&P warranty work. How does their process work? I have two identical VTAC M&P 9's that don't shoot worth a crap, do I just request that Smith and Wesson look at them and they send me a shipping label?

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 09:49
M&P warranty work. How does their process work? I have two identical VTAC M&P 9's that don't shoot worth a crap, do I just request that Smith and Wesson look at them and they send me a shipping label?

S&W tests barrels at like 12-15yds I think with 3 shot groups (don't ask me why they do this). So getting them to change out a barrel is probably not likely, but you can always try and call them.

If I might make a suggestion, you are MUCH better off sending your slide to me and I will do my best to match a FACTORY barrel to your slide.




C4

orionz06
03-13-14, 09:51
M&P warranty work. How does their process work? I have two identical VTAC M&P 9's that don't shoot worth a crap, do I just request that Smith and Wesson look at them and they send me a shipping label?

You pester them on multiple forums and social media accounts until they send you a brand new gun that still doesn't shoot accurately.

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 09:58
You pester them on multiple forums and social media accounts until they send you a brand new gun that still doesn't shoot accurately.

We have been selling the new guns (with the new barrels) and have seen MUCH better results. Joe R., Hack, Pannone to name a few have these pistols and have all reported that they shoot well.

I am not saying that there aren't lemons out there, but the chances of getting one are a lot less likely IMHO.





C4

Pork Chop
03-13-14, 10:06
Grant, what's the cost and turnaround time to have you match a slide & barrel?

Thanks.

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 10:08
Grant, what's the cost and turnaround time to have you match a slide & barrel?

Thanks.

Barrels are $99 + shipping and would say that turn around would be 1 week.


C4

Pork Chop
03-13-14, 10:16
If you don't mind, pm me the instructions of where to send and how you'd like me to make payment. I'll get it sent out.

Thanks.

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 10:17
If you don't mind, pm me the instructions of where to send and how you'd like me to make payment. I'll get it sent out.

Thanks.

Please send us an e-mail.


C4

orionz06
03-13-14, 10:18
We have been selling the new guns (with the new barrels) and have seen MUCH better results. Joe R., Hack, Pannone to name a few have these pistols and have all reported that they shoot well.

I am not saying that there aren't lemons out there, but the chances of getting one are a lot less likely IMHO.





C4

Even after 20k rounds? I know they were dropping off too.

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 10:21
Even after 20k rounds? I know they were dropping off too.

20,000rds fired? Dont' know, but I would expect any gun that only costs the manufacturer $100 dollars to build to lose some of its accuracy.



C4

Pork Chop
03-13-14, 10:22
Please send us an e-mail.


C4

Email inbound.

orionz06
03-13-14, 10:28
20,000rds fired? Dont' know, but I would expect any gun that only costs the manufacturer $100 dollars to build to lose some of its accuracy.



C4

Some, not what has been seen, 2-3" to 6-7" over time.

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 10:33
Some, not what has been seen, 2-3" to 6-7" over time.

Honestly really hard to say. I have never witnessed this first hand, but do find it hard to believe that a 2-3" gun turned into a 6-7" gun. If it actually did happen, I would look at things like the slide to frame fit (change out the locking block and SHB).

Is the above a sampling of one or have you seen this several times?




C4

orionz06
03-13-14, 10:44
2-3 of them had it happen between 5-20k.

Joe R.
03-13-14, 10:56
Just to verify Grants post about the "new" M&Ps, I did buy one from him in October because I had been following the updates and changes and wanted to see if the accuracy had improved. I was skeptical as I was one of the people who had been bitten by the less than stellar accuracy of the 9mil in the past.

I received the gun which had all the latest upgrades, dropped in an Apex sear and trigger as I wanted to see the true accuracy potential and off to the range I went. I'm happy to say I was easily able to shoot a 2 3/4" 10 shot group at 25 yards (10 rounds standing off hand). My past experience with the M&P was about 6" at best. Keep in mind this is a sample size of one, however it mirrors what I have been hearing from others in relation to the new guns.

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 11:47
2-3 of them had it happen between 5-20k.

I wonder if they were really ever 2-3" guns. Some 9mm is very long and gives the illusion that the gun is more accurate than it really is.

I am not saying what you witnessed is not accurate, but to date, I have not seen this.


C4

OldState
03-13-14, 15:46
Are you getting any new manufacture compact 9mm barrels?

I bought a 9c 18 months ago based people saying the compact didnt suffer from accuracy issues of the FS......but in my experience that is BS. Its a 7" gun at 50' off a sandbag with an Apex trigger kit.

I know I probably should care for this type of pistol but I'm an accuracy snob.

Are the new 9mm barrels as accurate as their .45's?

orionz06
03-13-14, 15:48
I wonder if they were really ever 2-3" guns. Some 9mm is very long and gives the illusion that the gun is more accurate than it really is.

I am not saying what you witnessed is not accurate, but to date, I have not seen this.


C4


What do you mean "very long"? I am talking 5-10 shot groups from a bench with good ammo (ASYM, Atlanta Arms match, Federal HST).

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 15:52
Are you getting any new manufacture compact 9mm barrels?

I bought a 9c 18 months ago based people saying the compact didnt suffer from accuracy issues of the FS......but in my experience that is BS. Its a 7" gun at 50' off a sandbag with an Apex trigger kit.

I know I probably should care for this type of pistol but I'm an accuracy snob.

Are the new 9mm barrels as accurate as their .45's?

Wasn't planning on it. I would contact S&W about it and see where that goes (as they might replace the barrel).

The newer 9mm's are definitely getting there. Do they still need to improve some things? Yes. I hope to push them to make some of these changes in the future.


C4

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 15:53
Case length is all over the place with 9mm.


C4

silvery37
03-13-14, 16:20
Even after 20k rounds? I know they were dropping off too.

Even if they did why would it matter if you put it in perspective. You would have put over $5000 in ammo through a 500 dollar gun. How long would you expect the gun to last. They dont have an infinite life. Look at rifle barrels, they have to be replaced. 20k would be a lot of ammo even for a. 223.

Magsz
03-13-14, 17:03
Even if they did why would it matter if you put it in perspective. You would have put over $5000 in ammo through a 500 dollar gun. How long would you expect the gun to last. They dont have an infinite life. Look at rifle barrels, they have to be replaced. 20k would be a lot of ammo even for a. 223.

Im currently shooting 40k rounds of 9mm a year. If i had to replace my pistols or re-barrel every year i would consider it an inconvenience...

C4IGrant
03-13-14, 17:16
Im currently shooting 40k rounds of 9mm a year. If i had to replace my pistols or re-barrel every year i would consider it an inconvenience...

That is a lot of rounds!

I am going to fire off a couple e-mails and see if any manufacturers to tell me what the expected life is of their guns (or what they think it should be).



C4

Magsz
03-13-14, 17:36
That is a lot of rounds!

I am going to fire off a couple e-mails and see if any manufacturers to tell me what the expected life is of their guns (or what they think it should be).

C4

Par for the course with most USPSA nutjobs. :P

Ive had Glocks go over 100k with no PRACTICAL loss of accuracy. They DID open up as one of my old G17's had an inch of rifling gone after the chamber area but the pistol still grouped acceptably.

Im very interested in what you find Grant as im super curious as what a manufacturer believes the lifespan of their barrels should be. The number is going to be hard to nail down considering rate of fire has more to do with barrel degradation than overall round count.

The Dumb Gun Collector
03-13-14, 17:56
I have a few month old 9mm VTAC that is much, much more accurate than the one I picked up last year ( last years waspizza box accurate at 25 yards). I was one of the people who scoffed at the idea that the 9mm M&P could be that inaccurate (because I had never had ANY inaccurate 9mm pistol) but it was a stinker. The new one is excellent, just as accurate as my Glock 19.

I would still say that my mid-sized .45 M&P is still a little more accurate.

Glock30
03-14-14, 07:11
I would still say that my mid-sized .45 M&P is still a little more accurate.

I agree! The mid size M&P45 is a dream. I'd love to add another S&W mid size 45, but in FDE :cool:

C4IGrant
03-14-14, 07:16
Par for the course with most USPSA nutjobs. :P

Ive had Glocks go over 100k with no PRACTICAL loss of accuracy. They DID open up as one of my old G17's had an inch of rifling gone after the chamber area but the pistol still grouped acceptably.

Im very interested in what you find Grant as im super curious as what a manufacturer believes the lifespan of their barrels should be. The number is going to be hard to nail down considering rate of fire has more to do with barrel degradation than overall round count.

Ya, I have waaaay to many other interests (besides guns) to shoot that many rounds in a year (on top of Kids and a wife)!

That is a lot of rounds in the Glock. What was your PM cylces like? What GEN Glock did you use?



C4

Watrdawg
03-14-14, 07:44
I agree! The mid size M&P45 is a dream. I'd love to add another S&W mid size 45, but in FDE :cool:

Same here. My Mid-Size M&P 45 is the most accurate handgun I have. If I could find one in FDE I scoop it up in a heart beat.

C4IGrant
03-14-14, 10:37
Im very interested in what you find Grant as im super curious as what a manufacturer believes the lifespan of their barrels should be. The number is going to be hard to nail down considering rate of fire has more to do with barrel degradation than overall round count.

Ok, I got one answer back (from S&W). The answer is, they don't have a number. Too many variables like type of ammo, how the gun was shot, etc.


C4

PD Sgt.
03-14-14, 11:47
I just picked up my new (LE) 9mm compact. The new trigger is definitely an improvement, with a more noticeable reset. Still not as strong as my G19s, but much better. I did end up replacing the striker block with an APEX, and I installed a Performance Center sear, resulting in a pull weight somewhere between factory and one of my duty APEX kits. I am going to try it this way for a bit before deciding how I like it, but so far the new parts do seem to help. There does not seem to be any issues with accuracy, but I have only gotten to put about 100 rounds through it so far.

One of the (little) things I really liked that is new is the plastic striker block spring cover with a protrusion to keep it on the spring. Balancing that metal disk while trying to get the sight on could be a PITA.

I also have a 45 compact that is one of my favorites and displays excellent accuracy. I may try to throw some of the newer parts in there and see how it does.

Magsz
03-14-14, 13:39
Ya, I have waaaay to many other interests (besides guns) to shoot that many rounds in a year (on top of Kids and a wife)!

That is a lot of rounds in the Glock. What was your PM cylces like? What GEN Glock did you use?



C4

I ran the first 25k rounds with the factory gen 4 dual stage rod. After that i ran 14 pound wolf springs which i changed every 15k rounds.
Trigger return spring at 65k (just because)
I run wolf 5lb striker springs and replaced them every 10k just because a pack of 10 is cheap.
A new Fiber optic Warren front sight at 75k rounds because i dinged the serrations (woops)
New firing pin block and firing pin block spring at 55k because the lightning strike TI coated block peened itself to death (terrible product, i now recommend the Apex unit).

Other than that...absolutely no other changes. IF i wasnt so lazy and i hadnt donated the gun to the NPO that i volunteer for i would have replaced the magazine catch and the magazine catch "spring". The mag release feels so soft it feels like you could breathe on it and eject magazines.

For the M&P's that we have in our stable, we've done pretty much the same thing minus the replacement of striker springs and the trigger return spring would be the sear spring.
One of our M&P's "required" a new locking block and sear housing block. The slide was so loose on the frame rails that we started to worry about it. The gun functioned fine but for peace of mind we changed the parts around. I am unsure of the round count but it was a HEAVILY used training gun from 2008.

Long story short, owning modern polymer guns is an AWESOME thing. They're seriously durable to the point of absurdity and it is nice knowing that you can spend a ton of money on ammo, run it through a "cheap" gun and get waaaayyyy more than your moneys worth out of it.

As a side note, i almost never clean my guns and in all of that time, i believe i only cleaned the gun four times. Plenty of lube was used but cleaning was just unnecessary.

C4IGrant
03-14-14, 16:13
Heard from Glock. Official party line is 40k.




C4

opngrnd
03-15-14, 10:50
Grant, how much different could the long term results be with an M&P that has a fitted barrel over a stock one? I've been following the developments as you discuss them, and I can see how an M&P with an acceptable barrel-to-slide fit could eventually loosen up and shoot poorly. But what if you started off with a barrel that was fitted to the specific slide it was installed in? I would think a fitted barrel would increase the acceptable lifespan and accuracy several times over since the fit of the barrel was optimal to begin with. Any thoughts?

Have you had a chance to see how the barrels you've fit have held up in the long run?

C4IGrant
03-15-14, 10:56
I ran the first 25k rounds with the factory gen 4 dual stage rod. After that i ran 14 pound wolf springs which i changed every 15k rounds.
Trigger return spring at 65k (just because)
I run wolf 5lb striker springs and replaced them every 10k just because a pack of 10 is cheap.
A new Fiber optic Warren front sight at 75k rounds because i dinged the serrations (woops)
New firing pin block and firing pin block spring at 55k because the lightning strike TI coated block peened itself to death (terrible product, i now recommend the Apex unit).

Other than that...absolutely no other changes. IF i wasnt so lazy and i hadnt donated the gun to the NPO that i volunteer for i would have replaced the magazine catch and the magazine catch "spring". The mag release feels so soft it feels like you could breathe on it and eject magazines.

For the M&P's that we have in our stable, we've done pretty much the same thing minus the replacement of striker springs and the trigger return spring would be the sear spring.
One of our M&P's "required" a new locking block and sear housing block. The slide was so loose on the frame rails that we started to worry about it. The gun functioned fine but for peace of mind we changed the parts around. I am unsure of the round count but it was a HEAVILY used training gun from 2008.

Long story short, owning modern polymer guns is an AWESOME thing. They're seriously durable to the point of absurdity and it is nice knowing that you can spend a ton of money on ammo, run it through a "cheap" gun and get waaaayyyy more than your moneys worth out of it.

As a side note, i almost never clean my guns and in all of that time, i believe i only cleaned the gun four times. Plenty of lube was used but cleaning was just unnecessary.


WOW on the springs! You do know that the GEN 4 springs are 5,000rds and the GEN 3's are 2,00rds right? :)

Right on the TI FPS's. Not the best choice. Thank GOD for Apex!



C4

C4IGrant
03-15-14, 11:02
Grant, how much different could the long term results be with an M&P that has a fitted barrel over a stock one? I've been following the developments as you discuss them, and I can see how an M&P with an acceptable barrel-to-slide fit could eventually loosen up and shoot poorly. But what if you started off with a barrel that was fitted to the specific slide it was installed in? I would think a fitted barrel would increase the acceptable lifespan and accuracy several times over since the fit of the barrel was optimal to begin with. Any thoughts?

Have you had a chance to see how the barrels you've fit have held up in the long run?

Hard to say. I imagine that it would be similar. If the SHB and Locking Block wear (which can happen with extreme round count), they are cheap and easy to replace (around $40-$50).


Keep in mind that in order to probably see a real difference, you would need to be in the 30-80K range. At todays 9mm ammo prices, that is about $11,000 dollars or higher. If you have that kind of money (and your gun's accuracy starts to degrade), simply light it on fire and buy a new one!



C4

opngrnd
03-17-14, 12:29
Hard to say. I imagine that it would be similar. If the SHB and Locking Block wear (which can happen with extreme round count), they are cheap and easy to replace (around $40-$50).


Keep in mind that in order to probably see a real difference, you would need to be in the 30-80K range. At todays 9mm ammo prices, that is about $11,000 dollars or higher. If you have that kind of money (and your gun's accuracy starts to degrade), simply light it on fire and buy a new one!



C4

Agreed! To me it's just an issue of being able to to know when to start the fire. If I have two M&P9's, and the one I usually shoot starts to go south, I'd want to purchase a third and have it set up by the time the first is worn out. Time is also money, and I'd just want to be able to stay on top of it to avoid downtime.

Out of curiosity, how long do loaded magazines usually last? I recently noticed that my primary loaded magazine doesn't drop free so well anymore. The other magazines drop free empty or loaded, no problem. I was thinking I'd just move the 10-8 base plate on to the next new magazine in my bag and send the original one to the range bag. It still feeds just fine. I think I've had that one loaded for about two years.

Tennvol12345
03-17-14, 13:51
My range MP9FS has about 78,000 rounds of lead reloads downrange. Other than breaking slide releases and spring replacements she still runs and shoots fine. I shoot about 25,000 rounds a year so by December she should be over 100,000.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

Dino11
03-19-14, 21:10
Im currently shooting 40k rounds of 9mm a year. If i had to replace my pistols or re-barrel every year i would consider it an inconvenience...

I think you must of pushed the "0" by accident, that's almost 800 rounds a week. Maybe your a professional shooter and compete regularly, then I take that back. But as said, I to have better things to do in life than spend it behind a trigger. If you do shoot that much you must be one hell of a shooter, if I divided that many rounds up with all the weapons I have, I would be broke. And I reload about 50% of what I shoot.

Tzintzuntzan
03-20-14, 13:07
I think you must of pushed the "0" by accident, that's almost 800 rounds a week. Maybe your a professional shooter and compete regularly, then I take that back. But as said, I to have better things to do in life than spend it behind a trigger. If you do shoot that much you must be one hell of a shooter, if I divided that many rounds up with all the weapons I have, I would be broke. And I reload about 50% of what I shoot.

Dude, just stop. Notice that no one else on here questioned that claim and that should be taken as a clue. Many of the members on here do actually shoot their guns, a lot, because they want to become better shooters. Don't just randomly go online and call someone a liar because you don't know who they are or what they do for a living when they say they actually go out and shoot their guns. I don't know if that's what you meant to say but it certainly can be read that way.

beschatten
03-20-14, 13:16
I think you must of pushed the "0" by accident, that's almost 800 rounds a week. Maybe your a professional shooter and compete regularly, then I take that back. But as said, I to have better things to do in life than spend it behind a trigger. If you do shoot that much you must be one hell of a shooter, if I divided that many rounds up with all the weapons I have, I would be broke. And I reload about 50% of what I shoot.

That's only $8,000 a year if I paid retail .20 cents a round per 9mm. Or in other words, $160 a week for 800 rounds or about $640 a month.

Reloading would significantly drop the costs... Seems very do-able and not that financially cumbersome.


When you take into the costs of some people's alcohol and tobacco costs per year...$3,000 a year to reload 40,000 bullets isn't bad at all.:stop:

Koshinn
03-20-14, 14:03
I to have better things to do in life than spend it behind a trigger.

> posting on a gun board
> saying you have better things to do than shoot a gun
logic.

Dino11
03-20-14, 18:40
Dude, just stop. Notice that no one else on here questioned that claim and that should be taken as a clue. Many of the members on here do actually shoot their guns, a lot, because they want to become better shooters. Don't just randomly go online and call someone a liar because you don't know who they are or what they do for a living when they say they actually go out and shoot their guns. I don't know if that's what you meant to say but it certainly can be read that way.

No were in my post did I call anyone a liar, your the one that needs to chill out. I also stated that if I was wrong I take it back. But that is a lot of trigger time, unless your a range officer or something were you are required to spend time at the rang. Just a simple statement was all I was doing. Don't make things into something they are not.

I just thought that maybe he fat fingered the keyboard. That is a lot of time at the range, and just as much if not more time maintaining his weapons. No harm meant on my end.

JSantoro
03-27-14, 12:48
"I to have better things to do in life than spend it behind a trigger" IS a simple statement. A simple, highly subjective statement that read as if you think somebody who shoots that much more than you, job or not, is akin to something you'd scrape off your shoe.

And, your apparent disdain for time spent behind a trigger that exceeds your own was posted on a gun forum.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/xq90/163/phillip2c.jpg (https://imageshack.com/i/4jphillip2cj)

You've not posted a lot since you joined, and perhaps that's for the best. Let's keep it that way, until you can 1) post using a polite tone where applicable, and 2) you can own up to our errors without backpedaling, making excuses, and trying to shift blame. If you have any clever rejoinders you'd like to share with me, they're best transmitted via PM, and NOT in this thread.

RERAIL

If the M&P that I bought from Grant, picked up yesterday, and pounded 285 rounds through is generally indicative of what's coming off the lines......they've definitely made positive steps. VERY positive steps, I feel.

My other two M&Ps, Thing1 and Thing2, both have Apex DCAEK and RAM. I asked that this gun, Thing3, have the DCAEK installed. Bearing in mind that this thing is NEW-new and that stuff'll change somewhat over the next 2k rounds or so...trigger's heavier than my others by perhaps .75#, but with amazingly little takeup and the break is really crisp with just a hint of roll to it; I think I may actually like it better, and may have to see about what I need to do to a 2009 and a 2012-made gun to make it match that as closely as I may.

I don't really care about reset too much, but from a mechanical standpoint, while not Glock-distinct, you'd have to be a total space-case to not be able to notice it. And, that's WITHOUT an Apex RAM. From the standpoint of knowing about WHERE the thing resets, whether it's fully tactile/audible or not, this one resets noticeably further forward than either of my DCAEK/RAM combos. I'm on the way to getting used to it, and the idea of liking it is dancing around the edges of my thoughts.

Being both unused to the trigger and not having properly prepared, plus not having the HST or Gold Dot 124s I prefer to use as a baseline, I made a total hash of my usual benching exercise of 5rds ea. on a B8 bull @ 25yd. Add to that, that I used a lollipop hold when it turns out that this thing "shoots to the dot" with the set of Warren two-dot trits I had put on it; all groups were low on the target, to the point that rounds were impacting off the letter-size paper. If it's not a carbine, I'm utterly unused to shooting to the dot, so I've a learning curve to overcome. Bottom line: I'd say it groups decently, at this point, but I'm gonna re-cock this one because the only thing it netted me was getting a feel for the trigger differences and what part of the sights I need to use. The Human/System Interactions make anything else inconclusive, particularly on a single gun that I can really only compare to my other two.

Just for funsies, I did a 10-10-10 from the holster, driving the dot. Resulted in a 94 (2x), beat par. My eyes sought the tip of the post somewhere in the middle (4th shot, I think), instead of the dot, so I dropped one pretty far:

http://i764.photobucket.com/albums/xx287/santoro0313/75db2abb-611c-488e-8dd0-88723f2afc3c.jpg (http://s764.photobucket.com/user/santoro0313/media/75db2abb-611c-488e-8dd0-88723f2afc3c.jpg.html)

Everything else I did last night, I shot to the dot, and met with success. I'll be better prepared to see what the barrel can do @25 on the next go-around.

RKB Armory
04-16-14, 00:08
For the M&P9 that I recently purchased, I'm not even going to install the Apex parts that I have in my parts bin from older M&Ps that I sold. I'm very happy with the improvement over the previous four M&Ps that I used to have. Compared to my previous M&Ps, this new M&P has significantly less grittiness in the trigger take-up, less over-travel, and a more pronounced reset. This thread convinced me to give S&W another chance and I'm glad I did.

Glock30
04-16-14, 07:10
... this new M&P has significantly less grittiness in the trigger take-up, less over-travel, and a more pronounced reset. This thread convinced me to give S&W another chance and I'm glad I did.

I recently purchased an FDE 45c for every day carry with a test fire date of Jan 30 2014 and I'll double down on the above remark by Devilneck. I refuse to molest any of my M&Ps with aftermarket triggers! My Blk MidSize 45 with a test fire date of June 2012 has been great, but I feel the difference in the new 45c. Now.....if I can only find a MidSize 45 FDE:cool:

walkin' trails
04-16-14, 07:45
JS - I like your observations.

I had become a little disgusted with the groups my M&P 9 shot at 25 yards. The pistol was purchased new from an LE dealer in July 2013, and seemed to have all or most of the factory improvements. The trigger is decent for a stock polymer gun. My previous M&P experience was with a full size 45 which I dearly love except for that the recoil stirs up arthritis in my shooting hand. Anyway, my consistency with the 9 has been a crap shoot.

I shot my first pistol match in over a decade this past weekend, and went to an indoor range a couple of times to practice. I noted I was suffering from a serious case of trigger jerk regardless of how well I gripped the gun. I did manage to note that after several dry fire presses after turning my bullseye around to a blank side, I drilled the paper center mass on the first two live rounds before whatever bad habits began to surface. I was afraid that my match performance was going to be so poor with the M&P that I broke out my Gen 1 G17 to compete. The 17 has Heinie slant pro sights as opposed to Heinie ledges on the M&P. I thought the narrower rear notch and a well broke in trigger would make a difference. This G17 was my first duty semi auto and further got me thru range officer and firearms instructor courses for two Fed agencies years ago.

Well, I shot the match - two PPC-style courses on Bianchi and IPSC targets, and a steel course consisting of a plate rack and poppers. On the PPC stuff, my group with the Glock was wide open; I was jerking the trigger here and there and flat not getting a good sight picture - same as with the M&P 9 I determined. I swept the steel - 10 targets with a reload - perfectly in 13 seconds (10 yards). I was on my sights better by then. The whole point of my post is that my accuracy problems have been me and not the gun.

If I could improve anything on my 9, it would be the grip. I would like to see a back strap that is somewhere between the medium and large inserts. The large would be good if it did not have that bulky palm swell that feels so unnatural to me. Bottom line though is that I fly a desk too much and don't practice enough. It doesn't matter whether you're shooting a custom 1911 with a tuned 3lb trigger or a cheap rusted piece of garbage with a hatchet blade set up for a 28lb pull, bad habits can always creep back in and cause you to jerk or flinch. Probably more often than not, it's the shooter, not the gun.

Sent from my HTCONE using Tapatalk

RWH24
04-16-14, 11:56
The M&P I got from Grant at Christmas still had some grunge after he polished it. I changed to the APEX USB, and grunge is gone.

I'm having a 9L done by Grant now with APEX USB, Sear and Poly Trigger. Should be great.

Wake27
04-16-14, 12:00
The FS 9 I just got feels real good, but I want to lighten the trigger pull and shorten the reset some.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

C4IGrant
04-16-14, 12:23
The M&P I got from Grant at Christmas still had some grunge after he polished it. I changed to the APEX USB, and grunge is gone.

I'm having a 9L done by Grant now with APEX USB, Sear and Poly Trigger. Should be great.

IMHO, changing out the SB with the Apex USB makes the biggest difference because of its shape and spring tension.



C4

bulbvivid
04-16-14, 13:07
For the M&P9 that I recently purchased, I'm not even going to install the Apex parts that I have in my parts bin from older M&Ps that I sold.

Probably don't want to install older Apex parts. Quotes from an inquiry I sent to them in an email:


I purchased a relatively newly manufactured M&P 9FS and I am wondering if there would be any problems
installing an older Apex hard sear in it. I know there have been some changes to the M&P’s design, so
I don’t know if perhaps the newer hard sears have been changed as well.

The answer is we did change the sear a little bit to stay current with S&W tolerance changes. We keep improving our products to stay as up to date as possible with the changes Smith implements. We always suggest installing the newest model.

RWH24
04-16-14, 20:21
IMHO, changing out the SB with the Apex USB makes the biggest difference because of its shape and spring tension.



C4
That's exactly what you told me and danged if it didn't work. Just like you said.

C4IGrant
04-17-14, 07:26
That's exactly what you told me and danged if it didn't work. Just like you said.

I generally know what I am talking about (at least with the M&P). :)




C4

Koshinn
04-17-14, 09:09
I got and installed the new slide stop assembly on my M&P. The reset is VERY noticeable now. It's like night and day. As I have a FSS installed, I didn't get any of the other new S&W parts to update my M&P.

Definitely worth the $15 upgrade from G&R. I'm almost considering getting a new FS M&P to leave stock too... S&W is definitely doing things right now.

The trigger pull on my FSS'd M&P9 still seems a bit "squishy" compared to, say, a Geissele SD-E. How do you lighten a FSS'd M&P trigger pull? Use CompAEK springs?

C4IGrant
04-17-14, 09:50
I got and installed the new slide stop assembly on my M&P. The reset is VERY noticeable now. It's like night and day. As I have a FSS installed, I didn't get any of the other new S&W parts to update my M&P.

Definitely worth the $15 upgrade from G&R. I'm almost considering getting a new FS M&P to leave stock too... S&W is definitely doing things right now.

The trigger pull on my FSS'd M&P9 still seems a bit "squishy" compared to, say, a Geissele SD-E. How do you lighten a FSS'd M&P trigger pull? Use CompAEK springs?

Are the internals polished?



C4

Koshinn
04-17-14, 09:55
Are the internals polished?



C4

No. Polishing them will make the trigger pull crisp or lighten it or both? What do I have to polish?

C4IGrant
04-17-14, 10:00
No. Polishing them will make the trigger pull crisp? What do I have to polish?

It can make for a crisper release (as edges are cleaned up). It will also drop around half a pound pull weight.

This is what we polish:

1. Sear (front engagement edge to the trigger bar loop), rear.
2. Trigger bar striker block engagement area and loop. We also time the loop to the sear. Side of trigger bar is ground smooth on a stone and then polished (where it interfaces with the frame).
3. Striker Block (to include the sides where it rubs inside the slide).
4. Striker (where it rubs on the sides of the slide) and front edge where it engages the sear.





C4

RWH24
04-17-14, 19:42
That's why I patiently wait while you work your magic on my M&P. :cool:

varoadking
04-19-14, 14:10
I picked up my 7th M&P this week...another new 9mm FS. The accuracy of this factory HPK serial numbered piece is greatly improved over than that of my DUF serial number.

I swapped a few other frames around with different slides and have managed to get a frame/slide combination that works great for my other 9mm's as well, including the DUF.

This new HPK 9mm FS is every bit as consistently accurate as my M&P45's. While I still use Apex parts, I'm very pleased with the advancements S&W has made with their guns.

RWH24
04-19-14, 17:25
The M&P9 FS I got end of December 13 is an HRD prefix. Much better than the 2011/2012 models I previously had, now gone.

Talon167
04-20-14, 20:09
All this M&P talk and I had to get one for myself. Went with the 4.25" Pro model. It was manufactured in 12/2013. Comes with night sights, a 4.5lb trigger, and the more aggressive backstrap. I could do without the "Pro Series" on the slide, but whatever. Looking forward to comparing it side-by-side to my G17.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d135/Talnz167/Cannons/P4190011c_zpscbc79dbb.jpg

l8apex
04-21-14, 01:45
Took delivery of a recent MP Shield 9mm. Very accurate and the trigger is better than what most have stated at 6.5-7. It feels like 4.5-5 crisp, WAG estimate compared to my G19/17. Got lucky or maybe a production improvement?...

xjustintimex
04-21-14, 07:38
My shield produced this month has a really bad reset and break compared to all my friends shields/ones that come through the shop. Apex to the rescue!

Striker
04-21-14, 13:19
Personally I think it will be interesting to see what's going on with the Texas DPS pistols first. Then we'll see how well the pistols do with a couple of other large LEAs that are rumored to be adopting the M&P 9. Time will tell.

urbantactic
05-04-14, 21:29
Currently have a FS 9 that was produced back in July of 2013, looking to purchase a new production model this summer.

I've noticed several folks state that they have been able to purchase 9L's through Grant, but was under the impression that S&W discontinued making the 9L. Anyone know whether a 9L can still be had, and if so, whether the 9L would have the updated stock production parts?

Christopher
05-04-14, 21:43
All this M&P talk and I had to get one for myself. Went with the 4.25" Pro model. It was manufactured in 12/2013. Comes with night sights, a 4.5lb trigger, and the more aggressive backstrap. I could do without the "Pro Series" on the slide, but whatever. Looking forward to comparing it side-by-side to my G17.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d135/Talnz167/Cannons/P4190011c_zpscbc79dbb.jpg


Did you purchase that backstrap from a 3rd party or did you stipple it? Thanks in advance.

crazymailman
05-04-14, 21:45
I just got a 9L produced 12/13 and it had the new SHB, but not the new slide lock or trigger bar. It will not accept the RAM and has no audible reset.

g-men10455
05-04-14, 22:12
Did you purchase that backstrap from a 3rd party or did you stipple it? Thanks in advance.

The Pro Series comes with those back straps.

Christopher
05-05-14, 11:23
The Pro Series comes with those back straps.



Awesome thanks.

C4IGrant
05-05-14, 11:45
Just did a polish job on a new M&P CORE (no aftermarket parts were added). Starting pull weight was 6.5LBS. With our polish work, pull weight dropped to 4.9LBS!

Factory barrel hood to slide fit was .001! This one is a good for sure.



C4

tarkeg
05-06-14, 19:27
I just got a 9L produced 12/13 and it had the new SHB, but not the new slide lock or trigger bar. It will not accept the RAM and has no audible reset.

Are you talking about a 9L CORE?

graffex
05-06-14, 19:50
The M&P9 FS I got end of December 13 is an HRD prefix. Much better than the 2011/2012 models I previously had, now gone.

I also bought a new M&P 9 with the HRD prefix about 3 weeks ago. My first M&P, hope it's a good one. The trigger feels better than my brothers 3 or so year old M&P, but I haven't had a chance to live fire it yet.

xjustintimex
05-06-14, 20:44
I have a somewhat recent production m&p from a member here that is rock solid and is showing exceptional accuracy. The trigger was decent, still threw an apex aek into it.

crazymailman
05-06-14, 22:03
Are you talking about a 9L CORE?

No just 9L.

chakup
05-16-14, 10:33
So would it be safe to assume an HRZ prefix 9mm CORE should have most recent updates ?

Koshinn
05-16-14, 10:36
Kind of related... is a pull weight of 2.5# too little? Apex FSS, Apex Comp springs, polished, 2013 M&P Core with updated slide stop.

On the same trigger pull gauge, it read 4.5# before I installed the Comp springs. My G2S on my AR showed 4.5# and my SD-E showed 3.5#.

C4IGrant
05-16-14, 10:40
So would it be safe to assume an HRZ prefix 9mm CORE should have most recent updates ?

No. For whatever reason, the PRO series and CORE M&P seem to be lacking all the latest parts.



C4

C4IGrant
05-16-14, 10:55
Kind of related... is a pull weight of 2.5# too little? Apex FSS, Apex Comp springs, polished, 2013 M&P Core with updated slide stop.

On the same trigger pull gauge, it read 4.5# before I installed the Comp springs. My G2S on my AR showed 4.5# and my SD-E showed 3.5#.

Depends. What are you doing with it???


Typically, I keep my pistols at 4lbs or ABOVE for any kind of defensive purposes.


C4

Koshinn
05-16-14, 10:59
Depends. What are you doing with it???


Typically, I keep my pistols at 4lbs or ABOVE for any kind of defensive purposes.


C4

Competition, I don't carry it, but it does have a spot on my battlebelt for classes.

Did you edit my post?

chakup
05-16-14, 11:06
No. For whatever reason, the PRO series and CORE M&P seem to be lacking all the latest parts.



C4
Hopefully barrel is g2g at least.

C4IGrant
05-16-14, 12:14
Competition, I don't carry it, but it does have a spot on my battlebelt for classes.

Did you edit my post?

Cool. Go with whatever you like it.

I did not edit your post. I did hit the edit button by accident though (sorry).


C4

C4IGrant
05-16-14, 12:14
Hopefully barrel is g2g at least.

I would assume so. Always check the hood lock up though (as this matter WAAAAAY more than the twist rate).



C4

graffex
05-16-14, 12:17
I would assume so. Always check the hood lock up though (as this matter WAAAAAY more than the twist rate).



C4

Out of curiosity, how do you do this?

Sent from my Motorola StarTac using Tapatalk

chakup
05-16-14, 13:32
Edited- never mind. Thought asking how he edited post.

graffex
05-16-14, 13:33
Gonna guess because he's a Mod.

Wat.

Sent from my Motorola StarTac using Tapatalk

C4IGrant
05-16-14, 13:50
Out of curiosity, how do you do this?

Sent from my Motorola StarTac using Tapatalk

Use a feeler gauge between the hood and the slide. Ideally, you want a fit better than. .005



C4

graffex
05-16-14, 13:51
Use a feeler gauge between the hood and the slide. Ideally, you want a fit better than. .005

C4



Lol good too know . I gotta a new one so hopefuly it's fine :)



Sent from my Motorola StarTac using Tapatalk

Koshinn
05-16-14, 13:55
Use a feeler gauge between the hood and the slide. Ideally, you want a fit better than. .005



C4

Is there any way to fix loose hood lock up besides a new barrel or slide?