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TacticalSledgehammer
10-07-13, 23:39
So the wife and I go out to look at pistols for her. I let her pick out some that SHE likes because I want her to enjoy shooting it. She's got it narrowed down to the Sig P238 in .380, S&W M&P Shield in 9mm, Springfield xds in 45, and a S&W bodyguard in .380.

So far she's shot the shield (the only choice available to rent). Given its a dirty old range rental pistol, it jammed 4 times out of 50 rounds. She didn't like it as much because she wasn't hitting where she wanted. I think she's developed a flinch (we're gonna have to work on).

I've looked up reviews on youtube and other sources, but kinda take some of them with a grain of salt. Out of the choices above, which would you pick? Do you know of any bad "known" issues with any of the 4 mentioned? Thanks for your help.

JHC
10-08-13, 00:04
Sorry. None of the above. I don't ascribe to the theory that an untrained and inexperienced person is well served by picking something they decide they like. Like based on what? 50 or 100 rds of shooting?

I would try to create a list of known solid guns that have stood the test of time and trial. OTOH, FWIW I know someone with a S&W Bodyguard 380 and his wife likes it and it has run well for 100 rounds or so. See what I mean? I dunno, maybe it's solid.

Is the M&P compact 9mm too large for the intended purpose?

Interesting take on the elimination of the Shield. I've seen a few reports locally of folks giving up on them for the difficulty of shooting them well. Based on common forum reports last year I thought everyone shot them as well as a full size.

tonyxcom
10-08-13, 00:17
My Shield is my EDC but it took me a few trips to get used to it. I've got decently large hands and my issues revolved around getting a consistent grip that didn't shift during the "heavier than glock" trigger pull.

Nonetheless, my 150-200th rounds fired were during the qualification to get it added to my CCW permit (yes in Cali).

Do I shoot my Glocks better. Yes. How much? At 7 yards my Shield groups probably averaged about 1 inch bigger than my Glock groups (1-2") and after adding the full Apex kit to my Shield they are nearly equal with the edge still going to my Glocks.

BTW, in over 500rnds fired in the Shield the only failure I have had was to lock back on empty a couple of times.

Michael2007
10-08-13, 00:25
Her selections are all over the map. I took my wife to various gun stores in town and let her monkey paw what they had. Although we couldn't test them she kept coming back to a S&W M&P 9FS so that's what she bought and she likes it. She's still working on recoil management. (She has back issues) she is comfortable enough to use it for home defense. Maybe your wife should check out some full size or just compact guns. She may be pleasantly surprised with their shoot ability

badness
10-08-13, 00:47
1911's are always easy to shoot as long as she learns and trains the manual of arms.

If she likes the p238, might want to consider the p938 instead. It's almost the same gun except in 9mm instead of .380. A little more punch in yet a still manageable package.

opmike
10-08-13, 00:55
Her "choices" are all over the map. Everything from a .45 to a .380

Buy her a Glock 19, a real set of sights, a quality holster, and an assload of ammo. Once she's shot all of that up, she'll be in a better position to assess what she does and doesn't want/need in a handgun.

Right now she's in the position that we were all at when we first started out: "not knowing what we didn't know."

I wouldn't suggest a P238 or P938 to anyone who's safety I actually cared about.

Hmac
10-08-13, 01:15
Buy what she wants, what she's comfortable with. Don't force your decision on her. If she takes to shooting and enjoys it, get a "real" gun later when she's had training and practice, and in a better place to participate intelligently in the decision. Push her to something she she's not keen on and you risk quashing any enthusiasm she has now.

I would recommend the .380. Not because it's a better gun, but because it's the least likely to turn her off.

NYH1
10-08-13, 01:15
The only one of the four you mentioned that I have any hands on experience with is the S&W BG380. When my wife, son and I were at my FFL's picking up one our guns, can't remember which, my wife liked the BG380. So I figured for the price I'd get it for her for her birthday. She doesn't carry, so it's just a plinker for her.

However, after all of us shooting it quite a bit without any malfunctions (causing it not to go bang) I figured I'd get a little pocket holster and carry it when I didn't want to or it wasn't practical to carry one of my larger pistols. I fire 100 rounds of Gold Dots though it and that's what I carry in it.

After about 6 months we started having a problem with the laser not working correctly. I thought it was the battery. I replaced it and it's still not working right. It puts out a star like shape. But, in S&W defense, I haven't contacted them about it yet and I'm sure when I do they will fix as quick as they fixed my SW1911 (told me it was going to take two weeks, took four days!). The reason I haven't contacted them, lasers really don't do anything for me and I forget about it until a post like this comes up.

All that being said. . . . .and I know you didn't ask but, if and when my wife does carry, I would (and already have) have her take a REALLY LONG HARD look at a Glock G26 or G19. I know everyone has different likes and dislikes. However, my experience with my gen 3 Glock's (G22 (even w/G31 barrel from time to time), G26, G27 and G34) has been 100% reliable every time I pulled the trigger, thousands and thousands and thousands of rounds over the last 14 years. . . . .with one exception. It was a Remington UMC 180 gr. in my G22. It had a good primer hit. I took it out. My friend tried to shoot it in his S&W 4006 and it didn't on off for him either (I know, probably wasn't the best idea!). I absolutely trust that as long as do my part, my Glock's will do theirs. . . . .I have to trust what has always worked for me, can't help it, YMMV!

Good luck, NYH1.

TacticalSledgehammer
10-08-13, 05:33
Thanks for the replies. She doesn't like the thickness of Glocks (believe me I tried lol). I'm going to run it by her again, but it's her choice. I just don't want her picking out a high point or similar quality pistol.

Hmac
10-08-13, 05:59
Thanks for the replies. She doesn't like the thickness of Glocks (believe me I tried lol). I'm going to run it by her again, but it's her choice. I just don't want her picking out a high point or similar quality pistol.

My wife went through the same thing. She already knew she wanted a 9mm, her previous gun being a Colt Mustang Govt Model .380. We went to Gander Mountain and Cabelas and she tried on handguns. My preferred role was to be supportive and informative. I don't know how your relationship works, but the idea of saying to my wife "I've picked out a handgun for you" is inconceivable. She ruled out all the double-stack magazines right away for having a grip that was too thick and too short. Not enough hand on the grip. She ended up with a Walther PPS and bought a bunch of the 7 round mags, which extend the grip just enough fir her to comfortably get her hand on. I gotta hand it to her...she is not a gun enthusiast, but she insists we go to the range about once a month and in addition to her PTC course, she's taken at least one defensive pistol course every year.

Grand58742
10-08-13, 07:24
If she is flinching with a Shield in 9mm, that XDS in .45 is going to be a handful. It's not a bad pistol, but a .45 wrapped in that small of a package equals to pretty sharp recoil.

That's one you seriously need to let her shoot before you buy.

ryr8828
10-08-13, 07:26
I have the xds .45 and really like it but I can't recommend it at this time. It's under a recall and a fix has not yet been announced.

I haven't even sent mine in yet but springfield says don't shoot it.

Crow Hunter
10-08-13, 07:29
I don't have any experience with the guns you have mentioned, but I do have experience with a wife and guns.:D

I went through this over a decade ago. I owned a bunch of different guns at the time and I just knew which gun she would love. She didn't.

I just knew she was going to pick the S&W 640 or the Sig P232.

She, instead, picked the Glock. I wound up getting her a Glock 19 for Valentines day right after we were married and she currently routinely carries a G26 in her purse when she is on business trips. I recently got a S&W 642 and she really liked the way it felt, but didn't like the way it shot. (Although she did put her first round right into the 1" square at 7 yards) With the G26 & Gold Dot 124g +P she can go 5/5 into a 1" square at 7 yards slow fire and easily in an 8" circle firing quick.

I have tried to get her interested in other guns but she always comes back to Glock.

For reference my wife is 5'4" and around 105 lbs dripping wet with small hands and has no trouble controlling the gun.

walkin' trails
10-08-13, 08:02
What is her pistol to be used for? CCW, HD, or recreational shooting? If for HD or plinking, the S&W M&Ps, XD, Walthers, etc would be a better choice. There's also the old SIG P225 single stack if you can find one. Those had about as decent a grip as any modern semi auto pistol on the market. If for CCW, then that's something if a harder choice. I've heard others suggest having a spouse/SO take a basic pistol class before selecting a handgun. Of the pistols you listed, the Shield would be the most shootable in a training/recreation environment in my opinion. If it's only for plunking, that Walther P22 has a decent grip for small hands, a decent trigger for a poly gun, and seem to be pretty reliable. I think they also make it in 380.

Psalms144.1
10-08-13, 08:26
I applaud your approach of letting your wife decide what she wants to shoot, not trying to force the "right" decision on her. Here are some basic questions, though, that I'd want answers to before getting too far down the trail:

1. What is your wife's experience and comfort with handguns? Has she had any real training?
2. What's the intended role for this pistol? Plinking/range fun; home defense; concealed carry?
3. What's your budget, realistically?

If the answer to #1 is little/no training/experience/comfort, do her and you both a favor, buy a decent .22 pistol (I like the Browning Buckmark as a trainer), and get a reputable trainer to give her some lessons on fundamentals of shooting. If she's a new shooter, and she picks up a pistol with little/no training and can't hit crap, she'll quickly lose interest. Believe me, I've seen this routine HUNDREDS of times before.

If the answer to #2 is anything EXCEPT concealed carry, she's looking at absolutely the wrong types of pistols. Small, lightwieght, single stack guns are designed to be carried a lot and shot a little. Most, not all, but most, are significantly harder to shoot well because (a) short barrel/sight radius, (b) stout-for-caliber recoil due to light weight and narrow backstraps. As above, a pistol that "feels good" in her smaller hand that doesn't hit what she's aiming at, and kicks uncomfortably is going to lead to a loss of interest.

If the answer to #2 is anything EXCEPT "range/plinking ONLY," PLEASE don't let her pick the .380. There's VERY little difference in recoil/controlability (is that a word?) between the .380 and the 9mm, but a SIGNIFICANT difference in performance in self defense roles. I also would urge her NOT to select the .40 S&W or .45 ACP unless she's an experienced shooter with a lot of training in recoil management.

Your budget is going to drive practical selections. If you're in the $400-500 range, you're going to be limited to Glocks, Walther, S&W. If you can go higher, you open the door to base-level but respectable 1911s, Sigs, and HKs.

FWIW, I recently helped a newish female agent through this process. She didn't care for our issued P229R DAK .40s, and she'd had a G26 that she couldn't shoot well because the grip was so short and wide she couldn't get a good grip. She also didn't feel comfortable with a single-stack due to capacity issues. I suggested she look at the M&P 9c - and she thought it was "just right" in balancing size, concealability, and shootability.

Best of luck to you and your lovely bride in your searches.

Regards,

Kevin

C4IGrant
10-08-13, 09:05
So the wife and I go out to look at pistols for her. I let her pick out some that SHE likes because I want her to enjoy shooting it. She's got it narrowed down to the Sig P238 in .380, S&W M&P Shield in 9mm, Springfield xds in 45, and a S&W bodyguard in .380.

So far she's shot the shield (the only choice available to rent). Given its a dirty old range rental pistol, it jammed 4 times out of 50 rounds. She didn't like it as much because she wasn't hitting where she wanted. I think she's developed a flinch (we're gonna have to work on).

I've looked up reviews on youtube and other sources, but kinda take some of them with a grain of salt. Out of the choices above, which would you pick? Do you know of any bad "known" issues with any of the 4 mentioned? Thanks for your help.

OP, the below may or not apply to you in any way.


Men seem to really suck with helping women make intelligent choices when it comes to firearms. I see it in my shop, I see it online and I see it when my friends wives show me what their husbands bought them.

Men typically buy a pistol (that they secretly like) and sell it to their wives as a gift. It is usually in some obnoxious caliber and after a few short shooting sessions, they don't want anything to do with it.

So here are some general guidelines for men to follow when helping women pick out a gun.

1. Men, get training and knowledge about firearms. You can't help ANYONE if you don't know anything yourself.

2. Understand that women generally choose guns by LOOKS and then FEEL.

3. Women (generally) have no idea about calibers and how much recoil they have. So don't have them shoot 45's, 40's, .38's, 357's and 380Auto's UNTIL they have gotten to spend time with .22LR and .22Magnum. Then work them into 9mm guns with SMALL back straps in a full size configuration (1911's, M&P's, HK P30, PPQ, GEN 4 Glock, etc).

4. Women don't have strong hands and arms. So giving them a gun that is DA only or has some horrific, long 6-7lbs trigger pull isn't going to work out well. Choose guns with good triggers OR ones that can be easily modified to get the trigger pull weight down to 4-5LBS.

5. If the women cannot reach the controls (as the gun is too big) OR the gun is too complex (with decockers, etc) pass on it.

So OP, in your list the two best choices are the S&W BG and the Shield. The fact that ANY range rental gun malfunctioned is irrelevant. So don't base any opinion off of that.

Some other choices would be:

1. M&PC in 9mm (Apex DCAEK + polish)
2. G26 (add 3.5 connector + polish work)
3. S&W J Frame .22 or .22LR revolver (trigger work needs done)
4. GEN 4 19 (add 3.5 connector + polish work)
5. HK P30 (V1)


For dealing with a flinch, start doing ball and dummy drills NOW!



C4

ST911
10-08-13, 09:06
In extensive experience with ladies and handguns, the following trend as the most popular selections with the highest satisfaction. In no particular order:

Glock 19 (esp gen4)
Glock 26 (esp gen4), w/ extended baseplate/finger rest
SW 3913/3914
SW 6906
Sig P239
Ruger SP101
3" J-frames, esp M60, with smartly chosen grips
3" K-frames, with smartly chosen grips

There are others that are liked, but these are the clear leaders. Calibers are 9mm and 38spl, only.

I discuss several compact and subcompact models in this thread:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=135400

Do keep in mind that these are samples of one each, and my own experiences. Some of the observations may help. I believe that a properly functioning Shield is a viable choice.

jmp45
10-08-13, 09:44
My wife is quite petite, 5'4" probably less than 100 lbs. we don't have a scale, they are way too scary to me. For HD & plinking she moved from my M&P9FS to Gen3 G19. She loves the G19, she's the most proficient with that auto. I purchased another for her from Grant. I just put Ameriglo CAPs on hers, she likes those sights as much as I do. For CCW she moved from LCP to a 9mm Shield. She can but doesn't carry at this time, I'm usually always with her when we are out and about. With how she dresses not sure she can conceal anything..;)

I suggest a shield 9 for ccw, that would be my choice. Once they get over the limp wrist thing, they run fine, quite accurate and a soft shooter.

gunnut284
10-08-13, 09:51
The Shield and Glock 26 or 19 have been the guns all of the women I've taken shooting have preferred.

glocktogo
10-08-13, 09:54
Might throw the Walther PPQ in there. The wife of one of the guys I shoot with has one. It fits her hand well and seems easy to handle for her.

Hmac
10-08-13, 10:13
Men seem to really suck with helping women make intelligent choices when it comes to firearms. I see it in my shop, I see it online and I see it when my friends wives show me what their husbands bought them.

Men typically buy a pistol (that they secretly like) and sell it to their wives as a gift. It is usually in some obnoxious caliber and after a few short shooting sessions, they don't want anything to do with it.



Truer words were never spoken, Grant.

"There there, honey. I'll select the right gun for you. Or maybe I'll ask some guys on the internet...they'll likely know what's best for you."

Kokopelli
10-08-13, 10:15
I vote Shield.. Hands down.. FWIW.. Ron


So the wife and I go out to look at pistols for her. I let her pick out some that SHE likes because I want her to enjoy shooting it. She's got it narrowed down to the Sig P238 in .380, S&W M&P Shield in 9mm, Springfield xds in 45, and a S&W bodyguard in .380.

So far she's shot the shield (the only choice available to rent). Given its a dirty old range rental pistol, it jammed 4 times out of 50 rounds. She didn't like it as much because she wasn't hitting where she wanted. I think she's developed a flinch (we're gonna have to work on).

I've looked up reviews on youtube and other sources, but kinda take some of them with a grain of salt. Out of the choices above, which would you pick? Do you know of any bad "known" issues with any of the 4 mentioned? Thanks for your help.

crusader377
10-08-13, 10:52
I vote Shield.. Hands down.. FWIW.. Ron

+1 on the Shield. Every women that I have taken shooting preferred the Shield in 9mm. The grip on the shield works very well for people with small hands and all of the controls are easy to use and it is easy to rack the slide for someone with limited strength.

Kokopelli
10-08-13, 11:15
Indeed.. It works equally well with large hands. I've been carrying mine for almost a year now. The last few months in a Raven Concealment Phantom.. I've probably ran about a thousand through it and it's never failed. Ron


+1 on the Shield. Every women that I have taken shooting preferred the Shield in 9mm. The grip on the shield works very well for people with small hands and all of the controls are easy to use and it is easy to rack the slide for someone with limited strength.

Scrubber3
10-08-13, 11:16
My vote goes to a j-frame... Especially for CCW. Just pull the trigger and you've got guaranteed rounds into the BG. Easy to train with and easy to maintain. For defensive use, you'd be hard pressed to find a better one especially if she isn't an avid shooter.

Just because I recommend a revolver doesn't mean there aren't good examples of autoloaders. I'd recommend against a 1911 style although it'll shoot great, a single action isn't the best idea for a woman that doesn't shoot often.

WickedWillis
10-08-13, 11:42
Very well said, especially about how the 1911 relates to inexperienced shooters. My personal vote would be a Glock 19 or a Glock 26. I have gotten several of my friends upset with me by letting their girlfriends or wives shoot my Glocks and they've fallen in love with them.


My vote goes to a j-frame... Especially for CCW. Just pull the trigger and you've got guaranteed rounds into the BG. Easy to train with and easy to maintain. For defensive use, you'd be hard pressed to find a better one especially if she isn't an avid shooter.

Just because I recommend a revolver doesn't mean there aren't good examples of autoloaders. I'd recommend against a 1911 style although it'll shoot great, a single action isn't the best idea for a woman that doesn't shoot often.

crusader377
10-08-13, 12:04
My vote goes to a j-frame... Especially for CCW. Just pull the trigger and you've got guaranteed rounds into the BG. Easy to train with and easy to maintain. For defensive use, you'd be hard pressed to find a better one especially if she isn't an avid shooter.

Just because I recommend a revolver doesn't mean there aren't good examples of autoloaders. I'd recommend against a 1911 style although it'll shoot great, a single action isn't the best idea for a woman that doesn't shoot often.

I found that many women have problems with the very long trigger pull of the J frame along with the heavier recoil of the J frame vs a M&P Shield. I think the 1911 is a terrible choice for women shooters not so much because of the single action but due to difficulty physically racking the slide along with the weight.

Striker
10-08-13, 12:09
So the wife and I go out to look at pistols for her. I let her pick out some that SHE likes because I want her to enjoy shooting it. She's got it narrowed down to the Sig P238 in .380, S&W M&P Shield in 9mm, Springfield xds in 45, and a S&W bodyguard in .380.

So far she's shot the shield (the only choice available to rent). Given its a dirty old range rental pistol, it jammed 4 times out of 50 rounds. She didn't like it as much because she wasn't hitting where she wanted. I think she's developed a flinch (we're gonna have to work on).

I've looked up reviews on youtube and other sources, but kinda take some of them with a grain of salt. Out of the choices above, which would you pick? Do you know of any bad "known" issues with any of the 4 mentioned? Thanks for your help.

Same advice I would give to a guy who is new to shooting. Rent and shoot a lot of guns. Take some basic classes at a range where you can rent something for the class. Rent and shoot more guns. Make your decision after you have some experience. Right now she doesn't have any knowledge or experience to base her decision on. And if she chooses X because it feels right in my hand and X is for instance an XDS .45, she's probably going to be in for one rude I hate this gun moment. If she has a flinch problem with a 9mm shield, she's really going to have one after shooting a sub compact .45.

Also, let's be honest here, hitting where you're aiming makes shooting more fun. The basic classes will get her started in the right direction and in the process make shooting more enjoyable for her. Being a beginner and frustrated because she can't hit the target is not going to make her want to keep shooting, it's going to get the gun thrown into safe and left there.

skydivr
10-08-13, 12:15
I bought my wife the Bodyguard (and I have one also) under the idea that it's going to fit her small hand, not kick hard and she'd actually CARRY it (the BEST gun there is, is the one she has on her when she needs it)..

Because the Bodyguard is a full double-action trigger, it's a LONG trigger pull, and she tends to pull it., or softhands it and gets a stoppage (she's now locking her wrists better and seems to have eliminated that problem). She also shoots my G19, which she enjoys shooting a LOT more than the BG, but she won't carry it in her purse or concealed (too big for her); it has never jammed on her.

I'd say you need to do some more looking, or find a way to try them out before buying, unless you want to buy/sell a few til you find what she will CARRY.

ST911
10-08-13, 12:16
I found that many women have problems with the very long trigger pull of the J frame along with the heavier recoil of the J frame vs a M&P Shield.

Remember that "J-frame" is a family of guns, not a gun. There can be a lot of difference between the steel, airweight, and scandiums. Good or bad choices in grips and ammunition also weigh in. Add an Apex carry kit to the J, and the trigger is very manageable.

When one of my wee ones was ~8 or so, one of his favorites was a 3" model 60 with some longer grips and a box of 148 HBWCs. If an 8 year old can shoot it...


I think the 1911 is a terrible choice for women shooters not so much because of the single action but due to difficulty physically racking the slide along with the weight.

Operating the slide is much more about technique than anything, and few are genuinely unable to do it. Weight of the gun can be a factor, but is usually overestimated.

badness
10-08-13, 15:39
Thanks for the replies. She doesn't like the thickness of Glocks (believe me I tried lol). I'm going to run it by her again, but it's her choice. I just don't want her picking out a high point or similar quality pistol.

I've never shot a shield before, but if it's anything like an m&p, then i can see why she can't hit anything with it.

You might want to take a look at the walther pps. I've got one in .40 and they also come in 9mm. Very nice striker fired trigger right out of the box.

bluejackets92fs
10-08-13, 16:41
So the wife and I go out to look at pistols for her. I let her pick out some that SHE likes because I want her to enjoy shooting it. She's got it narrowed down to the Sig P238 in .380, S&W M&P Shield in 9mm, Springfield xds in 45, and a S&W bodyguard in .380.

So far she's shot the shield (the only choice available to rent). Given its a dirty old range rental pistol, it jammed 4 times out of 50 rounds. She didn't like it as much because she wasn't hitting where she wanted. I think she's developed a flinch (we're gonna have to work on).

I've looked up reviews on youtube and other sources, but kinda take some of them with a grain of salt. Out of the choices above, which would you pick? Do you know of any bad "known" issues with any of the 4 mentioned? Thanks for your help.

My vote would be the Shield. For me it comes down to a few factors.

The P238, while a great gun, it may be too complicated for a new shooters or inexperienced shooters. I wouldn't throw a SAO gun into the mix. YMMV

The Bodyguard has been solid but unlike the P238, it has a pretty stout recoil and I know a few women and even guys that complain about the recoil management. A good choice as a pocket or secondary firearm but as a primary carry I have a hard time recommending one.

The XDS has been getting good words about it but like the .380 models, I think the recoil management may be a little stout. I would definitely shoot them before deciding to go that route.

I think the Shield wins for me. 9mm recoil management is easier and the grip size is comfortable. I wouldn't get hung up on issues that a rental was experiencing. You don't go to Hertz to test drive a car do you?

That is just my 2 lincolns

ST911
10-08-13, 16:54
The XDS has been getting good words about it but like the .380 models, I think the recoil management may be a little stout. I would definitely shoot them before deciding to go that route.


I think the Shield wins for me. 9mm recoil management is easier and the grip size is comfortable.

Recoil in the XDs was very agreeable. The Shield as well. They're about the same.


I wouldn't get hung up on issues that a rental was experiencing. You don't go to Hertz to test drive a car do you?

Actually, I do. If I'm serious about a vehicle, want to spend some time with it, and still be able to walk away I'll rent one. It gives me a better idea of what I might expect after some miles and wear and tear.

A range rental gun can be very informative, for the same reasons.

bluejackets92fs
10-08-13, 17:01
Recoil in the XDs was very agreeable. The Shield as well. They're about the same.



Actually, I do. If I'm serious about a vehicle, want to spend some time with it, and still be able to walk away I'll rent one. It gives me a better idea of what I might expect after some miles and wear and tear.

A range rental gun can be very informative, for the same reasons.


Yeah, guess I've never thought of it that way.

I have only shot an XDS once. It was having light strikes occasionally but when it ran, I found the recoil to be pretty stout but that's just me. I'll be honest and say my trigger time with .45 platforms is pretty limited so my standing may be biased.

TacticalSledgehammer
10-08-13, 17:24
That's a lot of useful info that you guys posted. I'd reply back with individual quotes, but I think my phone would explode, so I'll try to cover some things....
It seems like the sig P238 is overly complicated for a new shooter, and it has issues, so I think I'll rule that out.
The M&P Shield seems to have mixed reviews, and if I buy one post recall, she may be okay with it.
The XDS in 45 is questionable, still. She shoots my G21SF, but I think the short .45 will be rougher on her.
If Glock made a single stack 9mm, I don't even think I'd have created this post. I think I'll work on a G19 or 26 for her and set it up at the range next time. On a Gen 4 G19, do you think the smallest grip config is a noticeable enough when compared to a Gen 3 G19? The grip thickness if her biggest complaint. Thanks!

Hmac
10-08-13, 17:36
Single stack 9mm....gotta circle back to the PPS. She should try to grip one. That pistol has not had any Shield-like issues that I've seen or read about, or experienced. I liked my wife's enough that I bought one for myself, for summer and snowmobiling.

Psalms144.1
10-08-13, 17:38
TS - the Gen4 isn't less "thick," but it's smaller front to rear, so the overall "feel" of the grip is that it's "slimmer." I'd also have an M&P9c available if you wanted to give her a breadth of options.

WickedWillis
10-08-13, 17:46
If she shoots your 21SF then she should have no issue with any of the Gen 4 9's.


That's a lot of useful info that you guys posted. I'd reply back with individual quotes, but I think my phone would explode, so I'll try to cover some things....
It seems like the sig P238 is overly complicated for a new shooter, and it has issues, so I think I'll rule that out.
The M&P Shield seems to have mixed reviews, and if I buy one post recall, she may be okay with it.
The XDS in 45 is questionable, still. She shoots my G21SF, but I think the short .45 will be rougher on her.
If Glock made a single stack 9mm, I don't even think I'd have created this post. I think I'll work on a G19 or 26 for her and set it up at the range next time. On a Gen 4 G19, do you think the smallest grip config is a noticeable enough when compared to a Gen 3 G19? The grip thickness if her biggest complaint. Thanks!

TacticalSledgehammer
10-08-13, 18:18
The 21SF is the night stand gun. The pistol we're shopping for is for her ccw. The 21sf is too big for her to conceal, or else I think she'd rock it!
She loves 1911s, but she a very novice shooter so I don't think she'd do as well with maintaining and operating it. She picks one up every time we go into a shop, not knowing the difference between it and others.
I've thought about the Walther PPS, but haven't gone back into the shop. How soft does it shoot?

WickedWillis
10-08-13, 18:24
It shoots very well, and is comparable recoil-wise to the Shield. It feels more like a full size soft recoil than a snappy small 9mm such as the kel-tec and so on. It's a nice little gun.


The 21SF is the night stand gun. The pistol we're shopping for is for her ccw. The 21sf is too big for her to conceal, or else I think she'd rock it!
She loves 1911s, but she a very novice shooter so I don't think she'd do as well with maintaining and operating it. She picks one up every time we go into a shop, not knowing the difference between it and others.
I've thought about the Walther PPS, but haven't gone back into the shop. How soft does it shoot?

Hmac
10-08-13, 19:08
It shoots very well, and is comparable recoil-wise to the Shield. It feels more like a full size soft recoil than a snappy small 9mm such as the kel-tec and so on. It's a nice little gun.

Agreed on all points. And it's slim enough that even an exceptionally trim woman like my wife, who tends toward very stylish clothes, can conceal it well in an OWB Raven, or a DeSantis Speed Scabbard (her preference).

badness
10-09-13, 18:13
I don't understand all of these comments about how a gun is "too complicated". It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the differences between a 1911 and a glock (or any striker fired gun).

If she's going to take on the responsibility of carrying a firearm, then she should be proficient in using it. The only way she's going to be proficient in using it is through practice. Through live fire and dry fire practice, she will learn the how to use the gun she has and likes despite it being "a little more" complicated regardless of what model she goes with.

If she's one of those types that just wants to have one and doesn't want to practice, then go buy her a tazer. People who don't want to become proficient in deadly weapon that they're carrying shouldn't be carrying one in the first place.

Hmac
10-09-13, 18:18
I don't understand all of these comments about how a gun is "too complicated". It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the differences between a 1911 and a glock (or any striker fired gun).



My wife wanted to replace her Colt Government Model 380 and Colt Mustang because of the need to flip the safety off and the whole cocked and locked thing. I'm sympathetic and feel the same way as her - zero interest in any 1911 variant. It's not a matter of training, it's a matter of why bother with the nonsense.

tom frost
10-09-13, 19:22
I don't understand all of these comments about how a gun is "too complicated". It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out the differences between a 1911 and a glock (or any striker fired gun).

If she's going to take on the responsibility of carrying a firearm, then she should be proficient in using it. The only way she's going to be proficient in using it is through practice. Through live fire and dry fire practice, she will learn the how to use the gun she has and likes despite it being "a little more" complicated regardless of what model she goes with.

If she's one of those types that just wants to have one and doesn't want to practice, then go buy her a tazer. People who don't want to become proficient in deadly weapon that they're carrying shouldn't be carrying one in the first place.


A tazer is a deadly weapon, people can certainly die as a result of being tazed.
IMHO, if it's not important enough to shoot someone over, it's not important enough to taze someone over either.

NYH1
10-09-13, 20:27
Thanks for the replies. She doesn't like the thickness of Glocks (believe me I tried lol). I'm going to run it by her again, but it's her choice. I just don't want her picking out a high point or similar quality pistol.
Understand completely. If she doesn't like them or feel comfortable with them she isn't going to shoot them as good or more importantly, as often. Being good at shooting pistols is like welding in that, "the more you do it.....the better you get at it".

Good luck, NYH1.

RWH24
10-10-13, 00:44
Sig 239 9mm
Sig 228/229 in 9mm

M&P 9C

XD/XDm 9mm

Abraham
10-10-13, 16:07
Glock 26 or 19, but make sure she can properly reach the trigger.

My wife loves her G19, but we had to have the grip reduced for her to adequately reach the trigger.

bjxds
10-10-13, 21:30
Since you asked, here is a little more for you to think about.

As long as she can shoot and handle it safely/comfortably you probably can't go wrong with any of your choices, BUT keep in mind
there may be a big difference between the 380 and 45 in reference to shootability for your wife. ie. the feel of the XDS 9 and XDS 45 are the same, until you pull the trigger. I personally do not have a problem shooting any of the calibers 380-45 subcompact-full size, but my wife has a big time preference for the 9mm.

Interesting why you did not mention the XDS 9. I think the XDS is a perfect CC platform in either 9 or 45. I have liked many other guns I have, but the XDS 9 and 45 have been the best I have ever owned in terms of feel, accuracy, ease of carry/concealability and general shootability. It is just such a sweet platform. With that said the XDS in in the midst of a recall to "upgrade" the gun. refer to SA site and XDS forum for all the details. The recall does not make it a bad gun, almost every major manufacture has had recalls. I have owned a few other quality weapons from quality manufactures, that have had issues that they have fixed, Colt, Remmington, Winchester, BCM, HK, SIG. Pain in the ASS, Yes; Deal breaker, No. If it is a quality company they will make it right, and if ANY gun I have is not 100% safe and reliable I will not keep it.

My wife's preference is the XDS 9. She shoots a full size 45 pretty well, it is just a little big for her to handle, and the XDS 45 is a bit much recoil for her to handle. As a matter of fact she had a few FTF attributed to limp wristing. I have never had any FTF with the same gun with almost 1000 rounds fired. So, could she learn to shoot it properly, probably, but if used for SD, we will NEVER take that chance.

In my opinion the Springfield line XDM/XDS is the closest to the 1911 platform feel in a polymer striker fired pistol, AND I do LIKE the 1911 platform.

I think it is very important to select a gun on feel as long as you are aware of the differences in recoil between the various calibers. Also keep in mind the shorter sight radius of a subcompact vs a full size will make it much harder to shoot.

Also, with the proper training and time spent, I firmly believe that almost anyone can learn to shoot just about anything made, BUT why not start with something that just feels good. Shooting, as with most things in life is major mental. If it feels good and you like it and believe you can do it you probably can. My wife feels like the 40 kicks more than the 45, and tells me, can I shoot it, YES I just don't like it.

SteveS
10-10-13, 21:47
look at a 9mm what ever. There is a tiny petite really feminine woman {hope so} that shoots 1911 race guns in action pistol type events I have seen her handle a Kahr p40 like is was a 115 gn win white box load. She shoots awesome I wish I could shoot half as geed as she does. I am not one to limit a guns use by gender or size.

HKGuns
10-10-13, 23:26
If I were you I would take her to the range and have her shoot one of these. This conceals extremely easily and can shoot .38 Special, .38 Special +P, .357 Magnums light or heavy -all of which will, generally speaking, get the job done.

If this doesn't work for her have her try a .38 special that will more than likely be even smaller.

There is a lot to be said for a DA point and pull for a woman who sounds like a newish shooter.

Edit: I'm more of an auto type guy for the most part but I absolutely LOVE this little pistol.

S&W Model 60

http://hkguns.zenfolio.com/img/s8/v76/p1434639194-4.jpg