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chadb
10-16-13, 10:55
I bought a Sig P226 and had to send the magazines back due to weak mag springs. More often the not when I would shoot it the rounds would fumble inside the magazine. Sig sent me 4 new magazines and the problem with the new ones is they would get stuck in the magazine well. I would have to grab ahold of the mag and pull fairly hard in order for it to remove. I sent the pistol and all mags back again and when it was returned the magazines did drop freely. So off to the range I went and loaded 10 rounds into my mag. After firing those 10 rounds the magazine, and all after it, had to be removed by me pulling on them. Sig is having me send the weapon back so they can look into it. Has anyone had a problem like this?

Tzintzuntzan
10-16-13, 11:50
Sometimes mag wells can be a bit too small to let mags drop free. I would be more worried about whether or not I could remove the mags easily when they don't drop free. You might also see if you can find some other base plates to see if that will make the mags drop free more consistently.

Itzik
10-16-13, 12:07
Mag's that are intended to drop free should drop free with factory spec mag well and mag's.

There is no need to start looking for other parts to replace or do any alterations to your gun except by the factory.

Send the gun back and tell them to do it right or refund the money you paid for the gun or send you a new gun that works well. It is obvious that something is out of spec, the mag's or the mag well.

britishtq
10-16-13, 12:33
Aren't Sigs supposed to work "when it counts"?

Tzintzuntzan
10-16-13, 13:17
I just don't recommend counting on a mag to drop free every time. Should a drop free mag system work properly when all components are clean? Ideally yes, but you can't always count on a mag to drop free so you should also be able to perform a reload when the mag doesn't always drop free. I guess I was not very clear about that in my previous post. I merely said what I did before because I thought the OP had already sent the gun back to Sig.

chadb
10-16-13, 13:43
I just don't recommend counting on a mag to drop free every time. Should a drop free mag system work properly when all components are clean? Ideally yes, but you can't always count on a mag to drop free so you should also be able to perform a reload when the mag doesn't always drop free. I guess I was not very clear about that in my previous post. I merely said what I did before because I thought the OP had already sent the gun back to Sig.

I get what your saying. I think it should drop free and I would like it to however after reading your comment I will also train in a way that would prepare me for when the mag does not drop free. Thanks for the comment. What do OP mean?

Tzintzuntzan
10-16-13, 13:46
OP just means the person who started the thread. I'd also prefer a mag that drops free since it's honestly more difficult to use a gun that doesn't let the mags drop free at least most of the time. For the most part good maintenance will prevent the mags from sticking but if the outside of the mag or the mag well gets dirt or grit it may not be able to drop free even with aftermarket base plates.

britishtq
10-16-13, 14:59
I had that problem with my glock until I started lubing the inside of the magwell and the outside of the mags when I clean the gun. No problem anymore. With my xd I had to bend the mags til they dropped free. Maybe try that?

DBZ220
10-16-13, 17:07
Which mag manufacturer? Sig jumps around a bit with contractors. I've seen some checkmate P226 mags that have a thicker coating on them and do tend to stick a little. If your mags are made in the U.S. and have a black bake on looking finish, that's likely the problem.
Stick with factory marked mags from MecGar. These will be marked "made in Italy" on the side. These are 100% across the board and will have a dark greyish phosphate finish in most cases.

HCM
10-16-13, 17:45
Which mag manufacturer? Sig jumps around a bit with contractors. I've seen some checkmate P226 mags that have a thicker coating on them and do tend to stick a little. If your mags are made in the U.S. and have a black bake on looking finish, that's likely the problem.
Stick with factory marked mags from MecGar. These will be marked "made in Italy" on the side. These are 100% across the board and will have a dark greyish phosphate finish in most cases.

Try the Mec Gar mags. If that does not address the problem send it back to SIG.

Averageman
10-16-13, 17:48
I bought a Sig P226 and had to send the magazines back due to weak mag springs. More often the not when I would shoot it the rounds would fumble inside the magazine. Sig sent me 4 new magazines and the problem with the new ones is they would get stuck in the magazine well. I would have to grab ahold of the mag and pull fairly hard in order for it to remove. I sent the pistol and all mags back again and when it was returned the magazines did drop freely. So off to the range I went and loaded 10 rounds into my mag. After firing those 10 rounds the magazine, and all after it, had to be removed by me pulling on them. Sig is having me send the weapon back so they can look into it. Has anyone had a problem like this?

I was the Beta tester for two Sig Rifles.
I was told the pistols were much better quality, but it seems like the same run around.
If your experiance turns out anything like mine, I would sell now and buy something that works.

chadb
10-16-13, 18:16
Which mag manufacturer? Sig jumps around a bit with contractors. I've seen some checkmate P226 mags that have a thicker coating on them and do tend to stick a little. If your mags are made in the U.S. and have a black bake on looking finish, that's likely the problem.
Stick with factory marked mags from MecGar. These will be marked "made in Italy" on the side. These are 100% across the board and will have a dark greyish phosphate finish in most cases.

I do have the mags with the black bake on look to them, thanks

SiGfever
10-16-13, 18:53
In my opinion the older SiG's lived up to their slogan, "To Hell and Back Reliability". Today's management has sullied that phrase. No pun intended but today's SiG's are a crap shoot, some good, some bad. If you can find an older model of your chosen platform I think it will serve you well. I used to own quite a few SiG's but the only one that I kept is a "NSW" model P226 that is spooky accurate and always performs as expected. JMHO

firerocketjump
10-16-13, 19:20
In my opinion the older SiG's lived up to their slogan, "To Hell and Back Reliability". Today's management has sullied that phrase. No pun intended but today's SiG's are a crap shoot, some good, some bad. If you can find an older model of your chosen platform I think it will serve you well. I used to own quite a few SiG's but the only one that I kept is a "NSW" model P226 that is spooky accurate and always performs as expected. JMHO

That's sad to hear I wanted to pick up the latest mk25 model

Tzintzuntzan
10-16-13, 22:52
An MK25 is actually a good buy from Sig even in their eternal quest to improve product lines, supposedly things have been taking an upturn since 2013. It seems Sig is also willing to listen to customer complaints since they are asking for the pistol to be sent in under warranty. Hopefully all this means that I can get a 229 and be confident it'll run.

davebee456
10-16-13, 23:27
The SIG P226 Mk25 is the only new sig other than a Sig Elite that I would buy new.

I will stick to my West German P226 CPO I bought runs like a top so far...

texasgunhand
10-16-13, 23:46
I think i would try a different mag,but i bet sig will fix it for you if theres a problem. I had this problem on a used springfield armory .45 i bought and had problems with it for YEARS.
finally one day i bought a new colt mag and the problems stopped right then. No more jams no more stuck mags nothing...and it had the factory shooting star mags when i got it...

opmike
10-17-13, 05:09
I had that problem with my glock until I started lubing the inside of the magwell and the outside of the mags when I clean the gun. No problem anymore. With my xd I had to bend the mags til they dropped free. Maybe try that?

Are you seriously suggesting that he BEND his magazines? Bend what?

That and lubing magazines sounds like textbook WECSOG and a bandaid. Quality magazines out of most modern service handguns should be dropping free on a out of box handgun. If they aren't, then I'd be inclined to think the magazines, mag release, or frame is out of spec. If something is out of spec, that's cause to send it back to the manufacturer as far as I'm concerned and have them **** around with it. Not to rant, but I've grown tired of having to tweak and treat Glocks, M&Ps, Sigs, etc. like some finicky 1911 requiring all manner of fitting, extractor tuning, etc. and I've grown tired of people making excuses for them. This shouldn't become the "new normal."

SigSlave
10-17-13, 05:36
Sigs mags have trouble dropping free due to out of spec mag wells or out of spec trigger bars mostly.

I have also seen them fail due to the mag release hole to magwell location being off.

There are many contributing factors to mags not dropping free. The best thing to do when diagnosing the issue is to strip the frame completely an add parts one at a time until you find the cause.

CAVDOC
10-17-13, 07:48
Don't know if this can be an issue as I have seen with 1911's at times and especially berettas - try loosening your grip screws a little- some people over tighten then the cause the mags to hang up. On berettas there are tiny lock washers under the screws which are often lost when the grips are removed and they take up just enough space that when the grips are screwed on tight the grip screw will drag on the mag. If you find this a factor consider getting some very small rubber I rings to put under the grip screws to allow tightness without the grip screw invading the mag well

SigSlave
10-17-13, 11:23
An MK25 is actually a good buy from Sig even in their eternal quest to improve product lines, supposedly things have been taking an upturn since 2013. It seems Sig is also willing to listen to customer complaints since they are asking for the pistol to be sent in under warranty. Hopefully all this means that I can get a 229 and be confident it'll run.

Don't believe that for a second. The same people who were calling the shots in 2012 are calling the shots now so I don't see why the product would improve for 2013.

The product has steadily declined since 2004 so common sense would dictate that the 2013 product will be worse than the 2012 offerings, not better :).

Itzik
10-17-13, 11:35
Don't believe that for a second. The same people who were calling the shots in 2012 are calling the shots now so I don't see why the product would improve for 2013.

The product has steadily declined since 2004 so common sense would dictate that the 2013 product will be worse than the 2012 offerings, not better :).

Sorry but I disagree with this fatalistic point of view. many wake up after they see that their formerly good product is losing due to bad production.

They fire the people in charge of certain aspects, they give better customer service, they hire more diligent people and they can turn things around.

The only place where things don't change is in government and elected officials due to ideology, business is different when you get hit in the pocket book you make changes or you go out of business.

I have a Sig Extreme Elite 229 in 9mm that was my favorite gun until I changed just recently to the Walther PPQ M2 and only because the Sig is eight to ten ounces heavier not because it is faulty in any way.

texasgunhand
10-17-13, 12:40
Man i just dont get it ... sig has bent over backwards to help me..i called them and asked them about sending me a stock for one of their m4s i have becouse i thought it was a little sloppy and they sent me a new magpull stock and let me keep the old standered m4 stock... FOR FREE... who else does that. I did call and talk to a manager not a flunky, the flunkys arent gun experts there just reading a list off a computer.like most other companys have.

I must be the only one who get good CS from them? Nothings perfect when your selling millions of products ,not colt, not sig ,not springfield,chevy or ford.You dont hear from people that dont have problems with products only people that have problems.Even when people on here have sent products back to them it seem like they get a fast turn around etc. I hate ford becouse of problems ive had with them but others love them...

Itzik
10-17-13, 13:15
Man i just dont get it ... sig has bent over backwards to help me..i called them and asked them about sending me a stock for one of their m4s i have becouse i thought it was a little sloppy and they sent me a new magpull stock and let me keep the old standered m4 stock... FOR FREE... who else does that. I did call and talk to a manager not a flunky, the flunkys arent gun experts there just reading a list off a computer.like most other companys have.

I must be the only one who get good CS from them? Nothings perfect when your selling millions of products ,not colt, not sig ,not springfield,chevy or ford.You dont hear from people that dont have problems with products only people that have problems.Even when people on here have sent products back to them it seem like they get a fast turn around etc. I hate ford becouse of problems ive had with them but others love them...

I fully agree with you my 229 Extreme Elite had a small mark on its slide rails I called them and they picked up the gun and replaced the slide and barrel and returned the gun to me at their cost in less then two weeks.
The gun was functioning 100% before and is 100% after they returned it. It is my second favorite gun after my PPQ M2 and that is only because the Sig is heavier.

firerocketjump
10-17-13, 16:51
An MK25 is actually a good buy from Sig even in their eternal quest to improve product lines, supposedly things have been taking an upturn since 2013. It seems Sig is also willing to listen to customer complaints since they are asking for the pistol to be sent in under warranty. Hopefully all this means that I can get a 229 and be confident it'll run.



Thats pretty good to hear, I have been wanting the MK25 for quite a while now. Does anyone know when the difference between the old P226 navy and the Mk25?

SigSlave
10-17-13, 18:04
Sorry but I disagree with this fatalistic point of view. many wake up after they see that their formerly good product is losing due to bad production.Except for when it makes them a ton of money to sell poor products to people who don't know any better

They fire the people in charge of certain aspects, they give better customer service, they hire more diligent people and they can turn things around.

The only place where things don't change is in government and elected officials due to ideology, business is different when you get hit in the pocket book you make changes or you go out of business.

I have a Sig Extreme Elite 229 in 9mm that was my favorite gun until I changed just recently to the Walther PPQ M2 and only because the Sig is eight to ten ounces heavier not because it is faulty in any way.

Is your experience based off of the one example you own or years of being a Sig fan? You would think that a company would do all of the things you mentioned if their stellar reputation had a black mark. This is Sig we are talking about.

Itzik
10-17-13, 18:43
Is your experience based off of the one example you own or years of being a Sig fan? You would think that a company would do all of the things you mentioned if their stellar reputation had a black mark. This is Sig we are talking about.

I was carrying Sig's before I was carrying Glock's, I started with a Sig 228 then switched to the first 229's that came out in 40 caliber. I have a lot of experience with most guns as I have been carrying many different guns for the last 38 years in this country and a few more years in the old country.

I switched to the Glock 23 and Glock 27 when they came out but last year I bought a Sig 229 when the new model accommodated and offered 15 rounds of 9mm in the mag when the old one was 13 rounds of 9mm.

I also know that their quality went down for a while but it does not mean that it will stay like that as my experience with their CS and others shows that they are doing better and getting things taken care of.

I don't know how old you are and how much experience you have with various guns and different models but there isn't a gun manufacturer that did not have it's ups and downs, first was Colt that did not produce anything that did not require customization, then it was S&W with its problems with the model 59 which I owned and liked very much, and I am talking about many years ago, then came Kimber that had a disaster in the way they treated customers, then came Glock's (not in that order the Glock was before the Kimber) I never had any problems with any Glock's I owned but it seems like many have problems with them as this pages attest to it.

The M&P had problems that customer service and after market parts seems to have fixed at least mostly.

I have been carrying, competing, teaching combat shooting for many years almost 38 years, believe me I have enough experience when I make any statement to back up what I am saying.:)

SigSlave
10-17-13, 19:04
I was carrying Sig's before I was carrying Glock's, I started with a Sig 228 then switched to the first 229's that came out in 40 caliber. I have a lot of experience with most guns as I have been carrying many different guns for the last 38 years in this country and a few more years in the old country.

I switched to the Glock 23 and Glock 27 when they came out but last year I bought a Sig 229 when the new model accommodated and offered 15 rounds of 9mm in the mag when the old one was 13 rounds of 9mm.

I also know that their quality went down for a while but it does not mean that it will stay like that as my experience with their CS and others shows that they are doing better and getting things taken care of.

I don't know how old you are and how much experience you have with various guns and different models but there isn't a gun manufacturer that did not have it's ups and downs, first was Colt that did not produce anything that did not require customization, then it was S&W with its problems with the model 59 which I owned and liked very much, and I am talking about many years ago, then came Kimber that had a disaster in the way they treated customers, then came Glock's (not in that order the Glock was before the Kimber) I never had any problems with any Glock's I owned but it seems like many have problems with them as this pages attest to it.

The M&P had problems that customer service and after market parts seems to have fixed at least mostly.

I have been carrying, competing, teaching combat shooting for many years almost 38 years, believe me I have enough experience when I make any statement to back up what I am saying.:)

So it seems like you have owned Sigs in their golden age. The age where they earned the reputation they are pissing away. Now you have a newer production model as well. Is this correct?

My experience in firearms is not as extensive as yours. I turn 38 on Saturday :) What I do have is first hand, every day experience with the product. I was an employee from 2010 to early 2013. It was the absolute worst job I have ever had. BTW, I wasn't calling you out in my previous post. Your general gun experience was never in question. I was just curious if your Sig experience was limited to one gun.

I have seen first hand how the quality of the product has slipped in just those few years. As far as I'm concerned, the company is a shit show. It's a mess. I would love to get into more detail but I won't discuss it publicly. Lets just say I lost track of how many horrible decisions I have witnessed and some of them border on incompetent.

Talon167
10-17-13, 19:06
The Checkmate mags that came/come with some of the Sigs are junk. Got some crappy ones with my 226 Combat. Sent them back to Sig, got more Checkmates and ended up selling them and buying all MecGars.

I have 4,300 rounds through that gun and the only failure I had was when it was brand new with the crappy Checkmate magazines.

Itzik
10-17-13, 19:31
So it seems like you have owned Sigs in their golden age. The age where they earned the reputation they are pissing away. Now you have a newer production model as well. Is this correct?

My experience in firearms is not as extensive as yours. I turn 38 on Saturday :) What I do have is first hand, every day experience with the product. I was an employee from 2010 to early 2013. It was the absolute worst job I have ever had. BTW, I wasn't calling you out in my previous post. Your general gun experience was never in question. I was just curious if your Sig experience was limited to one gun.

I have seen first hand how the quality of the product has slipped in just those few years. As far as I'm concerned, the company is a shit show. It's a mess. I would love to get into more detail but I won't discuss it publicly. Lets just say I lost track of how many horrible decisions I have witnessed and some of them border on incompetent.

Happy Birthday young man, I am 65. I was just telling you that I have a long experience with various types of guns which I have not even mentioned some of them.;) so you know that you are talking to someone that has a lot of experience.

Yes my first Sig's were from the Golden age and were very good, the reason I switched to the Glock was because of their extra capacity over the Sig and also being a lot lighter almost by 8 to 10 ounces.

Recent Sig's I owned were the 229 E2 and my current one the 229 Extreme Elite both have been great guns.

I understand that you worked there and got disappointed with the way things were going there and I am sure if you would be working somewhere else like Kimber and even Glock now when they tried to fix what was not broken with the Gen 4's you probably would feel the same but as I said most gun companies had their problems at one time or another but they can get fixed and I am sure that Sig is trying to do so or they will go into the s&^t hole.

Itzik
10-17-13, 19:37
The Checkmate mags that came/come with some of the Sigs are junk. Got some crappy ones with my 226 Combat. Sent them back to Sig, got more Checkmates and ended up selling them and buying all MecGars.

I have 4,300 rounds through that gun and the only failure I had was when it was brand new with the crappy Checkmate magazines.

That might be a reason for some of the problems, mine always had the MecGar Mag's and they were and are flawless.

SigSlave
10-17-13, 20:02
Happy Birthday young man, I am 65. I was just telling you that I have a long experience with various types of guns which I have not even mentioned some of them.;) so you know that you are talking to someone that has a lot of experience.

Yes my first Sig's were from the Golden age and were very good, the reason I switched to the Glock was because of their extra capacity over the Sig and also being a lot lighter almost by 8 to 10 ounces.

Recent Sig's I owned were the 229 E2 and my current one the 229 Extreme Elite both have been great guns.

I understand that you worked there and got disappointed with the way things were going there and I am sure if you would be working somewhere else like Kimber and even Glock now when they tried to fix what was not broken with the Gen 4's you probably would feel the same but as I said most gun companies had their problems at one time or another but they can get fixed and I am sure that Sig is trying to do so or they will go into the s&^t hole.

I'm afraid that they are already there at this point. It is really sad. I was a huge fan of the products. The Sigarms branded guns were great and, of course, the W. German guns speak for themselves. I remember saving up for a long time to buy my 226 in 2003 and having a feeling of pride when picking it up. You couldn't give me one now.

Hopefully they can turn it around but it would take the removal of most of the executives and middle management to do it. That's not gonna happen.

Thanks for the birthday wishes.

Itzik
10-17-13, 20:30
Let's hope so because it is an exceptional product if it works and only if they could lighten it up a little it would be great.