View Full Version : CARBON ON BOLT TAIL
USNIGHTGUNNER
08-12-08, 16:56
Looking for suggestions on the best method for removing carbon from the bolt tail. I have use a couple of products that are supposed to cut through carbon, but I am not having a lot of success.
I brush it off with stainless steel wire brush... one of those wooden handled jobs.
If it's really hard stuck on there, I'll scrap it off with a very small screw driver tip.
You can't hurt the bolt tail... believe me. Some people just leave a limited amount of carbon on there all the time.
I simply use the blade on my SOG tool or Gerber when it gets bad. Have you tried Slip 2000 Carbon Cutter? I have used it and it works pretty good.
USNIGHTGUNNER
08-12-08, 19:05
It works ok and the mineral spirit method is only so so.
Iraq Ninja
08-12-08, 19:09
308 brass works well if you don't have a brush handy. Ak brass will work too, if that is all you can find laying around :)
Blackwater
08-12-08, 19:20
308 brass works well if you don't have a brush handy. Ak brass will work too, if that is all you can find laying around :)
Case mouth as a scrapper, just roll the bolt and scrape.
5.56 works also. :)
You guys clean your guns? I KNEW there had to be a reason i had so much extra time with my AK in those carbine classes. ;)
Blankwaffe
08-12-08, 20:07
For heavy carbon on the bolt tail I just soak the bolt in a jar of Hoppe's No.9 or CLP and wipe the area clean.Otherwise I dont worry about it...I just wipe it down with CLP and what comes off,comes off.
Keeping the rings and bolt tail wet with CLP between uses seems to keep the carbon soft and in check.
I use to scrape the carbon off but decided I was putting in extra effort for nothing.The carbon builds right back up after a few rounds and seems to be self limiting.
ETA
The Hoppe's No.9 takes the brass marks right off the bolt face,lugs and ejector.
Razor knife or carpet cutter works outstanding
RogerinTPA
08-12-08, 20:30
+1 on Slip carbon cutter, wire brush and pocket knife. I use a dental cleaning tool/pick, i got from a flee market to clean the inside of the bolt carrier where the bolt sets. A small flat head screw driver works well too.
I'm waiting for someone to make a doodad to clean the boat tail and charge $30 for it.
Seriously I just scrape it off or I use Carbon Cutter.
Robb Jensen
08-12-08, 21:17
Scraping the carbon off of the tail of your bolt is about as useful as cleaning out the carbon from the tailpipe of your vehicle........
I'm waiting for someone to make a doodad to clean the boat tail and charge $30 for it.
Seriously I just scrape it off or I use Carbon Cutter.
They are a little more than $30 bucks but a gas piston upper would cure the carbon thing on the bolt tail..................... Just kidding, please no flame!
Seriously, I just use a bench grinder with a wire brush if its bad enough, got to watch out for the gas rings though, better take them off if you do it this way!!..........................AD
I use to scrape the carbon off but decided I was putting in extra effort for nothing.The carbon builds right back up after a few rounds and seems to be self limiting.
ETA
The Hoppe's No.9 takes the brass marks right off the bolt face,lugs and ejector.
true, though it seems hard carbon deposits CAN build up in the back of the bolt carrier.
Blankwaffe
08-12-08, 22:30
true, though it seems hard carbon deposits CAN build up in the back of the bolt carrier.
Yeap,same as the bolt....seems to be self limiting.Although if it looks heavy and bothers me,I soak the offending area in my jar of No.9 or a jar of CLP(both of which I use as a dunkit) and dig the carbon out with a sharpened chop stick.Otherwise I dont worry too much about it.
This area is self limiting as the carbon builds up and then doesn't build up anymore so a cleaning regimen is not needed.
For long term storage, it is smart to scrape this off to avoid pitting on the back of the bolt.
I use slip carbon cutter followed by the edge of a brass punch if there is a stubborn spot.
Otherwise keep this are well lubed when you put your gun away even for a short time.
LeadAway cloth works wonders...I use it for my M1A piston and my 642CT.
Keeping the rings and bolt tail wet with CLP between uses seems to keep the carbon soft and in check.
This is for sure! If I soak my bolt and inside of the carrier for a few days before cleaning my AR, It's a shit load easier to get stuff out of there.
Scraping the carbon off of the tail of your bolt is about as useful as cleaning out the carbon from the tailpipe of your vehicle........
Does Brownells have a tool for that? :confused:
Ned's MOACKS tool has one that is very effective if you are so in need of doing so takes 3 seconds and presto clean I never clean mine off it serves me no purpose to do so. over 6k right now in one dirty gun that hasnt seen anything but more lube and ammo
OldNavyGuy
08-13-08, 10:44
You guys clean your guns?
The carbon builds right back up after a few rounds and seems to be self limiting.
Scraping the carbon off of the tail of your bolt is about as useful as cleaning out the carbon from the tailpipe of your vehicle........
This area is self limiting as the carbon builds up and then doesn't build up anymore so a cleaning regimen is not needed.
all good quotes, i once fussed and fretted over getting all that carbon out, but now i adhere to the, ""This area is self limiting as the carbon builds up and then doesn't build up anymore so a cleaning regimen is not needed.""
A gun I intend to use for defensive purpose will be as clean as reasonably possible.
I rarely clean my non fighting stuff... rimfires, 1911, etc. But I am particular about my carry pistol, and fighting rifle.
all good quotes, i once fussed and fretted over getting all that carbon out, but now i adhere to the, ""This area is self limiting as the carbon builds up and then doesn't build up anymore so a cleaning regimen is not needed.""
my friend's AR apparently jammed up due to carbon in this area:confused:
he was showing it to somebody. checked the chamber, released the charging handle... and CRUNCH. shit was locked up tight :confused:
i guess he managed to pound out the pins holding hte upper and lower together and finally freed it.
i wasn't there, that's just what he told me :confused:
Blankwaffe
08-15-08, 00:33
That must have been one nasty,poorly maintained weapon.I'd recommend your friend read the -10 and learn to properly PM a weapon.
Ive never,in my 20+ years of shooting AR's had the carbon in that area cause a failure.But there again I do clean and lube my weapons regularly.
Robb Jensen
08-15-08, 06:50
my friend's AR apparently jammed up due to carbon in this area:confused:
he was showing it to somebody. checked the chamber, released the charging handle... and CRUNCH. shit was locked up tight :confused:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/smilies/Imcallingbullshit-2.jpg
I'd venture to say that 2-4 drops of oil down through the ports of the bolt carrier would have allowed the bolt to close. When I run my ARs in a class or competition, the carrier/bolt is literally dripping of oil........and you guessed it they simply work.
Dry and dirty doesn't run.
Wet and dirty does...
Ned's MOACKS tool has one that is very effective
+1 Mine works great!
As I understand, the carbon on the bolt tail is self limiting. The carbon build up inside the carrier may cause some issues. Typically, solvent will disslve a sufficient amount of carbon from both areas. I periodically use a bolt carrier carbon scraper and use a spent .44 mag casing to scrap the bolt tail free of build up.
Concerning lube--wet wet wet, most issues are caused by people being scared of oil.
+1 for MOACKS also. As alreadt stated, this area doesn't need to be spotless. If however you do want one that is very clean, then another method that works very well is to use a brass wire brush on a drill press/grinder. Use caution not to damage the gas rings though. It comes off very nicely. Also do not use a stainless wire brush as it is noticeably tougher than the brass ones.
Boltgun
Blankwaffe
08-16-08, 00:26
Its pretty simple....just put a few drops of CLP it the gas ports of the carrier like Gotm4 recommended.
Thats about the only good use Ive found for the Break Free aerosol CLP.Stick the little tube in one of the vents and give it a shot.It foams up and wets the entire area including the inside of the carrier key.It has a higher solvent content and penetrates like crazy,so it tends to work a little faster than the liquid version.
If you do this during and especially after shooting the CLP will actually start to break the crusty stuff down.If allowed to sit for a few days it really breaks the stuff loose.
As far as scrappers and the like for removing the carbon from inside the carrier...personally I dont think its needed and I sure aint spendin my money on a dedicated tool for such.
All I use for that area is a sharpened chop stick I saved from the china buffet.I eat there about once a week and have collected a good assortment.Free tool and it works perfectly to keep the chunks under control.To resharpen the chop stick just stick it in a pencil sharpener.
For heavy fouling I either soak the bolt in a jar of CLP or Hoppe's No.9 for a day or so.As a note the ole No.9 works best for soaking.I prefer the smaller glass pickle jars or the old 4oz. Hoppe's No.9 glass bottles.The fouling wipes right off.Same for the carrier.
Quib has detailed instructions on his bolt dunk solution and it works extremely well also.
IMHO there is way too much scrapin goin on.
But if it makes a man or woman feel better then scrape away.
Thats my opinion as it is anyway.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/smilies/Imcallingbullshit-2.jpg
I'd venture to say that 2-4 drops of oil down through the ports of the bolt carrier would have allowed the bolt to close. When I run my ARs in a class or competition, the carrier/bolt is literally dripping of oil........and you guessed it they simply work.
Dry and dirty doesn't run.
Wet and dirty does...
i wish i had more info. i wasn't there when it happened. :confused:
i've never had a malfunction like this, and i don't clean my gun much at all. usually just wipe the loose carbon off the bolt/carrier and relube with CLP or militec.
seems to work fine. every 400 rounds or so i'll give it a decent cleaning.
QuickStrike
08-16-08, 08:10
I'm glad to hear that cleaning off the carbon in this area is unneeded. It's a big hassle as none of my gun solvents seem to be taking it off that well. :o
If you do this during and especially after shooting the CLP will actually start to break the crusty stuff down.If allowed to sit for a few days it really breaks the stuff loose.
I drop CLP in the exhaust holes and in the carrier key at the end of every range session. It works... but as you said, it takes time to soak.
All I use for that area is a sharpened chop stick I saved from the china buffet.I eat there about once a week and have collected a good assortment.Free tool and it works perfectly to keep the chunks under control.
...I thought I was alone with the wood thing...
I also use the little cuticle stick that comes with the nail clippers and stuff...It's 1911 sized and shaped to scrape, and poke pins...http://emoticons4u.com/smoking/rauch06.gif
Cleaning carbon in this area is mostly a waste of time. Many people do more damage to their bolt than good by their various methods of cleaning, scraping, etc. As far as the buddy that told someone that wasn't there that the weapon "locked-up" due to carbon - that's called a clue.
Ned Christiansen
08-18-08, 09:44
There is a strict volume requirement in this area as the gas needs to expand into it for force the carrier to move. If buildup on the bolt tail and inside the carrier bore reduce the volume to below .071 cubic inches, there just is not enough pressure to do the job and..... (sound of BS meters all over the net, humming and then pegging the needle, some shattering their glass)....
I agree 99.5% it's not critical to clean these areas even though I make some tools for doing it. I will say that if one is going to clean them it's critical to do it right, in terms of the bolt tail anyway, the danger being inadvertently damaging or even removing a gas ring or just poking or cutting oneself. That's why I made the bolt tail scraper in such a way that it can't slip off as you apply pressure. Some of my very first ones did not have cutting relief on them and did not work very well. They now all have it CNC'd in and a couple twists make the chunks fly. Again not critical to do but I'm a little strange in that I actually enjoy cleaning guns (still to this day!) and there's just something satisfying about banishing carbon and crud from one of my implements if recreation.
If using a wire brush for bolt tail cleaning just be sure when you go to reassemble that you still have three gas rings.
I agree with gotm4. Cleaning the carbon in this area is a waste of time. Many people do more damage to their bolt than good by their various methods of cleaning, scraping, brushing on a grinding wheel, etc. Leave it alone.
I don't know! I've been scraping and brushing with steel wire brushes for over 10 years and haven't even damaged the finish on the bolt tail... let alone the bolt itself.
I guess I'll have to try a grinding wheel! :p I do agree that the rifle will function with it left on there. I've seen ARs that'll function so dirty that the barrel extension is full of crud. ARs will run very dirty, but I still like mine very clean.
and there's just something satisfying about banishing carbon and crud from one of my implements if recreation.
:D
That, and I feel like a lazy bum if I don't remove it.
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