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Center Shot
09-26-10, 18:13
In the Winchester Ranger 9mm Luger +P+ 127 RA9TA, has anyone compared the old SXT VS the new T-Series?

I have shot them in jugs of water and the SXT seemed to have more exposed lead, while the T-Series has more exposed and peeled back brass jacket and less exposed lead.

Anyone compared the two? Would the T-Series have more penetration?

Jerm
09-27-10, 00:14
From the sticky...


The following loads all demonstrate outstanding terminal performance and can be considered acceptable for duty/self-defense use:

9 mm:
Barnes XPB 105 & 115 gr JHP (copper bullet)
Federal Tactical 124 gr JHP (LE9T1)
Speer Gold Dot 124 gr +P JHP
Winchester Ranger-T 124 gr +P JHP (RA9124TP)
Winchester Partition Gold 124 gr JHP (RA91P)
Winchester Ranger-T 127 gr +P+ JHP (RA9TA)
Federal Tactical 135 gr +P JHP (LE9T5)
Federal HST 147 gr JHP (P9HST2)
Remington Golden Saber 147 gr JHP (GS9MMC)
Speer Gold Dot 147 gr JHP
Winchester Ranger-T 147 gr JHP (RA9T)
Winchester 147 gr bonded JHP (RA9B/Q4364)

.40 S&W:
Barnes XPB 140 & 155 gr JHP (copper bullet)
Speer Gold Dot 155 gr JHP
Federal Tactical 165 gr JHP (LE40T3)
Winchester Ranger-T 165 gr JHP (RA40TA)
Winchester Partition Gold 165 gr JHP (RA401P)
Federal HST 180 gr JHP (P40HST1)
Federal Tactical 180 gr JHP (LE40T1)
Remington Golden Saber 180 gr JHP (GS40SWB)
Speer Gold Dot 180 gr JHP
Winchester Ranger-T 180 gr JHP (RA40T)
Winchester 180 gr bonded JHP (RA40B/Q4355/S40SWPDB1)

.45 ACP:
Barnes XPB 160 & 185 gr JHP (copper bullet)
Federal HST 230 gr JHP (P45HST2)
Federal HST 230 gr +P JHP (P45HST1)
Federal Tactical 230 gr JHP (LE45T1)
Speer Gold Dot 230 gr JHP
Speer Gold Dot 230 gr +P JHP
Winchester Ranger-T 230 gr JHP (RA45T)
Winchester Ranger-T 230 gr +P JHP (RA45TP)

Notes:
-- Obviously, clone loads using the same bullet at the same velocity work equally well (ie. Black Hills ammo using Gold Dot bullets, Corbon loads using Barnes XPB bullets, etc…)

-- Bullet designs like the Silver Tip, Hydra-Shok, and Black Talon were state of the art 15 or 20 years ago. These older bullets tend to plug up and act like FMJ projectiles when shot through heavy clothing; they also often have significant degradation in terminal performance after first passing through intermediate barriers. Modern ammunition which has been designed for robust expansion against clothing and intermediate barriers is significantly superior to the older designs. The bullets in the Federal Classic and Hydrashok line are outperformed by other ATK products such as the Federal Tactical and HST, as well as the Speer Gold Dot; likewise Winchester Ranger Talons are far superior to the old Black Talons or civilian SXT's.

Center Shot
09-27-10, 12:04
Thanks Jerm

But I am referring to the Winchester Ranger Law Enforcement Ammo 9mm Luger +P+ 127 Grain RA9TA. It was redesigned a couple of years ago.

The older design had SXT on the box, the new redesigned bullet has T-Series on the box instead of the SXT, they were both RA9TA.

The older SXT bullet mushroomed with a lot of more lead exposed. The new T-Series has less lead exposed in the mushroom, but more jacket is used as part of the bullets expansion.

I just wondered how that would effect terminal ballistics between the two.

Dirtyboy333
02-16-11, 23:11
The T-series is the Ranger Talon. The ranger talon is "far superior" to the sxt's or Black Talons according to Doc. Their basically an improved version of the sxt's and black talons...I have the 45+p Ranger Talons and the expansion is amazing...They also run flawlessly trough my USP 45c. With more of the jacket exposed as your referring to the pedals will aid in ripping trough flesh as the projectile spins creating IMO a more severe wound than the sxt's...

There are a bunch of video's on youtube comparing the exact rounds you're talking about using water tests and other mediums.... sorry i dont have a link but i'll try to find it....

Glock17JHP
02-17-11, 14:25
Comparing the loads you mentioned above...

I would put the Ranger T loads at the top, followed by the Black Talon, and I would place the civilian SXT a lot lower than both. The Ranger T works well, and is quite barrier blind, and the Black Talon is not as good against some barriers but is still pretty good. The civilian SXT isn't in the same class at all, and is easily identified by 8 petals rather than the 6 the others 2 have.

There can be some confusion because even some of the Ranger T loads had SXT on the boxes, as I recall.

DeltaKilo
02-17-11, 15:33
Comparing the loads you mentioned above...

I would put the Ranger T loads at the top, followed by the Black Talon, and I would place the civilian SXT a lot lower than both. The Ranger T works well, and is quite barrier blind, and the Black Talon is not as good against some barriers but is still pretty good. The civilian SXT isn't in the same class at all, and is easily identified by 8 petals rather than the 6 the others 2 have.

There can be some confusion because even some of the Ranger T loads had SXT on the boxes, as I recall.

Well, recall that there was an older design of the Ranger T and a Newer one, the newer one identified with "T series" on the box, as opposed to "SXT series".

If I recall correctly, the redesign of the bullet was to enhance expansion and was to also enhance the strength of the copper jacketing (they're copper, not brass-jacketed) as it peeled back from the lead to allow for a more jagged edge. As such, the newer design should show adequate expansion, but there should be far less peeling of the jacket away from the lead.

I know that in the new T-series for Ranger 45, supposedly bare-gel expansion is closer to that of the HST than previous designs.

The design remains one of the best-performing rounds that I know of.

Dirtyboy333
02-17-11, 20:33
Well, recall that there was an older design of the Ranger T and a Newer one, the newer one identified with "T series" on the box, as opposed to "SXT series".

If I recall correctly, the redesign of the bullet was to enhance expansion and was to also enhance the strength of the copper jacketing (they're copper, not brass-jacketed) as it peeled back from the lead to allow for a more jagged edge. As such, the newer design should show adequate expansion, but there should be far less peeling of the jacket away from the lead.

I know that in the new T-series for Ranger 45, supposedly bare-gel expansion is closer to that of the HST than previous designs.

The design remains one of the best-performing rounds that I know of.

+1 to that. They gelatin test that i saw compared the HST and Ranger -T and they were almost identical in performance. You could still ID which bullet was which just by looking at them and the slightly different way they expand but they both performed better than any other i have seen.....I would like to get my hands on some 45 HST. I love my Ranger-t's but i want to do some test of my own for fun. IIRC the youtube test i believe showed the HST maybe expanding very slightly more , emphasis on slightly.