View Full Version : Recommended Powder for 55g FMJBT W/C
Boxerglocker
04-16-11, 02:59
I'm taking advantage of a bulk buy on Horandy 55g FMJBT W/C bullets with a couple of buddys.
Anyways, looking to purchase a 8# jug of powder to load for these bullets. I've tried 2520 it's OK but would like to experiment with something else.
The load with be used in my DDM4V2 16 inch 1:7 twist and will be for practice and our local TAC rifle matches.
I'd prefer a ball powder as they meter real well, but primarily do not not want a compressed load thus no volumous powders. Makes a mess when I get moving on the XL650.
Appreciate the advice.
Buck_Naked
04-16-11, 03:36
For 55 gr FMJ I usually use H335 or 2230.
I've used H335 and Ramshot TAC and was pleased with both. I'm currently loading the TAC because I'm using Wolf primers and it is incredibly accurate with 24.5 gr and the Hornady bullet (recommended by other forum members). I load it on a 550B and launch it with either a DDM4 or DDV5 midlength with no FT anythings. I think you can search both powders and get good information.
Eric
22.8 gr of accurate 2230 here, very nice powder, meters very well, and seems to burn clean..
Also only takes up about 2/3 of your case volume, so you can shake your rounds to verify powder charge as a part of your QC, and its impossible to double charge without overflowing.
Boxerglocker
04-16-11, 08:53
I've used H335 and Ramshot TAC and was pleased with both. I'm currently loading the TAC because I'm using Wolf primers and it is incredibly accurate with 24.5 gr and the Hornady bullet (recommended by other forum members). I load it on a 550B and launch it with either a DDM4 or DDV5 midlength with no FT anythings. I think you can search both powders and get good information.
Eric
The TAC really interests me as I'm also looking to trying the Wolf SRM primers out. Cost per a round is very much a isssue for me otherwise I'd just buy Fereral XM193.
The only thing I heard bad about TAC is contradicting to your experience though which it does not do well with lighter weight bullets and groups typical of 1.5 inches at 100 yards are the norm. Can you attest to this?
m1a_scoutguy
04-16-11, 14:37
For 55 gr FMJ I usually use H335 or 2230.
These are my two favorite Powders for 223/5.56 loads ! I have used more AA2230 than I have H335,,,but have had similair results with both !! Buy what ya can get a better deal on and go from there,,,,I have also shot Thousands of Wolf SRP without a single issue !
Pumpkinheaver
04-16-11, 22:18
H-335
Nightvisionary
04-17-11, 07:57
The TAC really interests me as I'm also looking to trying the Wolf SRM primers out. Cost per a round is very much a isssue for me otherwise I'd just buy Fereral XM193.
The only thing I heard bad about TAC is contradicting to your experience though which it does not do well with lighter weight bullets and groups typical of 1.5 inches at 100 yards are the norm. Can you attest to this?
So you will be loading for a carbine to shoot practice and tactical rifle matches but require accuracy better than 1.5 MOA, really?:confused:
h335 & IMR 4064. My last batch with the IMR worked very well for me.
H335
Go with 25g seated to 2.26 with a SRM primer and you'll be good to go.
COL can make a big difference with some guns.
I use TAC for my 77 SMK accuracy load and also use it for a 55 Hornady FMJBT /w cann - for my practice and CQB 3-Gun load. I load 24.6 grains TAC for the 55s with Rem 7 1/2 primers.
For convenience, I was loading the 55s at the same seater setting I use for the 77s , which gave me an O/L of ~2.240". It worked well in my 16" N4 Light (~2 MOA) and better still in the SPR; but was disappointing in a DD 14.5" pencil barrel.
I shortened the COL to 2.222" and It made a big difference. Testing yesterday in the DD LW, my 10 shot group came in at a hair over 2" at 100 Yds. Brass was mixed IMI/TZZ, trimmed to 2.155".
WC844
Cheapest powder you can buy. It is non-cannister grade H335.
hi-techammo.com and patsreloading.com usually have it available.
(it is a surplus pulldown non commercial version of H335)
I'll toss in my vote for Ramshot TAC. It's stupid-easy to use and is really versatile.
BG,
I haven't shot it at 100 yds for accuracy. I've shot many sub 1" groups at 50 yds with my Eotech off my shooting bag. I like this load.
Eric
Boxerglocker
04-18-11, 21:32
So you will be loading for a carbine to shoot practice and tactical rifle matches but require accuracy better than 1.5 MOA, really?:confused:
I'm simply asking a question regarding the pros and cons I have read about this powder with a 55g bullet. In our TAC matches it's commion to have a couple of targets out to 130-150 yards at the start of the stage, to shoot prone or benched, before a run and gun. We are only allowed non-magnified optics so the more accurate load for the chosen bullet the better is all...
BG,
I haven't shot it at 100 yds for accuracy. I've shot many sub 1" groups at 50 yds with my Eotech off my shooting bag. I like this load.
Eric
Thank you. I'm gonna put a PV order in this week with a bunch of guys on a group buy TAC it is.
Anybody care to share your current TAC load? Particularly with a 55g bullet.
My XM193 duplication load is a 55gr FMJ over 25.0gr of H-335.
I'm going to have to try using the TAC load of 24.5 that few guys recommended, as I have about 10 pounds of it (I usually shoot 69gr bullets, and it does an excellent job with them).
H335 with Hornady 55gr FMJBT tests you might find interesting.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Cartridge: 223 Rem
Powder: Hodgdon H335
Case: Lake City 89 - Once Fired
Case Length: 1.75
Primer: CCI #41
Bullet: 55gr Hornady FMJBT - w/canalure
OAL: 2.225 (case mouth roughly center of canalure)
Crimp: Very Light using Lee Factory Crimp Die
Firearm: Custom Rock River AR-15
Barrel Length: 16"
Barrel Details: 223 Wylde Chamber, Stainless Steel, 1 in 8 twist
Comp: Lund/SJC .223 Titan
Chrono Dist: 15 ft
Date: 9/4/2007
Time: 2:00 PM
Temp: 87-89
Bar Pres: 29.95
Rel Hum: 66%
Pdr Wt: 25.0 - 2988 fps - 10 shot average
Pdr Wt: 25.4 - 3009 fps - 10 shot average
Pdr Wt: 25.7 - 3045 fps - 10 shot average
Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3107 fps - 10 shot average
Following shot same day, same conditions for reference.
Factory Win USA 55 gr FMJ - Lot HL42 - 3252 fps - 10 shot average
Factory Win USA 55 gr FMJ - Lot NM32 - 3177 fps - 10 shot average
Factory Fed XM193 55 gr FMJ - Lot 2 - 3267 fps - 10 shot average
Black Hills 77 gr HPBT - Red Box - 2685 fps - 10 shot average
----------------------------------------------------------------
Cartridge: 223 Rem
Powder: Hodgdon H335
Case: Lake City 89 - Once Fired
Case Length: 1.75
Primer: CCI #41
Bullet: 55gr Hornady FMJBT - w/canalure
OAL: 2.225 (case mouth roughly center of canalure)
Crimp: Very Light using Lee Factory Crimp Die
Firearm: Colt CAR-15 HBAR
Barrel Length: 16"
Barrel Details: 1 in 9 twist
Chrono Dist: 15 ft
Date: 9/4/2007
Time: 2:00 PM
Temp: 87-89
Bar Pres: 29.95
Rel Hum: 66%
Pdr Wt: 25.0 - 2947 fps - 10 shot average
Pdr Wt: 25.4 - 2995 fps - 10 shot average
Pdr Wt: 25.7 - 3029 fps - 10 shot average
Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3065 fps - 10 shot average
Following shot same day, same conditions for reference.
Factory Win USA 55 gr FMJ - Lot HL42 - 3204 fps - 10 shot average
Factory Fed XM193 55 gr FMJ - Lot 2 - 3218 fps - 10 shot average
Black Hills 77 gr HPBT - Red Box - 2666 fps - 10 shot average
----------------------------------------------------------------
Various primers 26.0 gr H335
--
Cartridge: 223 Rem
Powder: Hodgdon H335
Case: Lake City 89 - Once Fired
Case Length: 1.75
Bullet: 55gr Hornady FMJBT - w/canalure
OAL: 2.225 (case mouth roughly center of canalure)
Crimp: Very Light using Lee Factory Crimp Die
Firearm: Custom Rock River AR-15
Barrel Length: 16"
Barrel Details: 223 Wylde Chamber, Stainless Steel, 1 in 8 twist
Comp: Lund/SJC .223 Titan
Chrono Dist: 15 ft
Date: 9/18/2007
Time: 1:00 PM
Temp: 82-86
Bar Pres: 29.96
Rel Hum: 58%
Elevation: 1001 ft
Primer: CCI #41 Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3102 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Fed Match Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3085 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Win SR Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3082 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Rem BR Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3083 fps - 10 shot average
Following shot same day, same conditions for reference.
Factory Win USA 55 gr FMJ - Lot HL42 - 3188 fps - 10 shot average
Factory Fed XM193 55 gr FMJ - Lot 2 - 3241 fps - 10 shot average
----------------------------------------------------------------
Various primers 26.0 gr H335
--
Cartridge: 223 Rem
Powder: Hodgdon H335
Case: Lake City 89 - Once Fired
Case Length: 1.75
Bullet: 55gr Hornady FMJBT - w/canalure
OAL: 2.225 (case mouth roughly center of canalure)
Crimp: Very Light using Lee Factory Crimp Die
Firearm: Colt CAR-15 HBAR
Barrel Length: 16"
Barrel Details: 1 in 9 twist
Chrono Dist: 15 ft
Date: 9/18/2007
Time: 1:00 PM
Temp: 82-86
Bar Pres: 29.96
Rel Hum: 58%
Elevation: 1001 ft
Primer: CCI #41 Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3075 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Fed Match Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3080 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Win SR Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3044 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Rem BR Pdr Wt: 26.0 - 3073 fps - 10 shot average
Following shot same day, same conditions for reference.
Factory Win USA 55 gr FMJ - Lot HL42 - 3177 fps - 10 shot average
Factory Fed XM193 55 gr FMJ - Lot 2 - 3153 fps - 10 shot average
----------------------------------------------------------------
Various primers 26.2 gr H335
--
Cartridge: 223 Rem
Powder: Hodgdon H335
Case: Lake City 89 - Once Fired
Case Length: 1.75
Bullet: 55gr Hornady FMJBT - w/canalure
OAL: 2.225 (case mouth roughly center of canalure)
Crimp: Very Light using Lee Factory Crimp Die
Firearm: Custom Rock River AR-15
Barrel Length: 16"
Barrel Details: 223 Wylde Chamber, Stainless Steel, 1 in 8 twist
Comp: Lund/SJC .223 Titan
Chrono Dist: 15 ft
Date: 9/18/2007
Time: 1:00 PM
Temp: 82-86
Bar Pres: 29.96
Rel Hum: 58%
Elevation: 1001 ft
Primer: CCI #41 Pdr Wt: 26.2 - 3156 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Fed Match Pdr Wt: 26.2 - 3114 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Rem BR Pdr Wt: 26.2 - 3114 fps - 10 shot average
Following shot same day, same conditions for reference.
Factory Win USA 55 gr FMJ - Lot HL42 - 3188 fps - 10 shot average
Factory Fed XM193 55 gr FMJ - Lot 2 - 3241 fps - 10 shot average
----------------------------------------------------------------
Various primers 26.2 gr H335
--
Cartridge: 223 Rem
Powder: Hodgdon H335
Case: Lake City 89 - Once Fired
Case Length: 1.75
Bullet: 55gr Hornady FMJBT - w/canalure
OAL: 2.225 (case mouth roughly center of canalure)
Crimp: Very Light using Lee Factory Crimp Die
Firearm: Colt CAR-15 HBAR
Barrel Length: 16"
Barrel Details: 1 in 9 twist
Chrono Dist: 15 ft
Date: 9/18/2007
Time: 1:00 PM
Temp: 82-86
Bar Pres: 29.96
Rel Hum: 58%
Elevation: 1001 ft
Primer: CCI #41 Pdr Wt: 26.2 - 3107 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Fed Match Pdr Wt: 26.2 - 3089 fps - 10 shot average
Primer: Rem BR Pdr Wt: 26.2 - 3093 fps - 10 shot average
Following shot same day, same conditions for reference.
Factory Win USA 55 gr FMJ - Lot HL42 - 3177 fps - 10 shot average
Factory Fed XM193 55 gr FMJ - Lot 2 - 3153 fps - 10 shot average
----------------------------------------------------------------
My old Hodgdon #25 load manual shows:
26" Barrel
H335 - 55gr bullet
Case unknown, Primer unknown
Starting Load 25.0 - 3011 fps - 36,600 CUP
Maximum Load 27.0 - 3281 fps - 48,200 CUP
--
Hodgdon #27 load manual shows:
24" 1:12 Barrel
H335 - 55gr bullet
Case Winchester, Primer Winchester
Starting Load 23.0 - 3018 fps - 40,800 CUP
Maximum Load 25.3 - 3203 fps - 49,300 CUP
dudley2112
04-25-11, 08:11
not one suggestion for win 748? 26 grains of it under the same bullet your using worked great out of my norinco and armalite Ar 15s
h335 & IMR 4064. My last batch with the IMR worked very well for me.
4064 is great... but why would you want to meter that long cut powder just for 55 gr FMJs? :confused:
I've been playing with a lot of different powders lately.
And since no one mentioned it... I'm going to recommend my current favorite...
H322! 23.3 grains... it's a short cut extruded powder that meters damned near as good as ball powder.
4064 is great... but why would you want to meter that long cut powder just for 55 gr FMJs? :confused:
It was left over from some .243 loads & I was out of h335, so I thought I'd try some out. I was pleasantly surprised with it when I shot it.
It was left over from some .243 loads & I was out of h335, so I thought I'd try some out. I was pleasantly surprised with it when I shot it.
I just started playing with it... and I like it. We tried it with 69gr SMKs and had good results. 23.0 grains.
Makintrax73
04-25-11, 11:48
I played around with AA2230 for a while. Compared it to H335. Ran both up and down the range of loads. Still was not really satisfied with the accuracy.
Had some H4895 for loading in my Garand. I noticed that it is also appropriate for 223 loads so I tried it - substantially better accuracy in my gun than either AA2230 or H335. 50 yard groups are about 2/3 the size w/ H4895.
25 grains of H4895 fills the case to near the bottom of the case neck and a max load (26) is compressed so it is VERY hard to overcharge, and it is also very easy to look into each case and verify the charge.
All of the above in a 1/7 twist, 55fmj-bt, and wolf SRM primer.
ETA: It also meters to within +/- .1grain for the most part in a cheap Lee Pro Auto Disk (ie if the charge is 25.1 probably 9/10 rounds will be 25.0 to 25.2).
I use TAC with 55gr FMJ's from Widener's. I settled on 26 gr which is fairly consistent at 100 yds within 1" IN MY GUNS. They all have 1/9 twist, all but 1 have 16" bbls. The 20" does well with it as well. A lot of people seem to have pressure problems above 25.5 gr, but mine show no difference other than the closer I get to 26 gr the tighter the groups are. YMMV--work up to it slowly. Also this load uses mixed mil brass and CCI mil primers. Only use in a 5.56 bbl as I have no idea if the actual pressure is within .223 limits, but again I show no overpressure signs.
Also 1 poster wondered why anybody would want better than 1.5 MOA out of practice ammo. Why WOULDN"T anybody want the best accuracy obtainable with any given ammo???? Take as many variables out of your shooting as you can, that way if you miss you can only blame yourself because you KNOW your weapon/ammo are capable of making the shot. ANY shot.
I thought 24.5 of TAC was the official M4C load for 55gr. Been using for quite a while and is a nice light training load that wont wear and tear too much.
During my trials, 25.5 came in 2nd.
For grins I am just wondering other good loads at different bullet weights with TAC(77, 69). Oddly, 25.5 was my ideal load for 62gr LC.
I thought 24.5 of TAC was the official M4C load for 55gr.
It was. But you know how we can't leave good enough alone right? :D
I still have a half gallon bucket of that load in my closet.
travellightfreezeatnight
04-28-11, 19:29
I am having pretty good luck with Varget- 27.4 grains with cci 400 primers. 55 gr vmax average velocity (out of 20 inch hbar) was 3060 at 18 F. I have not tried this load in 16 in barrel yet (as soon as the snow and rain quit). It meters well out of the dillon powder measure. Accuracy at 50 yards was well within acceptable for me, 5 rounds at 0.388 (center to center). Should keep me at 1" to 1.5" at 100 yards. When weather improves, will work on this load some more.
Boxerglocker
04-28-11, 20:54
Also 1 poster wondered why anybody would want better than 1.5 MOA out of practice ammo. Why WOULDN"T anybody want the best accuracy obtainable with any given ammo???? Take as many variables out of your shooting as you can, that way if you miss you can only blame yourself because you KNOW your weapon/ammo are capable of making the shot. ANY shot.
:agree:
Exodus appreciate you sharing your load data. I'm going to try H335 as well got a pound locally but will burn through the 8 pounds of TAC I just received. Same to MarkM and the all the rest. I'll be wanting to try different combos.
I just got this chronograph set-up delivered today so I will be doing some load development this weekend. :D
http://glocktalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=216134&d=1304040614
I'll start at 24g with TAC and work up with a 2.25 OAL using Wolf SRM primers.
Question regarding brass, how picky are you guys in sorting by brand and head stamp for the practice, plinking stuff? Any significant differences between the LC year dated cases?
Question regarding brass, how picky are you guys in sorting by brand and head stamp for the practice, plinking stuff? Any significant differences between the LC year dated cases?
I don't sort by headstamp at all for practice/plinking stuff. I just make sure the brass is usable. I haven't checked for an differences in LC brass depending on the year.
The only way I sort my practice/plinking brass is by number of times fired.
26 grains of W748 is good for what ails ya. ;)
I just sort my brass based on times shot for plinking/training ammo.
I'll start at 24g with TAC and work up with a 2.25 OAL using Wolf SRM primers.
Question regarding brass, how picky are you guys in sorting by brand and head stamp for the practice, plinking stuff? Any significant differences between the LC year dated cases?
In one rifle (a 14.5" LW that's finicky on what it likes), I get better accuracy at 2.220 to 2.225" OAL with the 55 Hornday FMJs. Probably just rifle specific, but the manual calls for 2.200".
I just load two brands of brass - LC and IMI/TZZ , so it's easy to keep them sorted.
I tried a few 55 gr V-Max today just to see how they would do in the 14.5" LW. They show great potential in that rifle.
I am having pretty good luck with Varget- 27.4 grains
Damn! How can you get that much Varget into the case? :D
26 grains of W748 is good for what ails ya. ;)
I got 26.5 grains to be a nice load that gave me a 100 fps slower bullet than M193. A good, nice stout load with a cushion for error.
That 748 has a nice low flash too. H335 flashes pretty bright on the other hand.
travellightfreezeatnight
05-04-11, 05:01
[QUOTE=markm;985075]Damn! How can you get that much Varget into the case? :D
very carefully,
yes it is a compressed load, but also helps me keep track of dillon, powder comes half way up neck and is easy to see.
This was not my starting load, but gives me the most consistant velocity and accuracy. I am currently working up a similar load with surplus 193 projectiles from wideners.
I have loaded exclusively with WC 844 for the last year, and 24.5 to 25.5 grains is the sweet spot for my rifle. Just got some 748"like" powder I am going to build up some loads with, and finish off the 8 pound jug if I like it.
I have loaded exclusively with WC 844 for the last year, and 24.5 to 25.5 grains is the sweet spot for my rifle. Just got some 748"like" powder I am going to build up some loads with, and finish off the 8 pound jug if I like it.
WC 844 and H335 are the same thing.
and
WC 846 is BLC2
WC 844 and H335 are the same thing.
and
WC 846 is BLC2
Yeah, when I got my jug I started at 24gr. and got around 2500-2550 fps, and worked my way up to 26gr and mid 2800's fps out of a 14.5 inch barrel. This new powder is from 50gr frangible ammo that I will take the same approach too as far as load buildup.
Boxerglocker
05-11-11, 17:17
Just a follow up. I got do do a short chrono session indoors today.
Horandy 55g FMJBT W/C
LC 07 once fired brass trimmed to 1.750 +/- 0.003
25g Ramshot TAC
2.20 OAL
Wolf SRM primers
Shot of of my DDM4V2 16inch barrel, indoor range 59 degrees F
2680 to 2730 Fps with a 10 shot average 2695
Burn pretty clean, and recoil was no sharper than what I was expecting from the factory stuff I've shot. Nickle sized 5 shot group of a bag at 25 yards.
I decided to start at 25g so as to have a comparison, I'm gonna move down to that 24.5 M4C pet load and up to 25.5 next to see differences in recoil and accuracy. Hopefully I'll get outside when it's not raining on the 100 yard line.
The sweet thing about 24.5 grains of TAC is that I can switch over to BARNES RRLP frangibles without adjusting the powder charge. They weigh the same but gobble up a lot more case volume because of their length.
The mild tac load leaves me plenty of room.
Boxerglocker
05-11-11, 19:11
The sweet thing about 24.5 grains of TAC is that I can switch over to BARNES RRLP frangible without adjusting the powder charge. They weigh the same but gobble up a lot more case volume because of their length.
The mild tac load leaves me plenty of room.
mark how much drop in velocity should I expect to have with the 24.5 load? I had been looking into loading a couple of Mags full of HD/SD 5.56 ammo. Looks like that BARNES RRLP frangible might be the ticket. Pretty pricey though at $29 plus shipping a 100.
LonghunterCO
05-11-11, 19:24
WC844
Cheapest powder you can buy. It is non-cannister grade H335.
hi-techammo.com and patsreloading.com usually have it available.
(it is a surplus pulldown non commercial version of H335)
Dang Chad- I owe you a beer!
Thanks
LonghunterCO (Marty from the 2009 Colorado Magpul Dynamics Handgun I&II)
mark how much drop in velocity should I expect to have with the 24.5 load? I had been looking into loading a couple of Mags full of HD/SD 5.56 ammo. Looks like that BARNES RRLP frangible might be the ticket. Pretty pricey though at $29 plus shipping a 100.
I don't know. I had some Quickload charts, but I'm not sure of the accuracy of them. I can tell you that 24.5 runs every gun I own well... from 11.5 SBR to 20 inch rifle.
I'll see if I can't pull up a quickload graph at work tomorrow.
30 cal slut
05-12-11, 06:32
The sweet thing about 24.5 grains of TAC is that I can switch over to BARNES RRLP frangibles without adjusting the powder charge. They weigh the same but gobble up a lot more case volume because of their length.
The mild tac load leaves me plenty of room.
Mark, is this load okay to use in indoor pistol ranges?
Mark, is this load okay to use in indoor pistol ranges?
Depends on the range. The round still can damage mild steel targets. You'd have to ask the range officer. And oddly enough, range policies usually contradict actual bullet capabilities.... so. :confused:
30 cal slut
05-13-11, 07:58
Depends on the range. The round still can damage mild steel targets. You'd have to ask the range officer. And oddly enough, range policies usually contradict actual bullet capabilities.... so. :confused:
I guess I'll find out soon enough. :sarcastic:
LonghunterCO
05-29-11, 20:07
WC844
Cheapest powder you can buy. It is non-cannister grade H335.
hi-techammo.com and patsreloading.com usually have it available.
(it is a surplus pulldown non commercial version of H335)
Was swinging back through St.Louis on my way back from business. Ran in to Hi-Tech Ammo and picked up...a lot of WC844 (amoung other stuff). What a great bunch of guys in there. I can not comment on dealing with them on line but that are first class in person. Called my order in the day before and they had it waiting for me and discounted a couple items a little extra.
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