View Full Version : Sabre Defence...opinions?
How do they compare with the rest of the Tier 1 manufacturers? Yes I guess this a bit of a "Is brand X a hair better than brand Y" thread, but heck, thats the question I am needing to ask. Spending $ means making decisions.
rob_s
10-31-2007, 01:44 PM
Are you looking for subjective opinions or quantifiable features? If the latter, have you looked at The Chart (http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=6642)?
C4IGrant
10-31-2007, 02:09 PM
Very good company with a quality product. I am not a fan of a couple things they do, but a good all around product.
C4
Bob Reed
10-31-2007, 03:20 PM
Hello Grant:
What are the thing's you'd like to see Sabre do differently?
Thanks.
Are you looking for subjective opinions or quantifiable features? If the latter, have you looked at The Chart (http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=6642)?
Already saw the chart, I am looking for: "I got mine and the upper/lower were very tight and it shot like a house afire" or "I got mine and fit-finish was horrible and I sent it back and they were completely rude to me."
Both the above are fictional of course, but I want personal experience validating or not validating the extra $1-300 they ask.
Very good company with a quality product. I am not a fan of a couple things they do, but a good all around product.
C4
Yes...do tell!
C4IGrant
10-31-2007, 03:23 PM
Mil-spec RE, HPT/MP test barrel and bolts, use H buffers instead of carbine buffers.
Other than than, they stuff is GTG.
C4
rob_s
10-31-2007, 03:31 PM
HPT/MP test barrel and bolts
It was my understanding that they do these things. Not correct?
C4IGrant
10-31-2007, 03:33 PM
It was my understanding that they do these things. Not correct?
They MP test only in batches last time I checked. They were going to HPT/MP test everything in the future, but don't know if they have started to or not yet.
C4
rob_s
10-31-2007, 03:37 PM
The MP test only in batches last time I checked. They were going to HPT/MP test everything in the future, but don't know if they have started to or not yet.
C4
Sent 'em the question via the "contact us" portion of their site. We'll see what kind of response we get.
If they don't do the testing on all samples, The Chart will need to be modified.
Shihan
10-31-2007, 04:25 PM
Already saw the chart, I am looking for: "I got mine and the upper/lower were very tight and it shot like a house afire" or "I got mine and fit-finish was horrible and I sent it back and they were completely rude to me."
Both the above are fictional of course, but I want personal experience validating or not validating the extra $1-300 they ask.
For the majority on this forum "fit and finish" is a non issue.
For the majority on this forum "fit and finish" is a non issue.
For me reliability is an issue. I am correcting the "fit and finish" on an AR mutt my dad bought from a friend of mine who sold it for fit-finish reasons. 5 minutes or less of gently grinding will fix it. No more FTF's :D
Shihan
10-31-2007, 08:53 PM
For me reliability is an issue. I am correcting the "fit and finish" on an AR mutt my dad bought from a friend of mine who sold it for fit-finish reasons. 5 minutes or less of gently grinding will fix it. No more FTF's :D
UHHHHH fit and finish and relaibility arent related.
UHHHHH fit and finish and relaibility arent related.
Usually no, and probably not on any rifle but a Mutt like my friend made. SOMEHOW (I dont know how) the feed-ramps have a gap between them and the lower. They are not M4 feed ramps as far as I can tell either. It is just enough of a gap on the left ramp to snag sharper tipped rounds.
I guess this would qualify as "build quality" instead of "fit-finish" though, you are correct.
CobraCutterPB
11-02-2007, 03:01 PM
It seems like the idiots from Barf.com are starting to trickle over.
If you don't already know, this site isn't to tell what your daddy says or what a friend thinks he knows or any other bullshit. This site is for sharing quality information. Don't claim to know what your talking about when you obviously don't know shit. This is the 3rd thread you have been giving your "expert" opinion, and its clear you are lost in the sauce. Keep your mouth shut and listen, learn, and listen some more.
Sorry for rant. Have a PT-test in a few hours.....HA
rob_s
11-02-2007, 03:04 PM
Sent 'em the question via the "contact us" portion of their site. We'll see what kind of response we get.
If they don't do the testing on all samples, The Chart will need to be modified.
Heard back.
They are starting to test every sample, as opposed to representative samples, but they do not feel comfortable saying "all our bolts and barrels are MPI and HPT" just yet. I find that admirable, but I have adjusted The Chart and pushed them back a couple of notches until they feel comfortable telling us they are 100%.
In other news, they did take a look at The Chart, and other than a couple of minor changes they said that their column is accurate.
C4IGrant
11-02-2007, 03:08 PM
Heard back.
They are starting to test every sample, as opposed to representative samples, but they do not feel comfortable saying "all our bolts and barrels are MPI and HPT" just yet. I find that admirable, but I have adjusted The Chart and pushed them back a couple of notches until they feel comfortable telling us they are 100%.
In other news, they did take a look at The Chart, and other than a couple of minor changes they said that their column is accurate.
Good, glad I my info was correct. They are a quality company that do what they say.
C4
Sounds good. I am really getting the feeling that SDI is a notch above Armalite in a few aspects. Since the rifles both will cost me the same, I am leaning towards SDI.
Is the non-milspec buffer-tube an issue on an AR15 A2 20" w/fixed buttstock? Or are all those buffer tubes the same and this is an M4 issue? Still trying to get it all figured out, Thanks.
Shihan
11-03-2007, 12:21 AM
A2 RE's do not differ in size.
A2 RE's do not differ in size.
Thanks!
Does Sabre chrome line the carrier?
Shihan
11-03-2007, 02:06 AM
yes they do.
How well are the keys staked? Do they get it right every time like Colt?
Shihan
11-03-2007, 05:11 AM
How well are the keys staked? Do they get it right every time like Colt?
Sabre does a pretty good job on just about everything except their carbine RE. I havent seen one not staked right but if one wasnt it is a easy fix.
MAJORSDAD
11-03-2007, 11:41 PM
I bought one of their 20" uppers and the sights were misaligned when I received it. I called them, and was told to send it back for a replacement or a refund. So, I sent it back for a refund, and it took almost a month in a half and several phone calls to get a credit. I'm not impressed. :(
I bought one of their 20" uppers and the sights were misaligned when I received it. I called them, and was told to send it back for a replacement or a refund. So, I sent it back for a refund, and it took almost a month in a half and several phone calls to get a credit. I'm not impressed. :(
This is the second such case I have heard of this happening. :(
vicious_cb
11-07-2007, 05:14 AM
Other than problems with the lower( I plan on getting only an upper from them) What other problems do they have with respect to the upper. I see that they just made a significant move on the chart to the right.
Does anyone know of they have started to do full MPI and HPT testing of their components. Also can someone enlighten me to what a shot peened bolt is?
carbinero
11-07-2007, 10:19 AM
I don't imagine the chart and this issue suggest the sages here would prefer CMMG?
rob_s
11-07-2007, 10:25 AM
I don't imagine the chart and this issue suggest the sages here would prefer CMMG?
No, I wouldn't. The "2"s in the chart under CMMG somewhat skew their position. The problem I have with CMMG is that they appear to be hit or miss, and pinning down exactly what you may or may not get from them seems to be problematic.
I called SDI with a few technical questions. Noone was in the office to answer them but the receptionist. I was given (without asking of course) the sales rep's cell number. He was at a wholesaler show in Nevada. He happily, competently, and honestly answered my questions. VERY! nice people. FWIW he also said they stake the snot out of the gas keys.
Tim McBride
11-08-2007, 03:08 AM
I've been very happy with my Sabre upper; function has been flawless.
_Tim
CoolBreeze
11-08-2007, 03:40 AM
Also can someone enlighten me to what a shot peened bolt is?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shot_peening
Shot peening is a process used to produce a compressive residual stress layer and modify mechanical properties of metals. It entails impacting a surface with shot (round metallic, glass or ceramic particles) with force sufficient to create plastic deformation. It is similar to sandblasting, except that it operates by the mechanism of plasticity rather than abrasion: each particle functions as a ball-peen hammer. In practice, this means that less material is removed by the process, and less dust created.
Peening a surface spreads it plastically in the manner of a rivet, causing changes in the mechanical properties of the surface. Shot peening is often called for in aircraft repairs to relieve tensile stresses built up in the grinding process and replace them with beneficial compressive stresses. Usually, peening can increase life-time of parts up to 15%.
Plastic deformation induces a residual compressive stress in a peened surface, along with tensile stress in the interior. Surface compressive stresses confer resistance to metal fatigue and to some forms of corrosion. The tensile stresses deep in the part are not as problematic as tensile stresses on the surface because cracks are less likely to start in the interior.
What I don't know, is whether this process is done before or after the bolt is hardened.
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