Budget Mil/Mil Optics: BSA Tactical, Millett Tactical, or Primary Arms?

Hey all,

Unexpected expenses have hit over the past couple of months and dug into my fun money, but I still need to pick up a starter mil/mil scope.

Right now, I'm looking between these three:

BSA Tactical 4-14x44mm Side Focus

Millett Tactical TRS-1 4-16x50mm Side Focus

Primary Arms 4-14X44 Mil Mil FFP

Granted, all these are low-end, budget affairs, but do any of these three come out as the obvious choice to you experienced guys? The Primary Arms is a bit of an unknown, historically, but they seem to be building a good reputation for price. That, and the FFP is appealing.

To rehash, this will be going on a 5.56 with mix of precision paper punching and coyote/varmint hunting.

Thanks!

Primary arms has decent stuff, not bad glass. I'd say you get more than what you pay for with PA, but I would not use it on anything but a range-only weapon. I have Trijicon and Aimpoint on my defense weapons. PA stuff is pretty good for a budget though, American company but contracts production in China to cut costs.

I can't comment on the other two.

Check out some of the new Weaver/Kaspa scopes that have come onto the market recently. They're not bad for range only scopes for pretty decent prices.

Friend of mind picked up one of the 1.5-6's and one of the 2.5-10's. They're actually pretty decent considering the price point.

(both 200 or less)

I have been looking for an uber-low budget mil/mil/ffp for rimfire. I ordered a primary arms. The first one that showed up was a turd. Virtually no clicks in the elevation turret.

I called and they were prompt to tell me "send it back, we'll send a new one" A couple weeks went by, nothing showed up. I called. "We have nothing in the system for you." It was as if the first call never took place. About a week later from the second call, another scope showed up. This one had mediocre clicks in both windage and elevation... with the elevation turret being egg shaped somewhere. When turning it, it gets easy, then hard, then easy. So something is ob-longed in there.

I haven't had time to test tracking, subtension, or anything yet. I can see through it... and it has a mil reticle. It's small and light weight. I'd rather have enclosed turrets and a better reticle with half mil stadia.

If I compare it to a regular $250 SFP vortex crossfire, this primary arms is a piece of shit. I have no other $250 mil/mil/ffp optics to compare it to. I really wish vortex would put out a mil/mil/ffp in their crossfire line with a Gen II reticle.

For a red dot go with PA if you want magnification go with the millet.

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Originally Posted by Kenneth

For a red dot go with PA if you want magnification go with the millet.

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... my experience with millet has been horrible.

What are you basing this recommendation from?

I have seen them used in 3 gun without much trouble. The ones I saw used were 1-4x though. That may be a factor.

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Originally Posted by Kenneth

I have seen them used in 3 gun without much trouble. The ones I saw used were 1-4x though. That may be a factor.

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I would say it is... when we are talking about magnified optics for precision rifle use, in the precision bolt rifle forum.

How many guys you see running a 3-gun, stop to run their turrets? I've never done it, and I've certainly never seen anyone else do it.

Well since the OP is putting them on a 5.56 for coyote hunting and paper punching I don't think he will have an issue. The turrets will most likely be used to sight in and that's it.

BUT if he wanted to try and rotate turrets for ranges then I wouldn't have confidence in any if those optics.

OP what is your budget? Possible could have a better optic from a different brand. Unless your stuck on those.

What do you think your maximum is in terms of spending on this optic?

I would run away from these offerings, and instead get a fixed power SWFA SS scope with 0.1 mil clicks:

http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-MRAD-Scopes-C4225.aspx

In my experience, the low cost scopes with lots of features (illumination, variable power, adjustable parallax, target turrets, etc.) are a POS.

A fixed 10x for coyote hunting... good luck with that.

I have the BSA scope.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/456...-reticle-matte

I took a chance with the BSA FFP scope because I did not want to spend the money on Vortex Razor or SWFA SS HD 5-20x50 and then find out that I did not like FFP scopes. I like FFP scopes. Currently I have about 250-300 rounds of .308 on the scope. One drop on the concrete, it was resting on the Harris bipod and buttstock and I accedently knocked it over. It landed directly on the windage knob which is now damaged(the knob not the function). I still holds zero. I was putting the rifle and scope in a case when I went to the range, now I just lay rifle in the back of the Tribeca or the H3 when I go to the range. Not handling it with gloves but not abusing it either.

BSA say the it is 4-14 power scope and it seems to work like that but when you go from 12x to 14x you had better be behind the scope perfectly. There is no room for error. The clicks on the dails should be better with exposed turrets but I have not had them turn on me yet. From what I have seen and reaschered this is not a typical P.O.S. BSA scope. I am not claiming that it is Trijicon/SWFA/Nightforce/S&B/Leopold or any other medium to high-end scope. It will get replaced, when the funds become avaible.

For what you are planning on doing with it, it should work just fine.

That's pretty surprising considering how horrible normal BSA scopes are.

One of the things that I looked at was the reviews on midway.com about this scope. 29 reviews with an average 4.4 and 5 being the best and only two reviewers gave it a 1. It was the overall trend that that allowed me to say "sure why not take the chance".

That BSA looks almost identical to the Primary Arms. Same factory in China?

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Originally Posted by Kenneth

OP what is your budget? Possible could have a better optic from a different brand. Unless your stuck on those.

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At the moment, my fun budget is significantly restricted, and I'd like to get into a mil/mil setup to start learning how to shoot precisely ASAP.

Ergo, I'm looking at the rock bottom.

As others have mentioned here and in other places I've posed this question, that fixed 10X SS might be an option, but as a coyote hunting neophyte, would that high of a fixed power be a problem?

If not, I very well may go that route.

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Originally Posted by fury413rb

That BSA looks almost identical to the Primary Arms. Same factory in China?

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I have been wondering about that. It also looks like a British scope, I think it the company is called Falcon. Bodies looked exactly the same but the turrets where different but both where exposed.

An option you haven't mentioned that would be worth looking into would be a Leupold Mark AR:
http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-...tte-black.html
At $349.99 from the first site I looked at, it only slightly more expensive than the Millett. I am sure if you did a little work with your google fu you could find it for less. I know that Leupold will back it up like every other scope they offer. I wouldn't walk away from the BSA, I'd run screaming. I have absolutely no faith in their quality.

Good luck in whatever you choose, but right now you are venturing into the "Penny Wise, Pound Foolish" territory. You might be better off waiting a month or two and getting a better piece of glass.

Take a look at Konus. I know numerous shooters using their spotting scopes and I have one of their M30 rifle scopes. The glass is very good and the warranty is excellent.