Musings on Compact AR's (CQB/Home D/Truck/BoB/etc.)

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Originally Posted by Warp

Logic, this makes absolutely none.

"If I felt like I needed to have a gun for self defense of my castle I would move" would make more sense, actually.

You recognize and admit that you might need a firearm for home defense, but write off the objectively more capable firearm because...why? If you need lethal force to stop an attacker that is in your home you need to stop them right now, why completely write off the tool (shoulder fired rifle/shotgun) that has proven itself time and again to be a superior fight stopper compared to a pistol cartridge'd pistol?

Sure, somebody might be more comfortable, competent, trained, etc with a pistol. Maybe they have reasons they prefer a pistol relating to use with one hand, ability to holster/conceal it, etc, but those are different stories

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No not discounting or writing off anything, as I stated I've got several rifles and access to them. If I knew I had to defend myself tonight and couldn't go elsewhere an M-4 would be my first choice. Everyone needs to do thier own threat assessment based on thier location, crime rate, training, etc. I've just never felt that I needed more gun than I alluded to for my everyday HD weapon.

Stating that if I needed a gun for HD I would move is more logical is not what I said or meant. There is an obligation to protect your family that exceeds the "need". Do not think I am sugesting or telling you what you need, but have explained my needs based on my assessments of my current station in life.

There are times that optimum beats maximum and launching bullets inside a bedroom is one where I'll go with optimum. Different tools. For every scenario that you can come up with that makes a carbine better than a pistol inside a structure, there is one that would would also point to the handgun as the preferred weapon. Have you ever launched 5.56 rounds inside a small structure without ear protection? Ever went through your house at night because of that random bump? Do you have a wife and kids? Like I said we all have to make a decision based on our own assessment.

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Originally Posted by Firefly

I liked this whole post, but that paragraph in particular is speaking to my soul.

OT but part of me wants to dump my pile for a VW Van and just live in the middle of nowhere.

On Topic, YES. When that shotgun went off I was right next to it and felt dizzy and sick. It was indoors. I recovered and pushed on but I attribute a good bit of tinnitus and that was when I had young, fresh 23 yo ears. Think hallway. Ugh.


Someone brought up suppressors. Yeah...no. A 556 suppressor is loud outdoors. It dont get quieter indoors.

Unless you keep peltors by the bed or are counting on auditory exclusion, you are in for a ride.

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~140 db is much, much less loud than 165db and ~140 db (suppressed 5.56) is less loud than unsuppressed-anything (that would be suitable for home defense)

Guns are loud, including G17's, particularly indoors



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Originally Posted by Warp

~140 db is much, much less loud than 165db and ~140 db (suppressed 5.56) is less loud than unsuppressed-anything (that would be suitable for home defense)

Guns are loud, including G17's, particularly indoors



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You obviously draw from a well of personal expertise and a wide breadth of training.

I shall defer to you and your ideas.

Don't overthink this, dudes.

The tool is secondary to either fighting or fleeing.

Beat feet, or pull a trigger until the target changes shape, or catches fire. The end.

I have a 14.5” at for HD. It will be suppressed in a year.

Rifles beat handguns every time in my situation. My job is to keep my wife safe. If we are getting invaded, outside is an unknown, but I have a nice funnel set up by design of the structure.

No I don’t have professional experience, but I’ve shot enough rifles without ear pro to not be surprised by it.
Each situation is unique. I do think size is overrated, just my opinion. I think being outnumbered is still to my advantage based on structure, as I can get hits before they can see me, and n collateral damage is a non-issue.

Know your situation and train and equip accordingly. Having children spread throughout the house changes a lot.

Rifles still win due to control issues IMO, but again, structure plays a role.

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Originally Posted by Firefly

You obviously draw from a well of personal expertise and a wide breadth of training.

I shall defer to you and your ideas.

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If something I have stated is incorrect, by all means, speak up

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Originally Posted by MegademiC

I have a 14.5” at for HD. It will be suppressed in a year.

Rifles beat handguns every time in my situation. My job is to keep my wife safe. If we are getting invaded, outside is an unknown, but I have a nice funnel set up by design of the structure.

No I don’t have professional experience, but I’ve shot enough rifles without ear pro to not be surprised by it.
Each situation is unique. I do think size is overrated, just my opinion. I think being outnumbered is still to my advantage based on structure, as I can get hits before they can see me, and n collateral damage is a non-issue.

Know your situation and train and equip accordingly. Having children spread throughout the house changes a lot.

Rifles still win due to control issues IMO, but again, structure plays a role.

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In my case, I have a funnel ahead of me and an invalid relative behind me, with a second in same position as soon as we finish consolidating households. I *am*--have to be, since even if the house is on fire my mother's too morbidly obese to hoist and flop her ass out the window--as Agent K of the MIB put it "the best, last and only line of defense," have to be the goalkeeper who NOTHING gets past. (In some ways it'd be easier with the GF visiting, since with the spare bedroom across the hall from mine and tossing her the spare gun we'd have interlocking fields of fire down the hallway "funnel.") One of those crappy-ass '50s ramblers that have a garage at one end, bedrooms in a cluster around a short, narrow hallway at the other and only a single john, which makes life suck when two-thirds of the household love playing Craphouse Camper.

I'm majorly hung up on the noise, maneuverability, and readiness condition of the carbine over the pistol for night-time home defense. My G19 with Ameriglo tritiums stays on my person all day and then transitions to my nightstand at bed time, staying in the kydex holster. I've woken up to several "bump in the night" situations and all of them have played out with me lying in bed with my G19 in hand trying to confirm if I actually heard something or if it was a dream that woke me. I've gotten out of bed and done some stealth looking/listening with all the lights still out and once I figure out something isn't going down I ease back to bed.

I don't see that playing out well with any long gun, and the only way to do it properly would be sling-less with a round chambered with a rifle so light it can be held only by the pistol grip while I work my way around using my off hand for tactile guidance on walls/door frames, etc.

Super bright weapon lights? No way. I have a ProTac 1L that I have to trigger the lowest light setting at first. I've accidentally tapped the high beam at 3am in my bedroom with it once and was nearly blind in the dark for 5+ minutes.

I dislike the noise of shooting my 6920 at the indoor range even with solid in-ear plugs and can't imagine how bad that would suck for me and all my family members to experience inside my house. The G19 sounds like a pea shooter at the indoor range, but I have a good cop friend who had a gun fight inside a fast food restaurant with his 9mm Sig many years ago and he wears a hearing aid to this day. The G19 is still going to suck in a house.

I'm not and never was a cop or military, and I've never shot at anyone. However, at this point the AR is a hobby/toy for me. Of course like everyone else I have it for the inevitable Walking Dead doomsday gunfighting I plan to be doing in my rural neighborhood when it goes down but that's a different story.

I'm sort of like Firefly in that I keep considering downsizing and letting all my stuff go except a primary and spare G19 and support gear for them.

Just because you have a rifle available for HD doens’t mean you can’t have a pistol too.

Depends what you do, who you are, where you live. I have had to shoot pigs on my property with zero notice and a limited engagement opportunity. While a methhead was on a home invasion / murder spree this spring within 5 miles of my house, my rifle was primary for quite awhile.

It’s a free country - do what you deem best for you, and live with the consequences of your actions.

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Originally Posted by Outlander Systems

Don't overthink this, dudes.

The tool is secondary to either fighting or fleeing.

Beat feet, or pull a trigger until the target changes shape, or catches fire. The end.

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Originally Posted by RHINOWSO

Just because you have a rifle available for HD doens’t mean you can’t have a pistol too.

Depends what you do, who you are, where you live. I have had to shoot pigs on my property with zero notice and a limited engagement opportunity. While a methhead was on a home invasion / murder spree this spring within 5 miles of my house, my rifle was primary for quite awhile.

It’s a free country - do what you deem best for you, and live with the consequences of your actions.

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Both of these FTW.