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Thread: M&P guys with APEX trigger kits

  1. #1
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    M&P guys with APEX trigger kits

    I've been looking at their kits for a while and wanting to get one for my MP9compact. I do carry it, and after dry firing my friends with the competition kit (with new trigger and all) I wanted to do mine.

    Giving they say don't use the competition trigger kit if you carry, how many do? I would like the pull to be around 4.5 lbs. If I use the kit and the pull is too light can I put stock spring to make the trigger pull heavier? If so which spring?

    My MP9 Pro is getting the competition trigger kit but I don't carry it so it is not a concern.


    Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Djstorm100 View Post
    I've been looking at their kits for a while and wanting to get one for my MP9compact. I do carry it, and after dry firing my friends with the competition kit (with new trigger and all) I wanted to do mine.

    Giving they say don't use the competition trigger kit if you carry, how many do? I would like the pull to be around 4.5 lbs. If I use the kit and the pull is too light can I put stock spring to make the trigger pull heavier? If so which spring?

    My MP9 Pro is getting the competition trigger kit but I don't carry it so it is not a concern.


    Thanks!
    Hey man,

    I think you had PM'd. I'm sorry if you did and I didn't get back to you. I run the trigger kit in one of my M&Ps and I carry it occasionally. I usually carry a Glock 17 or an M&P 9 with the DCAEK kit and RAM.

    I'm not sure if it'll work with the thumb safety or not, but if I continue to carry that one, I'll likely put the thumb safety back in. The trigger feels extremely nice compared to a factory M&P.

    Last edited by jonconsiglio; 03-18-12 at 16:51.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~ Paul Howe

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    I have four M&Ps with the FSS and trigger kits in all of them.
    I just ran the 9MM FS in a class for one day. No issues with lighter triggers (within reason) for me. The gun has a thumb safety, but, with or without a safety, I am the safety. The M&P with FSS, a Walther PPQ or a Glock with a 3.5 pound trigger are all as safe as the operator as far as I am concerned.

    I personally prefer the extra level of safety that a thumb safety allows but I can and have lived without it.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djstorm100 View Post
    I've been looking at their kits for a while and wanting to get one for my MP9compact. I do carry it, and after dry firing my friends with the competition kit (with new trigger and all) I wanted to do mine.

    Giving they say don't use the competition trigger kit if you carry, how many do? I would like the pull to be around 4.5 lbs. If I use the kit and the pull is too light can I put stock spring to make the trigger pull heavier? If so which spring?

    My MP9 Pro is getting the competition trigger kit but I don't carry it so it is not a concern.


    Thanks!
    Do what I do. Go with the DCAEK, get our Polish option and then buy the competition striker spring. This will give you a trigger between 4LBS-4.5LBS.


    C4

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    There seems to be a little variation between pistols, but here is my typical weights with various Apex configurations:

    1) FSST with Apex trigger spring: 4 lbs with essentially zero uptake.
    2) DCAEK with factory trigger spring: 3.5 lbs
    3) DCAEK with Apex trigger Spring: 5 lbs.
    Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.

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    I was looking at the whole trigger sear/ram package I liked the trigger more. I find my self not pushing the trigger sometimes right and the bottom of the trigger safety is getting caught on the frame. I'm a dumbass.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lanesmith View Post
    There seems to be a little variation between pistols, but here is my typical weights with various Apex configurations:

    1) FSST with Apex trigger spring: 4 lbs with essentially zero uptake.
    2) DCAEK with factory trigger spring: 3.5 lbs
    3) DCAEK with Apex trigger Spring: 5 lbs.
    DCAEK is just the spring kit correct? Why would you want to up the trigger LBS to 5lbs. using the apex trigger springs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Djstorm100 View Post
    DCAEK is just the spring kit correct? Why would you want to up the trigger LBS to 5lbs. using the apex trigger springs?
    DCAEK kit involves replacing the striker block, sear, and sear spring with APEX parts. Doing just this gives you a smoother trigger uptake and reduces the weight to release the striker down to about 3-3.5 lbs. However, this is a little lighter than most people/agencies want for duty, so APEX includes a stiffer trigger spring to bring the weight up to about 5 lbs (+/- 1 lb). Their competition kit has a trigger spring that brings the weight up to about 4 lbs.

    FYI, although the Glock "-" connector is supposed to be 3.5 lbs, I've found that the weight is really only cut down to about 4-4.5 lbs in most gen 3 guns (from about 5.5 lbs). The point that I'm making is that 4-5 lbs is rather light for any service pistol, and a true 3.5 lbs is very rare outside of 1911's
    Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lanesmith View Post
    DCAEK kit involves replacing the striker block, sear, and sear spring with APEX parts. Doing just this gives you a smoother trigger uptake and reduces the weight to release the striker down to about 3-3.5 lbs. However, this is a little lighter than most people/agencies want for duty, so APEX includes a stiffer trigger spring to bring the weight up to about 5 lbs (+/- 1 lb). Their competition kit has a trigger spring that brings the weight up to about 4 lbs.

    FYI, although the Glock "-" connector is supposed to be 3.5 lbs, I've found that the weight is really only cut down to about 4-4.5 lbs in most gen 3 guns (from about 5.5 lbs). The point that I'm making is that 4-5 lbs is rather light for any service pistol, and a true 3.5 lbs is very rare outside of 1911's
    So I could get the DCAEK and the comp spring kit (24.99) and play around with the springs a little to get 3.5 lb or use comp spring and get 4lb?

    Also

    could I use the forward set sear and trigger kit and get the Duty Carry spring kit and use those springs to get 4lb trigger?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Djstorm100 View Post
    So I could get the DCAEK and the comp spring kit (24.99) and play around with the springs a little to get 3.5 lb or use comp spring and get 4lb?

    Also

    could I use the forward set sear and trigger kit and get the Duty Carry spring kit and use those springs to get 4lb trigger?
    The DCAEK and Cometition Action Enhancement Kit (CAEK) use the same hard sear and striker block. Thus, you can play with various spring combinations to find your ideal trigger weight. However, I always came back to the straight DCAEK for my weapons. Notice that the CAEK uses a different sear spring, striker spring, and trigger return spring to bring DOWN the trigger pull to 3 lbs or a little less. This full competition kit is actually less trigger weight than the DCAEK with a factory trigger spring (about 3.5 lbs) due to the different striker and sear springs in the competition kit.

    I do not believe the the FSST kit is comparable with DCAEK or CAEK springs since the FSST uses a different sear. I seem to remember that a new trigger return spring was needed for the FSST for reliable function as the factory spring would not work. I would call Apex and talk to Randy or Scott before mixing springs across the FSST and other kits.
    Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by C4IGrant View Post
    Do what I do. Go with the DCAEK, get our Polish option and then buy the competition striker spring. This will give you a trigger between 4LBS-4.5LBS.


    C4
    You have to buy the sear separately to get the polish option correct?

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    I have the Apex FSS-T kit in my fullsize M&P. I had Apex install it, and when I got it back I was shocked at how light the trigger felt. I have a thumb safety on my gun, so I don't worry about carrying it, and now that I've practiced with it, the trigger feels completely normal. I think the pull is around 3.5lbs.

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    I, too, am toying around with the idea of upgrading my stock trigger. I would like a trigger in the 4-5 lb. range that has a smooth, consistent break. I was thinking about just going DCAEK, but it's my understanding that the trigger break is even further back (thus more pre-travel) than the stock trigger. Is this right? Anyone with the DCAEK that can comment if this is a "problem" with shooting for speed/accuracy?

    Also, is the FSS something that should even be considered for a "duty" type weapon (read: for carry, not for competition)?

    I'm really kicking myself in the butt for not shooting Grants M&P at the Vickers class in November!
    (Grant, are you using the FSS or DCAEK in your carry gun?)
    Last edited by Ironman8; 03-19-12 at 10:10.

  14. #14
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    Just the sear alone with a broken in striker spring will yield a 4 to 4.5 pound pull.

    The newer guns with the larger sear springs can be closer to five pounds but a stock gun with a bit of wear, ie compressions on those springs should still come in under five pounds.

    Randy has done an incredible job R&Ding a proper spring weight for his competition striker weight spring as we've had almost ZERO issues with light strikes running these, certainly less than a Glock with a lighter than Factory striker spring. Still, having said this, for the sake of maximum reliability, i think running factory striker springs is the way to go.

    Because of the way the M&P is designed you only feel the striker spring weight during the actual "wall" or "break" fast of the trigger press. Pre travel is unaffected unlike on a Glock.

    IF this were a perfect world i would actually do the following:

    DCAEK heavy trigger return spring
    AEK Competition striker spring
    AEK Competition sear spring
    Hard Sear
    USB

    This combo will yield about a four pound pull with significant resistance in the pre travel to facilitate proper prepping of the trigger. The closer my striker fired pistols feel to a DOA revolver with a short, striker style reset, the happier i am.

    Glass rod breaks are for 1911's and weirdos.

    In a NON perfect world i would test my above setup with all of the above minus the striker spring. Provided we experienced no sear flutter that setup would be in my eyes, safe and adequate for carry purposes right at around 4+ pounds.

    Light triggers are a detriment to control in my eyes so think about this one long and hard.

    Clarification:

    The issues that we have had with the light weight striker springs ONLY occurs with Tula/Wolf 9mm ammunition as this off the shelf brand uses small rifle primers that are exceedingly hard to touch off. All brass cased, commercial ammo has been good to go with the light weight striker springs.
    Last edited by Magsz; 03-19-12 at 10:33.

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    I dropped in just the standard APEX sear when they first came out and put a light polish on the striker engagement face. It made a substantial difference. The trigger smoothed out and the weight dropped to about 4 lbs. Later I put the RAM in, this did make the reset better but when shooting fast I can't really feel the reset on any gun I've shot.
    From Dippoville and stumblin'

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironman8 View Post
    I, too, am toying around with the idea of upgrading my stock trigger. I would like a trigger in the 4-5 lb. range that has a smooth, consistent break. I was thinking about just going DCAEK, but it's my understanding that the trigger break is even further back (thus more pre-travel) than the stock trigger. Is this right? Anyone with the DCAEK that can comment if this is a "problem" with shooting for speed/accuracy?

    Also, is the FSS something that should even be considered for a "duty" type weapon (read: for carry, not for competition)?

    I'm really kicking myself in the butt for not shooting Grants M&P at the Vickers class in November!
    (Grant, are you using the FSS or DCAEK in your carry gun?)
    I would have no issues with using the FSS for CCW, but then again, I am a 1911 guy so I am used to a gun with 3.5LBS trigger and really no safety (as soon as the gun clears the holster).


    C4
    Last edited by C4IGrant; 03-20-12 at 16:18.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magsz View Post
    Just the sear alone with a broken in striker spring will yield a 4 to 4.5 pound pull.

    The newer guns with the larger sear springs can be closer to five pounds but a stock gun with a bit of wear, ie compressions on those springs should still come in under five pounds.

    Randy has done an incredible job R&Ding a proper spring weight for his competition striker weight spring as we've had almost ZERO issues with light strikes running these, certainly less than a Glock with a lighter than Factory striker spring. Still, having said this, for the sake of maximum reliability, i think running factory striker springs is the way to go.

    Because of the way the M&P is designed you only feel the striker spring weight during the actual "wall" or "break" fast of the trigger press. Pre travel is unaffected unlike on a Glock.

    IF this were a perfect world i would actually do the following:

    DCAEK heavy trigger return spring
    AEK Competition striker spring
    AEK Competition sear spring
    Hard Sear
    USB

    This combo will yield about a four pound pull with significant resistance in the pre travel to facilitate proper prepping of the trigger. The closer my striker fired pistols feel to a DOA revolver with a short, striker style reset, the happier i am.

    Glass rod breaks are for 1911's and weirdos.

    In a NON perfect world i would test my above setup with all of the above minus the striker spring. Provided we experienced no sear flutter that setup would be in my eyes, safe and adequate for carry purposes right at around 4+ pounds.

    Light triggers are a detriment to control in my eyes so think about this one long and hard.

    Clarification:

    The issues that we have had with the light weight striker springs ONLY occurs with Tula/Wolf 9mm ammunition as this off the shelf brand uses small rifle primers that are exceedingly hard to touch off. All brass cased, commercial ammo has been good to go with the light weight striker springs.
    Curious about your perfect world scenario. I currently have:
    competition spring kit
    Hard Sear
    USB
    RAM

    in my MP 40 no manual safety. It is pretty light 3.5 lbs but crisp break and with a positive reset. I started thinking about putting the oem trigger reset spring back in to carry it. I wasnt sure how this would affect my weight? Id like to be in the 5 lb realm. Would this serve my purpose or should I just buy the duty spring kit
    Last edited by usnavydoc; 03-21-12 at 16:19. Reason: New info

  18. #18
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    Lots of agencies have a 5 lbs minimum trigger pull weight--this works well on a duty/carry pistol.

    When I carried 1911's, all had an 5-5.5 lbs trigger. My 9mm Glocks use an OEM "-" connecter and stock trigger spring give a 5-5.5 lbs pull measured mid-trigger. My M&P's with Apex Duty Kits give a 5-5.5 lbs trigger pull.

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