National 2 Gun League

[Karl Kasarda]

This is interesting news.

I've been running a two gun match in the Tucson area for years now, and I'm glad to see the idea is getting more traction.

We average 40-50 shooters a month which is quite good for a local venue in southern Arizona.

I'm curious what sort of collaboration potential may exist.

Here's info on what we've been doing:

https://twogunaction.squarespace.com/

We just recently started the Facebook page, so this is fairly light on content but there's a few videos from matches including this month:

https://www.facebook.com/2gACM

[SinistralRifleman]

WUT? What shooting organization has been ruined by being national?

I like my competitions to have as objective of standards as possible so people arnt driving XXX of miles for a unknown set of rules and playing musical chairs with optics and gear. I also like competing in a big pond vs a small one,and comparing your classifiers on a world/national level is better then being the home town hero at the local outlaw match.

Shooting local matches under slightly different rule sets has in no way ever made me feel less prepared for national level matches.

The problem I have with national level rule sets is they often take away creative control from local match directors; sometimes dictating what target types can and can't be used, length of stages, round counts, and disallowing physical challenges or limiting them. Look at the IDPA multi gun rules if you want a shining example of how they can interfere with creativity.

As far as standardizing equipment rules I would agree with that as log as there is always a place for whatever someone shows up to a local match with. Safety rules can also be standardized. Scoring is something that should be determined by the match or stage, sometimes emphasizing pure speed is better sometimes emphasizing accuracy is better.

[Karl Kasarda]

Shooting local matches under slightly different rule sets has in no way ever made me feel less prepared for national level matches.

The problem I have with national level rule sets is they often take away creative control from local match directors; sometimes dictating what target types can and can't be used, length of stages, round counts, and disallowing physical challenges or limiting them. Look at the IDPA multi gun rules if you want a shining example of how they can interfere with creativity.

As far as standardizing equipment rules I would agree with that as log as there is always a place for whatever someone shows up to a local match with. Safety rules can also be standardized. Scoring is something that should be determined by the match or stage, sometimes emphasizing pure speed is better sometimes emphasizing accuracy is better.

I agree whole heartedly.

Standards induce mediocrity and "gaming loopholes". We should standardize on goals, basic fundamentals and ideals, a banner flag, and safety. After that it should be free form to allow for the most creativity and diversity of shooting opportunities to suit the interests of the broadest customer base.

Our match here, for example, is more physically oriented. Some match formats would expressly prohibit that while we find it very rewarding and interesting. Shooters that like that will continue coming to our venue and those that do not could find another alternative venue with a different emphasis but still maintain the fundamental goals that bind us together in a combined effort.

[theblackknight]

The founder is a USPSA shooter, and really dosent shoot IDPA at all if that tells you anything.

I don't think this league will end up shutting down all the outlaw matches anytime soon if at all. Im with you guys on somethings. I like running in matches

One thing I do know is usually when the G-word is uttered, it's by someone who is mad they just seen an action that is clever, unconventional, faster, legal,and something they didnt think of. This person is usually operating on a extended set of rules that they place on themselves and expect other to read their mind and also shoot those rules.

sent from mah gun,using my sights

[Karl Kasarda]

One thing I do know is usually when the G-word is uttered, it's by someone who is mad they just seen an action that is clever, unconventional, faster, legal,and something they didnt think of. This person is usually operating on a extended set of rules that they place on themselves and expect other to read their mind and also shoot those rules.

We can either run matches to test skills and gear or the ability to lawyer stage descriptions and rules.

I prefer the former to the latter.

[nickdrak]

I've always thought 3-gun was way too cost prohibitive for many shooters to be competitive in equipment wise. The typical semi-auto shotty plus all of the shell carriers, etc add about $1500-$3000 to the start-up cost.

Pistol/Rifle 2-gun = AWESOME!

[JBecker 72]

Yes!

[currahee]

Shooting local matches under slightly different rule sets has in no way ever made me feel less prepared for national level matches.

The problem I have with national level rule sets is they often take away creative control from local match directors; sometimes dictating what target types can and can't be used, length of stages, round counts, and disallowing physical challenges or limiting them. Look at the IDPA multi gun rules if you want a shining example of how they can interfere with creativity.

As far as standardizing equipment rules I would agree with that as log as there is always a place for whatever someone shows up to a local match with. Safety rules can also be standardized. Scoring is something that should be determined by the match or stage, sometimes emphasizing pure speed is better sometimes emphasizing accuracy is better.

Exactly.

[theblackknight]

We can either run matches to test skills and gear or the ability to lawyer stage descriptions and rules.

I prefer the former to the latter.

If you think its a either/or issue you should come to more matches. A issue with a start position or how someone loads a pistol is 1% of a match if that considering how many rounds,transitions,movements,reloads etc etc have to be done. If whiners wouldnt whine, the gamers wouldnt have to range lawyer.It's all part of competition,if you want to win, find your fastest way to shoot A's inside of the rule book and stage description.

I think its awesome that given"upon signal, load pistol from table and engage targets as. . . . " can get many different versions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2whtcjNQd2E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vG3YibeB6ro

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7stLQvsDX8

[Karl Kasarda]

Okie dokie.

Anyone whom is interested, please review the websites I posted for the match we've been running for years in this format if you wish to collaborate and push this art forward.

Once again:

https://twogunaction.squarespace.com/

https://www.facebook.com/2gACM

Our contact information is readily available.

Thanks, good to see some evolution in the shooting sports.