E-Lander magazines

[Iraqgunz]

Honestly, I am not going to argue my points back and forth. People can do what they want. If people can't make their own decisions about what to buy, I am not going to force them.

I didn't discover the 2nd Amendment last year, I have been practicing it for almost 28 years.

Grant and others warned people that there was going to be a crunch and now we are seeing it.

I am guilty as well. I should have bought alot more ammo, but alas the few thousand that I have will have to do me until the market settles.

Do you believe people who got into the platform this year should have acquired as many magazines as they would need to feel comfortable with should there be an AWB /magazine restriction before buying a sling, light, or optic/BUIS?

I mean...hindsight is 20/20, nobody seemed to think an AWB/mag restriction had a snowball's chance in hell until the middle of December, and then it became a little uncertain (depending on who you asked)

[RogerinTPA]

Warp, we in M4C have always valued quality, durability and efficiency. In guns, gear and training. We like to get gear we can bet our lives on, right out of the package. There are always alternatives. Hell I got 10 Lancers in the mail a few weeks ago for $20 bucks a piece and really don't need them. I did it to see if I could find available mags online since everyone who failed to plan was crying about prices. They (Lancer) kept their word on backorders and at the same price. I'd rather deal with a quality company like Lancer who kept their word than an unknown company with a questionable product and doubtful word. Get on a few back order lists, be patient and wait or...not. The slow train of industry is catching up with production. I can understand the panic mentality, but it's been said before, if people didn't see this shit storm coming, they've been in a coma.

[Warp]

Warp, we in M4C have always valued quality, durability and efficiency. In guns, gear and training. We like to get gear we can bet our lives on, right out of the package. There are always alternatives. Hell I got 10 Lancers in the mail a few weeks ago for $20 bucks a piece and really don't need them. I did it to see if I could find available mags online since everyone who failed to plan was crying about prices. They (Lancer) kept their word on backorders and at the same price. I'd rather deal with a quality company like Lancer who kept their word than an unknown company with a questionable product and doubtful word. Get on a few back order lists, be patient and wait or...not. The slow train of industry is catching up with production. I can understand the panic mentality, but it's been said before, if people didn't see this shit storm coming, they've been in a coma.

That's a sweet deal with the lancers.

The only other backorder list I"m on is Brownells, but I'm not holding my breathe there either. Should've gone with DSG arms holiday pack too, I guess.

I'm being patient and waiting. I personally am not THAT hard off for mags. I have 8 NHMTG 20 rounders, 8 NHMTG 30 rounders, and 16 total 30 round PMAGs with, supposedly, 3 more on the way as we speak + another 2 pending with AIM. I just want more, and I'm not willing to pay over $20 a mag for any of them. And as I said above I don't trust CONgress enough to be comfortable waiting another 2 months on Brownells.

I'll probably go order some more 30 rounder NHMTG mags from Buffer Tech now. Should probably cancel the mako order and just order 4 or 5 of them with that money...but I do want to try these e-lander mags. I may be way off but I do think a brief bit with the file (or not, I'm so far down the list they may have updated them?) and they'll be just fine.

[Grand58742]

Never did really get the chance to reply to this.

It's not about hate. It's about accountability. The mistakes should have been caught prior to the first one being sold through R&D and quality control. I'm willing to give any manufacturer a chance, but when they sell defective products right off the bat, no one here or anyone who spent their hard earned cash, will appreciate it. Claiming that they are USGI quality when it appears that they just looked at the cosmetics or look of the mag, rather than the function, which we'd all agree, is far more important.

I can more or less agree. However, do I think they just slapped something pretty together and shipped it off without testing it? I'll give them the benefit of the doubt when they say it was tested on the rifles they had. And I'll give them the benefit of the doubt when they said they were built to spec and worked flawlessly in those Colt rifles. I've got no reason to doubt them and they have realized the errors made and supposedly are going to make the changes. And from the reports, these are hit and miss in just about everything else on the planet. But do I think they were just blowing smoke when they said they were tested? No, I doubt they could get away with that.

So I'll say they probably did do testing in good conscience and those rifles they had might have worked perfectly. Lot of maybe there, but I wouldn't think they would have knowingly shipped out bad products then turned around and started making changes when the consumer started into an uproar.

They should have worked the bugs out/wrung them out, even given a few hundred out to T&E on gun forums or professionals trainers so real users could provide feedback (much like most quality manufacturers do), PRIOR to marketing them to the general public.

See above...and the timing could have been better I agree. And maybe they felt the testing they did was sufficient. Probably not in retrospect. However, nobody could have foreseen the disaster in December. And since they had them "in stock and shipping" everyone started grabbing what they could not really giving a chance for a formal testing cycle in the courses, with gun rag writers, SMEs and with end users. From the back posts on TOS, they were released around the second week in November time frame which gave them a little over a month before the craziness started. And then problems started cropping up. They did try to ignore them a week or two, but all the sudden we started seeing "fixes" being "worked" from the rep. So my guess is, voices were heard and they decided to fix them on the fly.

In normal times, these probably wouldn't have sold quite as quickly and maybe had a better chance for more T&E on the user end. Same problems would have come up and maybe they would have fixed them. But let's face facts here, the timing on the release sucked. Or conditions out of their hands forced this situation and didn't give the opportunity for a proper evaluation in the long run.

Charging customers CCs without having product in hand, unless clearly stated, is not a feather in their cap.

Actually, on their site it did say the card would be charged at the time of processing. So those bitching about getting charged up front knew very well they were getting charged up front as well as the estimated shipping times which were and are in big red font on the pages themselves.

Might not be the best way of doing business, but everyone knew their cards were going to get charged. So I hold no pity for them when they want to complain about getting charged up front and/or the shipping times. They knew and still hit the submit button. And if they didn't take the time to read the big red print on the product page or the instructions on the order page, forgive me, but sucks to be them.

Fixing them after the fact by coming out with more refined products, when their mistakes are found out by consumers, while commendable, is not a smart way of doing business. By not doing so, they may have sealed their fate if they don't stand by their product and start replacing all those defective mags they sold, free of charge.

Again, in normal times, I would tend to agree. However, we are not in normal times. And the fact they are attempting to make fixes instead of continuing to produce a product of dubious quality in this market says something. They could have said "screw it, they are selling like hot cakes so continue to sell what we have and we'll make changes when the panic dies down." But they are attempting to fix it and rightfully so. They are fighting for a spot in the US market right now and this is make or break time for them. Between the idiots in Congress making a racket about high capacity bans and what happened over the past year, they have been thrust into the limelight. They HAVE to make this right in order to stay in the market...and be seen publicly responding to consumer demands.

As to replacing magazines, I can't say. So far they have been pretty good about replacing those that needed it from the reports over on TOS. I would tend to think it would be a consideration depending on the wear and tear of the mag in question. But see above, they have to be seen as a company that stands by it's products and my guess is they might offer a one for one swap when the time comes around.

You want an honest opinion? I'd be willing to bet half these mags will end up in a box in the closet or drawer in the basement and never see the light of day again. People bought them in a panic and because they could, not because they needed them...same for me. So as for replacement, I could see less than half the defective ones returned.

Forgive me if I came off harsh at you, but far too often I see on here a new product and people bashing it without any good reason or first hand knowledge. "Well, I KNOW they SUCK because I just KNOW!" and others jumping on the bandwagon because "I HEARD it from a FRIEND/READ a post on the INTERNET who said they SUCKED!" Overall, you look at this from a negative standpoint, the first iteration sucked and thus, all will probably suck and you won't do business with them.

I look at it from a semi-positive aspect. First iteration sucked, but they are attempting to fix it during a time which they very well could ignore the consumer and continue to sell to those that don't know any better. And let's face it, sales have not slowed even with the supposed problems. So they very well could have ignored the end market, but decided to get them right. Smart to be doing it right now? Yes and no. But the fact they are doing it impresses me. I'll stick around through the next batch and see what fixes are made. And as stated before, I can Dremel them out and/or resell them since they will keep their $18 value for the most part.

Different sides of the coin.

[Grand58742]

I am guilty as well. I should have bought alot more ammo, but alas the few thousand that I have will have to do me until the market settles.

As we all are. I recall a couple of days after Sandy Hook looking at some Prvi .223 75 grain match on SGAmmo and saying "$450 for a case! That's CRAZY!" Or the $280 cases of M193 spec back six months or so ago.

And should have tripped over myself grabbing my wallet when I could.

[usmcvet]

That's a sweet deal with the lancers.

The only other backorder list I"m on is Brownells, but I'm not holding my breathe there either. Should've gone with DSG arms holiday pack too, I guess.

I'm being patient and waiting. I personally am not THAT hard off for mags. I have 8 NHMTG 20 rounders, 8 NHMTG 30 rounders, and 16 total 30 round PMAGs with, supposedly, 3 more on the way as we speak + another 2 pending with AIM. I just want more, and I'm not willing to pay over $20 a mag for any of them. And as I said above I don't trust CONgress enough to be comfortable waiting another 2 months on Brownells.

I'll probably go order some more 30 rounder NHMTG mags from Buffer Tech now. Should probably cancel the mako order and just order 4 or 5 of them with that money...but I do want to try these e-lander mags. I may be way off but I do think a brief bit with the file (or not, I'm so far down the list they may have updated them?) and they'll be just fine.

Cancel the order. If you want 6 for what they cost me PM me. Mine never came out of the wrapper!

I ordered after reading a post on FB I think from Jerking The Trigger announcing Mako had a huge quantity in stock and they were shipping and not raising prices. There were no reviews at the time. BUT! Stickman warned us to be-careful.

[Warp]

Cancel the order. If you want 6 for what they cost me PM me. Mine never came out of the wrapper!

I ordered after reading a post on FB I think from Jerking The Trigger announcing Mako had a huge quantity in stock and they were shipping and not raising prices. There were no reviews at the time. BUT! Stickman warned us to be-careful.

My order is less, I think I used more coupon codes than you did.

[slamd095]

I was one of those that jumped on board fairly quickly about buying those. After reading some of the comments, and one in particular I canned my order. This thought alone, "if you were fighting for your life or your family's life, or your partners or squads, would you trust that magazine?"

Granted it would have been field tested etc. Still....No...I wouldn't.

[usmcvet]

My order is less, I think I used more coupon codes than you did.

Fair enough.

I was one of those that jumped on board fairly quickly about buying those. After reading some of the comments, and one in particular I canned my order. This thought alone, "if you were fighting for your life or your family's life, or your partners or squads, would you trust that magazine?"

Granted it would have been field tested etc. Still....No...I wouldn't.

That's the question we each need to answer. They are what they are. I would not do it again.

[RMiller]

People there are mags out there, they didn't halt production. Back order or sign up for email notifications. Quality mags can be had for $30 and less.

For example, I found 30rd NHMGT mags with magpul followers for $24 last night. In stock. They are shipping this morning.

There are proven mags made by contractors that I KNOW will work, are in spec, and I don't have to screw with. I don't have "range mags". I use what I would feel comfortable using in a confrontation ALL the time.

I don't reward mediocre products.

The mag catches weren't the only issue with one of my friends Elanders. The actual mag body seemed slightly out of spec and actually had to be stripped from the mag well.