Training or Techniques for protecting Family/Friends

[ToddG]

I think key point #1 is that you have to at least talk to your spouse and other close family members about these things. Start with non-violent catastrophes in the home things (what to do if there's a fire; what to do if there's an earthquake/tornado/flood). Once the family is in the mindset of "staying safe in the face of danger," you can take the next step of discussing a break-in. Once everyone is cool with that, talk about how things should work if you're out and about.

I consider myself very lucky that my wife has been through four pistol classes and has a couple days worth of Simunition training hiding somewhere in the back of her mind behind the latest episode of Rachel Ray and homemade greeting card designs. In fact, my wife is a completely different person when she's threatened ... something I never realized until the first time I used her as a role-player and she surprised everyone by being a ruthless, violent, foul-mouthed little girl. I was so proud.

Walking around with my wife is like driving with my wife ... my behavior changes. There are stupid things I've been known to do while driving that I wouldn't do with her in the car because I wouldn't risk her getting hurt. There are places I've been that I'd never bring my wife. There have been times I've left an area or situation because she was with me.

Does anyone remember the Secret Service guy who got into a gunfight off-duty at a mall last year? He was there with his family. His wife, when the shooting happened, pretty much froze according to folks at the Service who told me the story. His daughter (I want to say she was pre-teen) grabbed her little brother, dragged him behind a big garbage can, threw him to the ground, jumped on top of him to protect him, and then called 911 to let them know her daddy was a cop and he was in a fight. That's just frakking awesome ...

[John_Wayne777]

Damn brother!

Can I get an AMEN? Preach on it!

'twas a bit of a rant, looking back upon it now....

It's just always been a pet peeve of mine to see people who are supposed to be adults who can't seem to figure out that flashing blue lights and police running around with drawn weapons means that if you ain't wearing a badge and body armor that you had best haul a$$....

But instead I've actually witnessed with my own two eyes multiple occasions when police officers were doing exactly that and stupid MFers have actually been OFFENDED when an officer looked at them and said in a stern tone "GET THE F**K OUT OF HERE."

"Well he didn't have to be so mean!!"

Ya, lady...he was only trying to get you a safe distance from a developing threat. We should horse-whip him in the town square for his insolence.

P.S. Don't dumb people like that piss you off?

To no end. If something bad is happening and you aren't equipped to deal with it or don't have the authority to deal with it, the best thing you can do for EVERYBODY is get out of the way of the 1st responders. If you can see that they need help, help, but for God's sake it ain't a friggin' spectator sport.

This same inertia is what I've seen in friends and family on the few occasions when I've been trying to act in their interest. They are oblivious, and then when you're trying to make the urgency of the situation known, they become incredulous at the tone you are taking.

Meanwhile Osama Bin Laden himself could be setting the timer on a nuclear bomb ten feet away (maybe the combination of BO and goat smell would tip them off at ten feet) and they'll be oblivious to anything but the fact that you yelled at them.

...and it ain't just women, either. Most of the people I am ranting about are MEN. There are guys who ask me why I never invite them to go to something like a Vickers course with me.

Part of the reason is because they wouldn't ever put the money down to do something like that....the main reason, however, is that I know they can't handle taking instruction from somebody who knows more than they do, not even if the guy is a bona-fide Special Forces superman. They're perfectly lovely people in most respects but they're also the kind of people who think that a Marine DI yelling at the kids who show up at Paris Island is just barbaric.

"It puts them under so much stress!"

They just don't get it, and short of God Himself hitting them on the nose with a rolled up newspaper and telling them to cut that crap out in a Divine "You shoulda paid more attention in school!" moment, they never will.

Darn...I've gone and ranted again.

[John_Wayne777]

That's just frakking awesome ...

That's kind of what I'm talking about....it seems to my untrained, unprofessional, didn't even stay at the motel 6 last night self that some people are just born with a cool head and the ability to make the right calls under pressure. You can see it in all sorts of professions and walks of life.

Medicine is a good example. There are people walking around hospitals every day charged with patient care who come apart at the seems if somebody codes on them....I mean they freak right the hell out. There are others who want to play lookie loo and see what's going on....

Then, thankfully, there are some folks who have the mental preparation and training necessary to bring order to the chaos and actually attempt to do the patient some good. The freakouts and the in-the-way lookie-loos have the same certifications and get paid the same money, but they can't handle a critical incident to save their life, much less anyone else's.

[John_Wayne777]

"Sheeple Inertia" - do you mind if I use that term?

By all means.

And it serves another useful purpose....when somebody is exhibiting this behavior and it angers you to the point where you are ready to cuss a blue streak at them, just draw a deep breath, look them in the eye, and with all your might exclaim:

"BAAA-AAAA-AAAA-AAAA-AAAA-AAAA"

Which pretty much sums up how you are feeling without verbalizing it in such a way that you can get hauled before a supervisor for swearing profusely at a member of the public.

[RD62]

I remember on more than one occasion, some Joe Smoe pulling up or walking up during a felony car stop or similar, to ask directions or some other nonsense. It's like HELLO, bright flashing blue lights, guns, big boy voices, did you not see whats going on??? Wait over there and I'll be with you after this fight/arrest/whatever is over.... Homeowners/business owners who want to follow/lead you through the clearing of their house/store/office.... I have the gun and body armor, but after you... I've had to knock and or kick doors open to get residents out of an apartment building fire.... There were a dozen fire engines and patrol cars with sirens and flashing lights, smoke, flames, news choppers... What the hell people, Judge Joe Brown can wait! get the F^&*% out! It goes on... And I wasn't even in LE THAT long!


-RD62

[Hootiewho]

I appreciate the good feedback and would like more; especially on habits and tactics.

examples:
- When you and your girl are in a populated area maybe going around corners/buildings first, so that she is not subject to being grabbed by a mugger waiting in a blind spot.

-Keeping her or your children on your support side when walking.

-Going back to good ol' chivalry, and making sure you open the car door for her or your kids, especially in large parking areas at night, so as you don't end up in a situation where you jump in first and someone in hiding runs out and grabs here before she can get into the car; also maybe in real bad areas, hitting the lock on the remote until you can get around to your side to prevent anyone from jumping in with here, or with the both of you.

-In traffic, if you run into a situation where you are assaulted either by another vehicle (road rage) or by a pedestrian (car jacking), maybe have a code word for her or whoever is in the car with you to hit the seat recline and lay back to get out of the way, keep from getting shot, or having glass debris blown in her face.

Do you guys have any thoughs on other situations not covered?

Thanks Again

[Barry in IN]

We train for one on one engagements, but how often do we take into account having a spouse, child, or friend with us at the time of use of deadly force?

I'm a stay-home dad, so I pretty much expect that if I am involved in anything, I will have at least one kid with me.
Therefore, by extension, I expect to be shooting one-handed or "wrong"-handed. If it isn't as a result of the fight, it's from pulling/pushing/dragging the kid(s) clear.

So I try to do more one hand/weak-hand practice than I used to.

That's a start, but doesn't fully replicate dragging a screaming pre-schooler along while trying to shoot.
I shoot in the woods on our property, and I've thought about dragging a fallen limb around with one hand while shooting. Maybe I should take the dog and tie him to my wrist. That would cause a struggle.

While on the subject...
Most of us are probably in the habit of locating all the exits in restaurants and businesses when we enter.
But what about your family? Do they?
The fact that we located the exits is nice, but just in case something should happen while we are seperated (like if one of us goes to the restroom), my wife and I quiz our kids on exits when we sit down. The 4 y.o. still thinks it's a fun game like I Spy, but the 8 y.o. is getting bored with it (Yes, Dad, I know there is usually an exit through the kitchen of the restaurant), but at least she knows to check now. It's one thing we know we did right.