HELP! Problems with the Better-Mag 22 Adapter

[spdldr]

Thanks jandbj. I would like to add a little more. If you go to the Redi-Mag web site and then the Better Mag section you can find some very clear illustrations in the photos section. The upper right picture shows very clearly how the Better Mag catch interfaces with the rifle catch.

If you assemble it as shown, it should fix your problem.

[Badger89]

Thanks jandbj. I would like to add a little more. If you go to the Redi-Mag web site and then the Better Mag section you can find some very clear illustrations in the photos section. The upper right picture shows very clearly how the Better Mag catch interfaces with the rifle catch.

If you assemble it as shown, it should fix your problem.

Thank you for the replies jandbj and spdldr. Mine did come with instructions and I followed them for the installation. It is installed as shown in the photos on the Redi-Mag site.

Im going to clean it up and hopefully have time for round 2 this weekend. I was wondering if it needed some time to wear in, which is why I asked if anyone else had experienced this issue. If the issues persist with the next range trip Ill contact Redi-Mag... maybe something's slightly out of spec. Ill update this thread afterward.

[spdldr]

Badger,

Check the top rear of the aluminum adaptor for marks made by the front of the bolt. If there are marks there we can help you. The unit may be going up too far due to a dimensional variation and we have a solution for that. Call us at 1 800 477 3244 between 7 and 3 Pacific Time and we can send you at no charge a special part that will keep the unit down where it should be.

I apologize for your frustrating problem!

[Badger89]

Badger,

Check the top rear of the aluminum adaptor for marks made by the front of the bolt. If there are marks there we can help you. The unit may be going up too far due to a dimensional variation and we have a solution for that. Call us at 1 800 477 3244 between 7 and 3 Pacific Time and we can send you at no charge a special part that will keep the unit down where it should be.

I apologize for your frustrating problem!

I examined the unit and could not find any marks on it that would suggest any contact by the bolt. The rear portion is rock solid when installed so I dont think its riding up too high. The front of the unit has a little up and down play but I dont think this has had any adverse affect on operation, to my knowledge. Overall the adapter is a very snug fit in my receiver, usually requiring a bit of persuasion to install or remove, but I believe that is caused by my receiver, as mags are quite snug as well.

I cleaned and degreased the entire unit today, and re-lubed it with a thinner, lighter oil. I'll see if that makes a difference. Not sure if I'll have time to get out to the range again this weekend or not. When I do I'll report back. Thanks for your help.

[Badger89]

I managed to get back out to the range today and fire another 100 rounds through my CMMG .22LR Upper receiver, mated to my 5.56 lower with the Redi-Mag S&W .22 Rimfire Magazine Adapter installed using S&W M&P 15-22 magazines. Performance worsened. The adapter malfunctioned at least 6 times on the first 25 round magazine (I lost count), and 5 times on the second 25 round magazine. The malfunctions are the same as before, the adapter is locking the bolt to the rear with a partially full magazine, creating a FTFe scenario where the bolt catch must be hit or the charging handle cycled in order to chamber the next round.

I should note that although its a fairly small sample size, the issues seem to have worsened with the use of a lighter lubricant. For those that wonder, the first time when I had a failure rate of 8/100, or 0.08, I was using Mobile 1 5w30 as my lubricant. Although this has always performed excellent for me in the past, I picked up a can of Breakfree CLP to try instead. After cleaning and degreasing the adapter, the bolt, and the rest of the firearm with mineral spirits, I applied a generous amount of CLP (which I greatly dislike compared to Mobile 1 FWIW... crap runs all over the place) and reassembled the gun. Today's range trip using the CLP instead of Mobile 1 yielded a failure rate of 11+/50, or 0.22 +, malfunctioning nearly 3 times more often. But I digress... Back on topic.

After firing the first two magazines I removed the steel part of the adapter. I don't know it's technical name so I'm going to call it the bolt catch actuator. With the bolt catch actuator removed, but the aluminum adapter body still installed in the magwell, I fired two more magazines for a total of 50 additional rounds. No malfunctions. Zip, zilch, zero, nada. The gun burned through each 25 round mag like clockwork with no stoppages, although each magazine ended with a "click" of the hammer dropping on an empty chamber rather than bolt being locked back on empty. Obviously, that is to be expected when you remove the piece that is supposed to lock the bolt back on an empty mag, so I'm not considering it a malfunction. Because of these findings, I believe I have the problem narrowed down to the bolt catch actuator, and I have contacted Redi-Mag by email and am awaiting their reply.

[Lopro619]

I had a similar problem with just trying to dry cycle the bolt when I tried to switch lowers. I troubleshot the problem as to being the bolt release lever was too thick and would cause it to hang up. The thickness of the bolt catch didn't allow the lever to fully manipulate the bolt catch actuator piece. Try and put the setup in a different lower, or try a new bolt catch and see if that helps you out.

[spdldr]

Badger,

Here is another idea. Since it works with the aluminum base only, the steel Better-Mag catch must be above the aluminum when the magazine still has rounds to catch the bolt when you do not want it to. It could be binding on the aluminum, which is unlikely, and not going down far enough. A more likely possibility is that your rifle bolt catch is holding it up so that it interferes with the .22 bolt during normal cycling.

To test this, use this procedure which can be done at home. Put the entire unit properly in the rifle according to our instructions. Then put two empty cartridge cases in your S&W .22 magazine. (for safety reasons) Lock the "loaded" magazine into the rifle normally. Have excellent lighting and possibly magnification and pull the bolt back all the way and hold it while you check to see if the Better-Mag steel catch is above the aluminum adapter block.

The top of the Better-Mag steel catch must not be above the aluminum when you do the above. If it is, something is holding it up. Possibly your rifle bolt catch has a thicker than normal "tail". This is the part that the 5.56 magazines push up when empty. Possibly something is holding up the rifle bolt catch partially. (a BAD lever contacting the upper?)

I doubt that a weak bolt catch spring would be the problem, as it would then do the same when you were shooting 5.56.

[Badger89]

I had a similar problem with just trying to dry cycle the bolt when I tried to switch lowers. I troubleshot the problem as to being the bolt release lever was too thick and would cause it to hang up. The thickness of the bolt catch didn't allow the lever to fully manipulate the bolt catch actuator piece. Try and put the setup in a different lower, or try a new bolt catch and see if that helps you out.

I appreciate your input, unfortunately I have neither another lower assembly or another bolt catch to try at the moment. I am using a Seekins SP15 forged lower and a LPK from White Oak Armament.

I'm trying to wrap my head around what you are describing... I'm assuming when you say "the bolt release lever was too thick" you are referring to the internal portion of the bolt catch, not the actual release lever (a.k.a. the "ping pong paddle") on the outside. I don't see how that part being too thick would affect the operation of the adapter, since the standard bolt catch doesn't actually contact the .22LR bolt, the steel part of the adapter does.

I'm looking at mine right now. With the bolt catch actuator part of the adapter unit fully depressed (as it should be with no mag inserted, or with a full/part full mag inserted) there is a small gap on either side of the actual bolt catch (top and bottom. As I manually move the bolt catch actuator upward (as the magazine would do after the final round has been chambered) it moves freely upward approximately 1mm before contacting the actual bolt catch. Once it contacts the bolt catch it remains in contact for the remainder of the upward travel until it stops. Going in the other direction, the bolt catch (still in contact with the actuator) pulls the bolt catch actuator downward under spring tension until the bolt catch bottoms out. At this point I can manually depress the bolt catch actuator that remaining 1mm before it bottoms out in the aluminum housing of the adapter.

My only theory is that firing the gun somehow jars the adapter enough for the bolt catch actuator to jump up that 1mm of free play during cycling, and occasionally catches the bolt. I'm not very confident in this theory though, since that free play distance only allows to bolt catch actuator to ride a hair higher that the aluminum adapter body itself, with probably only half of that free travel distance being below the top of the aluminum housing. But I guess I don't know how tight the tolerances are in there with everything closed up, maybe half a millimeter is enough?

Does anyone else have any guesses as to what might be going on?

[steyrman13]

My only theory is that firing the gun somehow jars the adapter enough for the bolt catch actuator to jump up that 1mm of free play during cycling, and occasionally catches the bolt. I'm not very confident in this theory though, since that free play distance only allows to bolt catch actuator to ride a hair higher that the aluminum adapter body itself, with probably only half of that free travel distance being below the top of the aluminum housing. But I guess I don't know how tight the tolerances are in there with everything closed up, maybe half a millimeter is enough?

Does anyone else have any guesses as to what might be going on?

Have you tried the manufacturer's suggestions above this post? You may have been typing as they responded. It sounds as if the part they refer to is stocking above the aluminum although it is minute.

[Badger89]

Badger,

Here is another idea. Since it works with the aluminum base only, the steel Better-Mag catch must be above the aluminum when the magazine still has rounds to catch the bolt when you do not want it to. It could be binding on the aluminum, which is unlikely, and not going down far enough. A more likely possibility is that your rifle bolt catch is holding it up so that it interferes with the .22 bolt during normal cycling.

Yes, the Better-Mag catch does ride about 1/2 mm above the aluminum, at its maximum "free travel" before it contacts the standard bolt catch, as I described in my reply to Lopro619. I do not think the bolt catch is holding it up because of this free play area. It does not actually contact the rifle's bolt catch until it has risen above the aluminum housing.

To test this, use this procedure which can be done at home. Put the entire unit properly in the rifle according to our instructions. Then put two empty cartridge cases in your S&W .22 magazine. (for safety reasons) Lock the "loaded" magazine into the rifle normally. Have excellent lighting and possibly magnification and pull the bolt back all the way and hold it while you check to see if the Better-Mag steel catch is above the aluminum adapter block.

The top of the Better-Mag steel catch must not be above the aluminum when you do the above. If it is, something is holding it up. Possibly your rifle bolt catch has a thicker than normal "tail". This is the part that the 5.56 magazines push up when empty. Possibly something is holding up the rifle bolt catch partially. (a BAD lever contacting the upper?)

I doubt that a weak bolt catch spring would be the problem, as it would then do the same when you were shooting 5.56.

I will test this now. I don't run a BAD lever, and in full disclosure I have not fired this lower with a 5.56 upper yet.