Buy Em Cheap and Stack em Deep

[Warp]

Take my OP + http://palmettostatearmory.com/index...2-profile.html


Then you can order 10 Mags, a TR25 and a few boxes of ammo and still be under $1000.

Not bad.

[Plasman]

This deal is good for those in at-risk states who don't know how to put together a complete lower. For those that do, I don't really think this is that great (stripped lowers are going for $70-$100 almost every week now!). For the same price you can build something with better parts (like an ALG QMS trigger and actual milspec RE w/ H buffer).

[ra2bach]

This is the kind of shit I am talking about.

Some people on this site get the rooks and novies all worked up over what ammounts to bullshit, and then they are running around worrying about insignificant shit, when they should be focused on learning to shoot and improving their skills.

Its like an episode of the twighlight zone.

actually this isn't bullshit. there is a difference in products that matter to people who need the best because their lives or the lives of others depend on it. if you look at the founding goals/principles of this site, that is what the mission is here. other sites may have other focuses, such as, hunting, gaming, sporting use of an AR. there is nothing wrong with that as far as that goes. but it's wrong to say one is the same as another...

now, to the RE in question, it says Mil Spec Diameter, no mention of the material used and they do have RE with both materials available... to most people the diameter is the critical component as it determines the type of stock. all in all, we are talking about a budget build, using a blem lower and I would not be surprised if the RE is one of their 6061 as it fits the cost model.

however, I don't think it's misleading as no claims of excellence are made and regardless of the material, 6061 will be a serviceable piece for 99.99% of the people out there in all their uses. and for the .01% that need the better product, they probably won't be looking at $199 complete lowers anyway.

the problem I have with this discussion, is that someone has guaranteed (assumed) that the RE is shit and is basically accusing PSA of underhanded dealing. there's a reason this Complete Blem Lower is $199 other people's are $350. caveat emptor...

[TurretGunner]

I too have been on gun forums since the 90's. From my experience, what people THINK they know and what they ACTUALLY know are two different things (as they were never directly involved in any of the conversations).

For me personally, I am and have been friends with Paul (owner of BCM). There is no more trustworthy, honest guy in the firearms industry than him. NONE! So ya, I like to see his company do well and fully support him. If that makes me a "fan boy" or "brand pusher," I will wear that title with pleasure!

I also stock Colt, DD, S&W, Noveske, KAC and LMT AR's. Could I stock other brands of AR's? Yes. By monday, I could have a shelf full of DPMS, BM, RRA, Oly, etc. I CHOOSE not to though. Why? Because at the end of the day, their products are just a little bit cheaper than the quality AR's so why bother with the hassle of returns, broken parts or guns not running?? As they say, "Juice is not worth the squeeze."

At the end of the day, we all like what we like and that is just fine with me.


C4

Grant, I understand where you are coming from. Historicaly, the price between BM/DPMS and companies like colt, early LMT, Early BCM were about the same. In that case there is no comparison.

We have been fortunate to have alot of newer companies come out who do not make AR's the old way. We have options now. There are good products at all price points.

I have seen too many of these "garbage brands" that certian people here bash, run... and run well. Just beacuse it does not have BCM or DD or a pony on the side of it, doesn't mean it's a POS.

It used to be that we evaluate a product, then grade it. Now, people look at a compnany or even a price point, and have their mind made up before they even see the product.

Can you honestly tell me that a new shooter with limited funds and somone who just wants to learn to shoot, needs to go out and buy a $1500 BCM or DD rifle, when they can get a quality, lower priced brand.

I have spent alot of money with you over the years grant. In fact you, build me a couple uppers when I was still in Iraq in 2005. The problem is you only recomend products that you sell, and tend to demonize those you don't. Anyone who has been on the board for more than a few months can see this.

Back to the whole point of this thread was to let people who want to buy a few or a bunch of realitive inexpesnive, YET SERVICEABLE lowers have a stab before they sell out.

My go to guns are KAC. That doesn't mean I have any sort of issue picking up a PSA or Spikes rifle and shooting the piss out of it.

[LostinKY]

....

When you can build a rifle with good parts for around. $700-800,

...."good" is subjective and that is where we start the pissing contest as to what is "good enough" and "good as".

Those that have a desire for home owner quality subjectively believe that their economy weapons is GTG.
Most on this sight prefer combat ready weapons and objectively pick the weapons in the upper price range.

In both of these situations, knowledge is power, not emotion or lack of waiting and saving 1K worth of ammo to get a truly better weapon!

[TurretGunner]

This deal is good for those in at-risk states who don't know how to put together a complete lower. For those that do, I don't really think this is that great (stripped lowers are going for $70-$100 almost every week now!). For the same price you can build something with better parts (like an ALG QMS trigger and actual milspec RE w/ H buffer).

Price out a lower, good LPK, Tube/spring/buffer, MOE stock, MOE Grip and MOE TG and let me know how that works. The fact that it's already built and ready to go is just icing on the cake.

No shit u can build a better lower, but thats not the point of one thats $199, ready to rock.

[TurretGunner]

...."good" is subjective and that is where we start the pissing contest as to what is "good enough" and "good as".

Those that have a desire for home owner quality subjectively believe that their economy weapons is GTG.
Most on this sight prefer combat ready weapons and objectively pick the weapons in the upper price range.

In both of these situations, knowledge is power, not emotion or lack of waiting and saving 1K worth of ammo to get a truly better weapon!

Combat weapons? Are we a little high on our horse now. What exactly is a combat weapon? One of my combat weapon's (used in combat) was a piece of shit H&R m16A2 that had more miles on it than jenna jamson. It was a malfunction machine, and the only way I was able to get it replaced, was by smashing the barrel on the side of a 5 ton.

The snobbery around here is sickening. People seem to have this illusion that if they hang around a website that LAV, Haley, Pat Rodgers use, they are somehow an equal. Then they can piss on those who aren't as "enlightened".....

[steyrman13]

Combat weapons? Are we a little high on our horse now. What exactly is a combat weapon? One of my combat weapon's (used in combat) was a piece of shit H&R m16A2 that had more miles on it than jenna jamson. It was a malfunction machine, and the only way I was able to get it replaced, was by smashing the barrel on the side of a 5 ton.

The snobbery around here is sickening. People seem to have this illusion that if they hang around a website that LAV, Haley, Pat Rodgers use, they are somehow an equal. Then they can piss on those who aren't as "enlightened".....

If this site is sooo sickening, so much snobbery, and you disagree with the knowledge base, then why stick around?


I believe Grant supports those brands because he has seen less issues and failures from them and doesn't support other ones because he has.
Same as some mechanic or sponsor supporting Chevy over ford or ford over dodge etc.

I understand your OP for people looking for a cheap deal, some just had concerns that they could pay skittle extra to configure it differently like BCM or G&R offer on their deals

[ra2bach]

I have seen too many of these "garbage brands" that certian people here bash, run... and run well. Just beacuse it does not have BCM or DD or a pony on the side of it, doesn't mean it's a POS.

It used to be that we evaluate a product, then grade it. Now, people look at a compnany or even a price point, and have their mind made up before they even see the product.

Can you honestly tell me that a new shooter with limited funds and somone who just wants to learn to shoot, needs to go out and buy a $1500 BCM or DD rifle, when they can get a quality, lower priced brand.

the easy answer here is if you stick with the B,C, or D brand, you don't have to evaluate it - it's a known good product. the unfortunate thing is that some models of the "lesser" brands will cost just as much...

a lot of inexperienced buyers will be tricked into this because of the bells and whistles that boost the price but do not add to the quality/reliability of the firearm. it's like buying a lower priced car with the entire catalog full of options on it, still not being as good a car as the better one with fewer options.

you are right about snap judgements though. for awhile I was running a GG&G upper on a Rock River lower. anyone looking at this gun might assume it was trash. what they would not know is that the lower was bought stripped and I built with quality components. the GG&G upper was made for them by LMT using their barrel (although it was a 1/9 twist) and BCG. the only sketchy thing about it was the GG&G rail and folding front sight/gas block. not that it didn't work - it was actually pretty clever - but rail was not free float and they were heavy.

when I was able to afford more guns I only bought top quality ones and later sold that gun to someone I care very much about. it has over 7,000 rounds on the original components and hasn't missed a beat. and it's still very accurate. not bad for a piece of trash, huh?..

[Warp]

actually this isn't bullshit. there is a difference in products that matter to people who need the best because their lives or the lives of others depend on it. if you look at the founding goals/principles of this site, that is what the mission is here. other sites may have other focuses, such as, hunting, gaming, sporting use of an AR. there is nothing wrong with that as far as that goes. but it's wrong to say one is the same as another...

now, to the RE in question, it says Mil Spec Diameter, no mention of the material used and they do have RE with both materials available... to most people the diameter is the critical component as it determines the type of stock. all in all, we are talking about a budget build, using a blem lower and I would not be surprised if the RE is one of their 6061 as it fits the cost model.

however, I don't think it's misleading as no claims of excellence are made and regardless of the material, 6061 will be a serviceable piece for 99.99% of the people out there in all their uses. and for the .01% that need the better product, they probably won't be looking at $199 complete lowers anyway.

the problem I have with this discussion, is that someone has guaranteed (assumed) that the RE is shit and is basically accusing PSA of underhanded dealing. there's a reason this Complete Blem Lower is $199 other people's are $350. caveat emptor...