Moving away from Shotgun to AR for HD?

[cbmj]

I've put my shotty up getting older with a bad shoulder and the wife likes the rifle better.

[quaesitor logica]

Know the tools in your toolbox and the venue they will be deployed in. Not that I would volunteer to stand in front of an inbound handgun round, but they are all anemic compared to either of the long gun options. For those folks that still think the shotgun only sprays out a huge pattern, take a look at some of the Federal Flight Control loads, like the #1 buck (LE132 1B).

Exactly. FC loads are game changers where B.S is concerned. In my house the longest shot plausible would be about 10 yards. At this distance Federal L.E 00 Buck makes a single ragged hole about 2.5 inches in diameter.

Cant go wrong with slugs either.

[Tequila45]

We already have an existing thread re the Mayor, thanks much. - SeriousStudent

[T2C]

The OP mentioned home defense. If he asked about a LEO long gun for patrol officers, I would have given him a different answer.

[C4IGrant]

I think it comes down to training. You need to get comfortable manipulating the weapon you use for HD & know it's limitations. To me on paper a reliable AR SBR seems a good option but so does a Tavor you could manipulate and shoot with 1 arm and even something like an SBS Saiga/VEPR 12, also a KSG (if proven to run reliably) would seem a good option as well but one would need training behind any platform.

Considering this is M4C & not GlockTalk or Shotgun world I would expect many members here to be very comfortable with the AR and likely to default to it as an HD weapon, no real surprises here.

Correct on training. Most people are LESS likely to get PROFESSIONAL training on this weapon (compared to any other firearm). They are also less likely to shoot a SG as much as a pistol or AR15.

Since most people have their CCW, one would assume that people have had the most training and rounds fired with this gun (making it the best choice for many).

As someone that been trained by one of the best (if not the best) Tactical Shotgun instructors on the planet (and have run a SG through a shoot house), I would still make the SG THIRD on my list of choices. Point being, my recommendation has ZERO to do with the fact this is mostly and AR15 forum.


C4

[quaesitor logica]

I like for H.D

1 .40 S&W M&P full size
2. 12" AR 5.56 w/64g GDSP or better
3. 12g semi-auto 18" barrel w/ fc 00 B.S

I have a feeling that I might prefer the shotgun to the AR if I could get alot more training with it. BIG might considering the barrel length and bulk though.

[Jaxjag]

This guys reasoning seems to be pretty sound.......

http://youtu.be/qKk45i9DzDA

[lowbar]

Sold my Mossberg and Remington shotties long ago. Rifles and handguns are far superior in just about every aspect and will cover any use needed. Ya can't beat a handgun or rifle with a light mounted to it for any job.

[Wolfhound86]

Know the tools in your toolbox and the venue they will be deployed in. Not that I would volunteer to stand in front of an inbound handgun round, but they are all anemic compared to either of the long gun options. For those folks that still think the shotgun only sprays out a huge pattern, take a look at some of the Federal Flight Control loads, like the #1 buck (LE132 1B).

Or you could get a 18" barrel with a mod choke. That will keep the balls tight.

[cjb]

Over the years, I have slowly moved completely away from the shotgun for home defense.

Some of my reasons for the switch:

Nearly zero recoil (AR)
High mag capacity
Longer range
Lighter, faster handling
Over-penetration issues with 00 buckshot
Defeats body armor

Anyone else breaking out the old 12 gauge less and less?

I think I'm just not getting it. Home defense....

I'm not trying to be argumentative, just offering my own counter-thoughts.

1. Recoil. I duno. I've hunted plenty. I've sat in blinds and walk hunted and stalk hunted and just got lucky sometimes too. And I cant recall ever feeling the recoil, or ever thinking the noise was an issue - at least until later on. And hunting, the moment you see, and aim and decide to take the quarry, is a little stressful. To me it is. My heart pounds a little, I become very focused, and time slows down, or speeds up, but doesn't remain the same. I have pulled on, and not shot a home intruder. The stress... so much that after the cops arrived I damn near needed an ambulance. I seriously don't think recoil is going to be a major factor. Maybe its just me and my 40 years of hunting experience, dunno.

2. High mag capacity. The AR platform has it. I admit. Thing is - is it a practical need in home defense?

3. Longer range. For home defense I don't need long range. If the BG's are long range, they're not yet a threat.

4. Lighter and faster handling. I dunno, unless you've got an SBR, you're shotgun is similarly limited to size. Then again, if you have an SBR, why not an SBS? No advantage unless you compare the AR with 16 inch barrel to your turkey gun.

5. Over penetration with OO buck. As comared to what? A 55grain 5.56? Hint: Don't shoot 00 buck inside the house. Try something like combo BB and 2.

6. Defeats body armor. Yes the AR will defeat body armor. I find this sorta weird. You say the shotgun over penetrates, but tout that the AR penetrates well - through body armor. I'm trying to wrap my mind around the concept. I can't. I can say, that if BG's have body armor, I'm in deep deep doo-doo for sure.

At home I carry a pocketable .45 auto - a Kahr PM45. Two AR's are handy if need be, but my bedside companion is an 870 riot with 18.5 inch barrel. Ditto for my office at home. Shotguns still my plan-A, but to each their own.

And again, I'm not trying to be a dick and be argumentative, just offering my own thoughts. Tear 'em apart if ya gotta!