CHP arrest on-duty firefigher while treating crash victims . . .

[ShortytheFirefighter]

Most all of our FD personnel are pretty good about this kind of thing. They do get pretty testy about driving over their hoses though.....

To be fair, our own Chiefs do it too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roTHmpxirNY

[021411]

I appreciate all that our fire dept does for us (police dept) on crash investigations. They always park the pumper or ladder in such a way to provide a barrier for coming traffic. I've seen pumpers ran into by sober and intoxicated drivers not paying attention. Yes even with all their emergency lights on..
Where I'm at there's no pissing contest. We get in, do our shit and leave.

[Caduceus]

Not sure about CA, but here it is standard operating procedure for our FD's to park their apparatuses in a way so as to shield themselves and their patients from oncoming traffic. If this is the attitude that CHP takes with FD then I hope they never need EMS. Would that trooper arrested him if he was treating a fellow trooper on the highway? Do they arrest ambulance drivers for busting red lights and or speeding enroute to or from a call?

This is a shining example of how asinine that place is, it is void of all logic.

It is in CA as well. And there are misdemeanor laws about interfering with public servants on scene (which, c'mon, you think are really going to be put on this guy?)

The real conflict is who really 'owns' the accident scene. CHP is a state level agency, vice the usual county or city FD/EMS agencies (or heck, even private EMS). Most of rural CA is under CDF, which is a state level fire agency. Either way, in about 8 years of EMS in CA, I never saw cops give much flack to how/where the Fire and EMS guys positioned things. The cops usually just encompassed the entire scene and blocked as much as was needed.

That being said, CHP are wizards at getting the streets open and keeping traffic moving. I wish every state had such a priority on clearing the scene after the accident has been handled.

In CA, the law is that running Code 3 (lights/siren) can only go 15 over posted speed limit (IIRC, that test was a while ago). I've never seen anyone get a ticket for that; though I have seen emergency vehicles get parking tickets.

Maybe the guy will get disiplined. Maybe the fire guys will just screw with CHP and find some fire code violations at their substation.

[ggammell]

How much credibility is this guy going to have in court from now on?

I can see an "administrative" transfer to Death Valley in this guys future. Needs of the department and all.

[T2C]

While where I work we often joke about fire taking up three lanes to apply a band-aid, we also cede some authority if they are actively treating injuries or addressing hazards. They establish the room they feel they need to work safely. While we may ask how long they may need for the purpose of diverting traffic, we really don't try to hurry them, they are not trying to be out there any longer than they have to.

Fortunately, I have never seen anything like this, and if I did I would address it right away. Even if the FF was being an asshat, there is a way to do things in the public eye that involves a bit of decorum and common sense. If there is some kind of bona fide emergency that trumps the current emergency, then you explain that to the ranking personnel and let them deal with their people. Moving stuck traffic on the freeway ten minutes sooner than later is not such an emergency.

Most all of our FD personnel are pretty good about this kind of thing. They do get pretty testy about driving over their hoses though.....

This is a very good post and it expresses how most LEO feel.

[TacMedic556]

I have been in this line of work for 13 years now. I cannot fathom how these situations escalate to this point. A few years back there was a similar incident, and the arresting officer lost his job as a result (if I remember correctly). This case is similar and there were patients still requiring aid.

The placement of engines to protect a scene is protocol everywhere. The incident commander is 99% of the time the first arriving fire officer. This police officer really had no right to order movement of the apparatus. Traffic movement is a non issue. People in cars getting to where ever on time IS NOT A PRIORITY. The flow of traffic is NOT a priority.

In the end we are all brothers and sisters doing the same job. Let's do it right and save lives. Hope this is settled well and apologies are made.

[PD Sgt.]

I have been in this line of work for 13 years now. I cannot fathom how these situations escalate to this point. A few years back there was a similar incident, and the arresting officer lost his job as a result (if I remember correctly). This case is similar and there were patients still requiring aid.

The placement of engines to protect a scene is protocol everywhere. The incident commander is 99% of the time the first arriving fire officer. This police officer really had no right to order movement of the apparatus. Traffic movement is a non issue. People in cars getting to where ever on time IS NOT A PRIORITY. The flow of traffic is NOT a priority.

In the end we are all brothers and sisters doing the same job. Let's do it right and save lives. Hope this is settled well and apologies are made.

Very well said. It surprises me sometimes that some officers do not realize that at many of these scenes, the IC is Fire and not LE.

[eightmillimeter]

Have I seen emergency vehicles do terrible jobs of parking at crash scenes... yes, all the time. There is a right and wrong way to do it and on a high-traffic freeway it gets a little dicey. Parking a fire truck in the middle of a lane that is not already blocked (without additional traffic control vehicles to the rear) is wrong and dangerous. Usually its the police car with the dash cam rolling that gets hit from behind smashing everyone in between wreckage and now a large fire truck that isn't going to move much. That said, I never so much as mention it to the fire boys when they show up because 1) I am professional enough to let it go, 2) they can settle the lawsuit when the crash happens.

Was the CHP (and the officer in above older video) correct in their concern? Yes. Should they have addressed it with the firefighters when they obviously had something better to do (EMS)? No. Should they have been a big enough tard to escalate a situation like that? F-CK NO!

[96 SS]

It's been a few years, but back when I was working in Utah I went to a seminar out on by UDOT about incident command/secondary incident etc etc. While at that seminar UDOT specifically mentioned that in Utah the UHP does NOT "own" the road and can not order Fire aparatus placement etc.

Believe it or not the UDOT road recovery/driver assistance people owned the road and were the only people legally allowed to make PD/FD/UHP move vehicles etc.

[Whiskey_Bravo]

Where was the truck parked in this particular incident and why didn't the fireman move it when the CHP officer told him to? Before we hang the CHP officer, let's get a few more details.

Doesn't really matter where the truck was parked, and I assume he didn't move it being an active scene and he was busy. If the officer didn't like it that much he should have waited until there was no more EMS needs and take it up with the FF and his commanding officer after the fact. Arresting another civil servant, especially in public on an active scene who is providing medical service over a parking job is the height of stupidity and and shows a lack of judgement that should call into question his previous and future actions.

Just my opinion though.