Did the ATF Open the Door for Manufacture of New Machineguns for trust?

[DragonDoc]

Did ATF’s Determination on NICS Checks Open the Door for Manufacture of New Machineguns for Trusts? Did they open the door for us?


http://blog.princelaw.com/2014/05/14...ns-for-trusts/

[SteyrAUG]

[MistWolf]

No. There is a flaw in the logic but I'm too tired & brain burnt to attempt to explain it. It has something to do with there still has to be a person to handle the machinegun, trust or no trust

[SteyrAUG]

No. There is a flaw in the logic but I'm too tired & brain burnt to attempt to explain it. It has something to do with there still has to be a person to handle the machinegun, trust or no trust

The important thing is, can the ATF figure it out. Keep in mind these are the same people who declared "an empty volume of air IS a machine gun."

[Kain]

The important thing is, can the ATF figure it out. Keep in mind these are the same people who declared "an empty volume of air IS a machine gun."

Wait. What? Can you please explain that? This is the first time I have heard that one, and the only thing my tired mind can come up with is by that definition a balloon is a machine gun.

[SteyrAUG]

Wait. What? Can you please explain that? This is the first time I have heard that one, and the only thing my tired mind can come up with is by that definition a balloon is a machine gun.

Prior to the 1986 closing of the registry many people registered their HK 91, 93 and 94 receivers as machine guns in order to convert their semi autos into legal machine guns. Many of them simply modified the trigger group by resetting the sear to a new location and installing a sear trip lever and keeping the modified trigger group in the original clip and shelf setup frame.

Since the receiver was the registered machine gun they could use original factory sears and trip levers (keep in mind the trip lever is the actual part most people called "registered sears" on sear conversion rifles). But as they never removed the receiver shelf and drilled a hole for a swing down trigger group they always had to modify the trigger box and relocate the sear, install trip lever and make sure everything was timed properly for correct cycle.

Following the closing of the machine gun registry in 1986 many owners of registered receiver HK machine guns with receiver shelves intact wanted to modify their machine guns to accept a standard "push pin" swing down factory lower so there would be less gunsmithing involved and they could install any of the modular factory trigger group configurations available.

When somebody contacted ATF about the legality of doing this they were informed that drilling a hole in a registered receiver machine gun would constitute the creation of a "new" machine gun which would render the entire firearm a post 86 dealer sample that could not be possessed by a private individual.

When asked for a clarification letter on what exactly constituted the "new machine gun" on an existing registered machine gun and the location of this "new machine gun", the ATF produced a letter stating that the "empty volume of air" created by drilling a hole in the receiver of a registered machine gun receiver was a "new machine gun" that didn't previously exist and was to be considered a machine gun itself.

The letter was documented in "The Machine Gun Dealers Bible" by Dan Shea.

[Kain]

Prior to the 1986 closing of the registry many people registered their HK 91, 93 and 94 receivers as machine guns in order to convert their semi autos into legal machine guns. Many of them simply modified the trigger group by resetting the sear to a new location and installing a sear trip lever and keeping the modified trigger group in the original clip and shelf setup frame.

Since the receiver was the registered machine gun they could use original factory sears and trip levers (keep in mind the trip lever is the actual part most people called "registered sears" on sear conversion rifles). But as they never removed the receiver shelf and drilled a hole for a swing down trigger group they always had to modify the trigger box and relocate the sear, install trip lever and make sure everything was timed properly for correct cycle.

Following the closing of the machine gun registry in 1986 many owners of registered receiver HK machine guns with receiver shelves intact wanted to modify their machine guns to accept a standard "push pin" swing down factory lower so there would be less gunsmithing involved and they could install any of the modular factory trigger group configurations available.

When somebody contacted ATF about the legality of doing this they were informed that drilling a hole in a registered receiver machine gun would constitute the creation of a "new" machine gun which would render the entire firearm a post 86 dealer sample that could not be possessed by a private individual.

When asked for a clarification letter on what exactly constituted the "new machine gun" on an existing registered machine gun and the location of this "new machine gun", the ATF produced a letter stating that the "empty volume of air" created by drilling a hole in the receiver of a registered machine gun receiver was a "new machine gun" that didn't previously exist and was to be considered a machine gun itself.

The letter was documented in "The Machine Gun Dealers Bible" by Dan Shea.

Thanks. Though I am trying to decide if I should grab some aspirin or pour a double shot of Jack since my head hurts even worse now.

[SteyrAUG]

Thanks. Though I am trying to decide if I should grab some aspirin or pour a double shot of Jack since my head hurts even worse now.

You probably don't want to even know about the "shoestring would be considered a machine gun" determination.

[agr1279]

You probably don't want to even know about the "shoestring would be considered a machine gun" determination.

You now have my interest. Lets hear this one.

Dan

[platoonDaddy]

You now have my interest. Lets hear this one.

Dan

What he said!