AR 15 SBR Choices and Decisions

[ptmccain]

NFA question

My lower is going to shipped to my FFL, do I then pick it up there and register my SBR via the eForm process since I set up my trust? Or do I have to keep lower at FFL until I get ATF approval?

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[TehLlama]

A stripped lower is just a stripped lower - I'd run whatever lower you plan to SBR as a Title 1 firearm first (make sure everything runs on it the way you'd like), then you can do the Form 1 to 're'- make that lower into an SBR down the road. For now, just get the lower, and get your trust figured out. Once you're past that, it gets really easy.

[ptmccain]

Thanks, it is not a stripped lower, but a full lower, "complete" lower.

Would this change how I should alter my approach?

I am eager to comply with all laws.

I'm receiving a SBR upper, and want to put it onto the BCM complete lower I am getting next week.

I am looking for advice on what I must do legally, and can not do, etc.

I do have a NFA trust now set up.

[TehLlama]

Thanks, it is not a stripped lower, but a full lower, "complete" lower.
Would this change how I should alter my approach?
I am eager to comply with all laws.
I'm receiving a SBR upper, and want to put it onto the BCM complete lower I am getting next week.
I am looking for advice on what I must do legally, and can not do, etc.
I do have a NFA trust now set up.

Just don't assemble it into a configuration that is verbotten (until the receiver pins are put together nobody could make that federal case, even the 'constructive intent' has no precedent that would survive intelligent judicial scrutiny). If you have nothing to assemble that into, and you're concerned, just run some zip ties through the receiver pin holes in the upper, which renders it a case of you'd have to cut them open in order to assemble it, but with all things BATFE there's the possibility for stupid. In practical terms, anybody who gets in trouble with that is already in 'play stupid games, win federal agents tearing apart everything you own' territory. As a complete lower it's fine, just don't build it into an NFA setup until you have an approved Form 1.

The upper you're getting isn't an SBR upper, it's just an upper that can be assembled into an SBR with the addition other parts (or built into a pistol, AOW, or be art if never built into a firearm). That lower same idea - you can (and I'd recommend doing so) building that into a rifle and running it as-is with another upper to make sure it runs and functions fine.

[ptmccain]

Thank you, sir. I appreciate it.

[Anymouse]

PT,

A couple of things to think about, in no particular order …

 There are many suppressor manufacturers. Don’t skimp on doing research. At an absolute minimum, research SureFire, SilencerCo, and AAC. Also Thunderbeast, OPS Inc., Gemtech, Yankee Hill. Read the reviews on silencertalk and elsewhere. Ask questions. Call Silencer Shop.

 Do you have/might you acquire 7.62mm rifles you might want to suppress in the future? If so, consider getting a quick-detach 7.62/30 cal can. Most manufacturers who make both 5.56 and 7.62 QD suppressors make adapters for both, so you can use your 30 cal can on your AR/other 5.56 mm rifle (obviously trying to put a 5.56 mm can on a 30 cal rifle is a really bad idea). Typically a 30 cal can on a 5.56 mm rifle won’t suppress quite as well as the same model 5.56 mm can on that rifle, but the difference is usually small and often undetectable to the ear.

 What is most important to you? Suppression? Size? Weight? Adaptability? Price? As a general rule, larger cans suppress better, but of course they aren’t as “handy.” Sturdier cans weigh more. Titanium cans are light, but pricey. Some QD mounts are more solid than others. Aluminum baffles are light (and probably not used in any centerfire rifle can, but I could be wrong), but don’t hold up nearly as well as stainless steel. Inconel is better. Stellite is probably better yet. Again, research. The internet is your friend.

 Will you be shooting FA? Not all cans are rated for FA, and those that are may be rated FA only for barrels longer than a certain minimum.

 Will you be using the can to hunt with? Some 30 cal cans are rated up to 308 Win … others to 300 Win Mag … others to 30 RUM.

Any can is expensive for what is basically a muffler for a very small automobile, especially when you add $200 for the tax and a 9-12 month wait for the Form 4 to be approved. After all that, you want to try to make the right choice (whatever that may be for your proposed use, budget, and other considerations) the first time.

Beware of non-lawyers stating their opinion of what the law says. Having said that … it is a felony to attach a short (<16” barrel) upper to any lower unless that lower has already been registered as an SBR (or a MG), because that would constitute making and possessing a SBR that hasn’t been registered with BATFE by means of a Form 1 or a Form 4. Some people (I believe including BATFE agents) maintain that simply possessing that short-barreled upper receiver without having a “matching” lower receiver (that is, FA or SBR lower) constitutes constructively possessing an illegal SBR. Others say it doesn’t matter.

Personally, if I were doing it, I would only keep the short upper in my possession if I had no AR rifle or receiver in my possession that the short upper could possibly be assembled to. Otherwise, I’d try to find a friend who owns no ARs who would be willing to keep it until I had the stamped Form1/Form 4 in my hand. But that’s me. It’s your ass, not mine.

[Slippers]

I'd like to echo what TehLlama said. You should consider using the lower a bit to make sure it runs well. Then, send it off to get engraved. When you get it back, file the eForm 1. The reason for this is to make sure it doesn't get lost, damaged, or messed up at the engraver. Considering it only takes 3-4 weeks for a form 1, I suppose it's not a big deal either way.

[scooter22]

SilencerShop has SureFire SOCOM 556 RC for $949, which is unf*ckingbelievable.

You'd have to be insane not to jump on that.

http://www.silencershop.com/shop/surefire-socom556-rc/

[MistWolf]

PT, your lower is neither a rifle or a pistol, even complete with a rifle stock and will be listed as an "other" on the form 4473. Best thing to do is remove the rifle stock and keep the lower in a pistol configuration. That way you can legally install your upper and shoot it and make sure everything works.

Some points to keep in mind-
-A receiver that is originally assembled and sold as a complete rifle is forever a rifle
-A receiver that is not sold as a complete firearm, is an "OTHER" and may be configured as a pistol or a rifle whether it's fitted with a rifle stock or not. As a receiver may be configured as a pistol, the purchaser must be 21 and can only take possession of it in their state of residence
-A receiver that is first configured as a rifle is forever a rifle; that is the lower receiver, complete with rifle stock, is mated to a complete upper
-A receiver that is first configured as a pistol, is a pistol
-A pistol may be re-configured as a rifle. A pistol that has been re-configured as a rifle may be returned to a pistol configuration

The key to avoiding constructive intent while waiting for your paperwork is possessing a complete legally configured firearm, whether that configuration is a pistol or a rifle.
-Possession of an AR rifle lower and a pistol length upper without possessing a rifle length upper can be construed as constructive intent
-Possession of a rifle lower, rifle upper and pistol upper is not constructive intent

This ruling is the result of the lawsuit brought against the BATF by Thompson Center

[Jwknutson17]

SilencerShop has SureFire SOCOM 556 RC for $949, which is unf*ckingbelievable.

You'd have to be insane not to jump on that.

http://www.silencershop.com/shop/surefire-socom556-rc/

This big time. I bought both my Socom RC and Mini at this same price point. Cant go wrong with a Socom 556 RC under 1k.