Considering the Snub Nose Reload - Spares Carry

[ST911]

Snub interest and discussion has been particularly popular of late, so I offer the following as we deepen our knowledge base and consider our options.



Purpose: Compare the time required to reload and fire 20 rounds from a 5-shot snub revolver using three spare ammunition carry methods.

Start position: 5 fired cases placed in the cylinder, gun held in a two handed firing grip, covering a target placed at 7 yards. Spare ammunition set out on a table top in front of the shooter.

Instructions: On the tone from the shot timer continuously reload from the loader specified (below), firing the ammunition in the cylinder to the designated target zone until 20 total rounds have been fired.

Target: 8”/-0 zone, RGT-1 target (https://www.letargets.com/estylez_item.aspx?item=RGT-1)

Drill 1: Safariland Comp 1 Speed Loader
Loaded: Capacity
Time (1): 34.51, Clean, 1:1.73 sec
Time (2): 31.68, 17/20 hits, 1:1.58 sec

Drill 2: Bianchi Speed Strips
Loaded: 4 strips of 5 rounds each
Time: 52.02, 18/20 hits, 1:2.6 sec

Drill 3: Bianchi Speed Strips
Loaded: 5 strips of 4 rounds each, load to middle four slots
Time: 54.27, 18/20 hits, 1:2.71 sec

Notes and Discussion:

Target size and distance was chosen to prevent artificially rapid fire for the sake of setting up the reload.

Spares carriers (pouches, pockets, etc) were not utilized to prevent giving any reload configuration possible advantage.

20 rounds was the quantity selected as it was the lowest mathematical intersection for the chosen reload configurations.

Reloading via speed loader was ~34% and ~40% faster than the lowest time for any speed strip configuration.

The rate of fire averaged over each string with speed loaders was 1 round every 1.58 and 1.73 seconds. The best speed strip run was 1 round every 2.6 seconds.

For the two speed strip configurations, it took approximately the same amount of time to load and fire the revolver with 4 rounds 5 times, as reloading with 5 rounds 4 times. This is due to the amount of time required to index the speed strip and cylinder to load the remaining fifth round each time. The four round speed strip returns the gun to a firing condition quicker, but with 20% less ammunition. The five round speed strip leaves the gun down longer during reloads, but at full capacity when brought back to target.

Summary: The limited capacity of the snub revolver does not negate its value as life support gear, nor its ability to accurately place rounds on target if the shooter can deliver. It does require an additional layer of deliberate planning and training for keeping it loaded and able to fight. Many shooters will consider concealment and convenience in the choice of reloads, without regard to performance. The information above may be helpful to them.

[The Dumb Gun Collector]

Awesome post

[PD Sgt.]

Thank you for taking the time to put this together and post this!

I for one am guilty of choosing my J frame reloads by convenience (speed strips) with less regard for the actual speed. I was thinking the other day after watching some video from the recent HITS (I think that was the class) that was posted here that I may need to rethink my choice.

The problem is, when I carry a J frame it is usually for the sake of concealability. To add traditional speed loaders, with their greater bulk, defeats the purpose in a t-shirt and shorts. I may have to experiment with some kind of belt pouch or kydex to see if I can find something that works for me.

[Voodoo_Man]

good stuff

[jpmuscle]

good stuff

x2. Indeed.

[Horseman45]

Very interesting. Figure out the inner tube riddle yet?

[Doc Safari]

Questions:

1. HKS speedloaders use a "turn" knob, the other brand uses a spring-loaded button. Any speculation as to which might be the quickest? ( I have trouble using the spring-loaded type, so it's a moot point for me).

2. Any pointers on reloading without "stuff getting hung up"?

3. Something I've always wondered: when you speed reload a revolver, are you trying to carefully reclose the cylinder to avoid even the possibility of bending the ejector rod, or do you just slam it home? The reason I ask this is because the times I've handled a Ruger SP101 I always looked at its ejector rod as somewhat fragile. I have actually seen a couple of these damaged on SP101's at gun shows over the years. I carry a Smith 642 myself, so I'm not as concerned, but that's one of those "fifty questions you've always wanted to ask about firearms but didn't want to look like an idiot."

4. Given that guns like the J-frame have short ejector rods, you (mostly) have to assist getting the empties out even after plunging on the ejector. Any tips on doing this better?

[1toughdog]

Thanks for the information, great posts!

[Zim]

This post is great. Thank you for sharing.

I'm trying to work out the best method of reloading my new Kimber k6s (my first modern revolver), and I'm finding that the smooth cylinder walls interfere with Michael de Bethencourt's technique. The only speed loaders that fit (afaik) are made by 5-star, and the cylinder wants to rotate with the turn of the speed loader. It works fine with Massad Ayoob's stress reload technique, however, but pistol + speed loader + speed strip really clogs up the right side of my belt.

I've contemplated using both techniques; left hand for speed loaders and right hand for speed strips, but that seems like it would unnecessarily complicate the muscle memory at a potentially critical moment.

[Ttwwaack]

OP, in your upcoming re-do, have you considered a J frame converted for moon clips? It would be interesting to see a comparison of moons -vs- speed loaders. They are slightly smaller than speed loaders and it is one package in and outta the gun. Problem is trying for a load 2 shoot 2 drill.