Consistently Grouping Poorly

[Pappabear]

That's a 4 MOA dot. I guess if you have 3 moa ammo and 4 moa dot .....it still seems
Ike quite a large group.

I would just get anybody optic and throw on it. Anything. Riflescope, ACOG, another aimpoint with very small red dot....AND let someone else shoot it.

I doubt very seriously that it's the gun.

[Iraqgunz]

With some of the trash I have seen lately, I wouldn't rule out anything.

That's a 4 MOA dot. I guess if you have 3 moa ammo and 4 moa dot .....it still seems
Ike quite a large group.

I would just get anybody optic and throw on it. Anything. Riflescope, ACOG, another aimpoint with very small red dot....AND let someone else shoot it.

I doubt very seriously that it's the gun.

[Sticks]

This rifle is fairly new. It's a complete rifle I bought from my local gun shop. Everything is tight. As far as my shooting position. It was from the bench mostly. I had the rifle rested on it magazine for a few rounds. Then propped it up on its rail on top of blocks. I switched positions, my grip, altered my trigger pull. Nothing helped.
I've shot this rifle a few times. The only other time I had it on paper was at 25 yards in a rushed indoor range outing. It grouped well enough for me then. The only things I've changed before this outing were butt stock and pistol grip.

Was it a new rifle when at the gun shop, or a used trade in? If trade in, you may now know why.

If it was indeed a trade in - I'd give the upper a very thorough inspection, looking for any tool marks, up to and including removing the handguard. Look at the muzzle crown and see if it's damaged.

[TacticalSledgehammer]

Thanks for the help guys. I was thinking along the same lines. I just wanted to see what you all would recommend. The rifle was new when I bought it. I'm going to defiantly try irons/other optics on it.

[markm]

There should be something Majorly obvious here. 14" groups at 50? Helen Keller could have shot better than that!

As suggested, Irons are a must. That way you can reconcile your sight systems. If that doesn't reveal anything, it needs to get looked at.

[MegademiC]

Check the muzzle device. I had a loose brake on an ak and bullets were skidding off the top. Like mark said, it's some hung obvious, Rds not mounted correctly, loose bbl/muzzle device, etc. I would wager something is moving when your shooting.

I also had BSA rds and the dot floated around every shot. That was my last experience with cheap gear, but everyone puts out a lemon at some point. Is the aim point verified legit? Even if so, put it on another gun and ensure its holding zero.

[Shao]

Check the muzzle device. I had a loose brake on an ak and bullets were skidding off the top. Like mark said, it's some hung obvious, Rds not mounted correctly, loose bbl/muzzle device, etc. I would wager something is moving when your shooting.

I also had BSA rds and the dot floated around every shot. That was my last experience with cheap gear, but everyone puts out a lemon at some point. Is the aim point verified legit? Even if so, put it on another gun and ensure its holding zero.

I was gonna say, if it's not the RDS mount, I would take a long hard look at the muzzle device - is it the standard DD birdcage or has it been changed out? It sounds to me like someone overtorqued the flash hider or something.

[TacticalSledgehammer]

I've checked everything (flash hider, castle nut) with the exception of the barrel nut. The barrel itself seems like its in there tight. It will move some (very little though) up and down & side to side in the free float hand-guard, I would think that is normal though. The MOE stock is kinda sloppy, but I thought they all were. It collapses and extends with a solid lock up. I feel like its possible that I have a wondering dot in my R-1. I'll check it with irons to see what the real deal is.

[markm]

The fact that you tried 855 and M193 pretty much eliminates the ammo. I can't wait to see what you find out.

[waveslayer]

This would be hard to diagnosis without seeing how you are shooting it etc... you could have a loose barrel nut or not enough torque on it to hold the barrel steady, etc... also using a red dot can be accurate if you make a matching MOA dot at 50 yards.. maybe a good gunsmith can diagnosis it if he strips it down