Smith & Wesson M&P series, thus far...

[Slater]

I remember when the M&P first hit the market some years ago. A lot of folks were calling it a "Glock killer" and predicting that it would soon claim the lion's share of the polymer 9mm/.40 market.

Fast forward to today and Glock still seems as popular as ever, their 9mm hiccups notwithstanding. And since then, some outstanding guns have hit the market such as the Walther PPQ and HK VP9.

Don't know about S&W's market share, but is the M&P about where it was expected to be at this point in time?

[ralph]

I remember when the M&P first hit the market some years ago. A lot of folks were calling it a "Glock killer" and predicting that it would soon claim the lion's share of the polymer 9mm/.40 market.

Fast forward to today and Glock still seems as popular as ever, their 9mm hiccups notwithstanding. And since then, some outstanding guns have hit the market such as the Walther PPQ and HK VP9.

Don't know about S&W's market share, but is the M&P about where it was expected to be at this point in time?

I don't know, and I doubt you could find out as S&W isn't talking. That said, I'm thinking S&W is getting some serious competition from a lot of other manufacturers I mean look at a VP9, other than sights, it doesn't need anything out of the box. NO apex anything. IMO, S&W took too long to address a lot of issues, and this eventually cost them.

[saints75]

I happen to agree with ralph on S&W taking too long to address a lot of issues. There are a lot of other striker fire firearms out there. Besides the VP9, there is the FNS, the Sig 320 and Beretta is coming out with striker fire. One thing I have notice is that Smith is takes a while to address the issues with there guns. It seems a lot of people wanted a Glock 19 size M&P. What does Smith do, they came out with a FDE and Carbin Fiber color frame. Really!? FN had an issue with their striker fire gun. FN addressed the issue right away and seems to be working fine now.

There are a lot of Glock fans out there. Glock is a good good firearm for the price. They have been around for a long time. Unless Smith re-vamps the internals of the M&P, and give what people want, the M&P will be second or third or fourth to the Glock. Just my two cents. Which isn't much

[RWH24]

What hurt S&W was the slow to respond/react to shortcomings of the pistol, hoping buyers would just learn to accept it or when it gets sent to the S&W shop for repair, fix or repair the problem them. I guess if I owned a shop putting a firearm that was expected to be trustworthy and 100% reliable, I would be slow broke. My philosophy would be, don't let it out the door until it's right. I know it can be done as manufactures have managed to do it.
After carrying Sig 226's for 26+/- years I bought my own M&P9 FS and 9L, Shield and a 9C. Not as warm to the 9c so it will move on out and a Sig 329 Compact, 15 rnd mag and 3.9" barrel, will take the 9c spot. I have a Sig 239 9mm, it's a great gun almost 20 years old, but it is a heavier Shield size wise and capacity.

[ChaseN]

I always thought the M&P line failed to really give shooters a reason to switch from Glock...the P320 brings a groundbreaking level of modularity to the table, and the VP9 offers excellent ergonomics with an outstanding out of the box trigger pull. Sure the M&P was the first popular plastic gun to offer different backstraps, but there were too many other issues to overcome. Also the sizing of the Compact is a little smaller than I think most people are looking for.

[CatSnipah]

The only M&P I have is the shield. Does fine for its purpose. Only thing I've done to it is change the sights and add some Foxx grips (like rubberized talon grips).

That said, I see a lot of M&P fanboys touting "all i did was add an apex kit....".

Yeah, how much is that? Why would people brag about having to add additional hardware and cost to a brand new firearm? I just don't get it. But that's me.

I know many will debate this, but I have listened to a lawyer who has defended several defensive shootings, and any good prosecutor will attempt to go after any types of functional modifications you've made to your trigger, sear, etc. Doesn't sound like that's nailed anyone YET, but all it takes is one skewed jury to buy-in to that translating to the defendant "wanting to go out and kill someone" to turn the tide. And with the ever-growing libtard media pushing these types of agendas, it should at least be considered.

Ok, rant done.

[Shao]

I think Smith & Wesson should stick to wheelguns. After the Sigma, I don't trust any S&W semi pistol. The only S&W semi I would trust would be a 5906. The problem is the "me too" attitude that many manufacturers have. There was already a plethora of polymer framed hi-cap striker-fired semis on the market that had a proven track record. I think the M&P was doomed for failure from the beginning. As others have pointed out, the series didn't really bring anything new to the table - so what was the point? Money... I think they've been trying to reclaim their LE market share after losing all of their Model 10 contracts. LOL. BTW, the Model 10 was called the "Military & Police" as well - and that was 116 years ago.

[Koshinn]

I know many will debate this, but I have listened to a lawyer who has defended several defensive shootings, and any good prosecutor will attempt to go after any types of functional modifications you've made to your trigger, sear, etc. Doesn't sound like that's nailed anyone YET, but all it takes is one skewed jury to buy-in to that translating to the defendant "wanting to go out and kill someone" to turn the tide. And with the ever-growing libtard media pushing these types of agendas, it should at least be considered.

No, just no. A good prosecutor will argue the facts and the law... and a modified gun is irrelevant in an intentional shooting. Hell, a good prosecutor most likely won't even prosecute you. Now if it was a negligent shooting, then yes, a modified gun to have a lighter trigger pull or fewer safeties may be to your detriment. But for an intentional defensive shooting? It doesn't matter if your gun had a 1 lb or a 10 lb trigger, the shoot was good regardless of trigger weight and any "good" prosecutor won't waste literally everyone's time by making such a frivolous argument.

[CatSnipah]

So...a lawyer who has seen it happen in court on multiple occasions is wrong? It didn't happen?

And why is it that in these cases you read about and see in the news, the prosecution often times tries to question the credibility or intent of a defendant involved in a shooting? That's what they are doing with the dive into the modifications on a pistol.

Like I said, I don't know where it's nailed anyone yet, but it does and has been a tactic.

[Koshinn]

So...a lawyer who has seen it happen in court on multiple occasions is wrong? It didn't happen?

And why is it that in these cases you read about and see in the news, the prosecution often times tries to question the credibility or intent of a defendant involved in a shooting? That's what they are doing with the dive into the modifications on a pistol.

Like I said, I don't know where it's nailed anyone yet, but it does and has been a tactic.

The prosecutor/da wasn't "good" in those cases. In most jurisdictions, self defense is a defense to murder. And self defense, in most jurisdictions, is assumed as soon as someone unlawfully enters your home. At that point, the weapon you used is essentially irrelevant. It doesn't matter if you used a punisher evil black rifle or a pink deringer. At that point the case revolves entirely around if the person was there lawfully or not. A dead body in a house who is not a family member nor a resident of that house is an open and shut case. The protector likely won't waste time and budget to prosecute you at all.

The only time he would is when there is real doubt on if it was self defense, which would be outside of the home in 99% of cases. And if there was, your trigger pull weight again won't matter. It still comes down to the question of self defense.


Now if it's a civil case... It might matter. Maybe. Depending on jurisdiction. But you were referring to criminal charges, so I haven't mentioned that.