Movement in open area while engaged

[Koshinn]

If you draw it out on a board and do the math (John Simpson's motto) 45 degree diagonal movement into a target at any range makes the bad guy work more to engage you - more than lateral movement, more than diagonal out.

Well yeah, moving laterally while keeping the distance the same maximizes angle displacement at any given speed. Which is actually moving in a circle. But at LE ranges, a 45° movement is a decent approximation. At military ranges, a 90° perpendicular movement is a decent approximation.

[Arctic1]

For those of you that are debating weather you should shoot on the move, record a video of yourself actually moving while trying get good hits, even if the targets are at relatively close range. You will be surprised.

I do this at every match I shoot, and based on target distance, size and exposure level, scoring Alphas is very much doable.
I also practiced this while in the military, both moving towards the target, away from the target, and laterally across the target array.
If you practice it, you can do it. The same with shooting moving targets (swingers, sliders etc).

Shooting while moving should be a decision based on target distance, target size and target cover/concealment (which affects size). 35 yards moving with a pistol....I don't think I would take that shot. I'm not Todd Jarrett.
Either drop to the ground for a more solid platform, or move to cover.

[Eurodriver]

Two man is the only way to do it safely and effectively.

I'm up. He sees me. I'm down.

[Eurodriver]

If you draw it out on a board and do the math (John Simpson's motto) 45 degree diagonal movement into a target at any range makes the bad guy work more to engage you - more than lateral movement, more than diagonal out. As someone mentioned, straight in or straight out does nothing to get you off the threat axis - it just gives the bad guy a bigger or smaller target along the trajectory he is throwing rounds down.

When you say "work more to engage you" I am assuming you mean that his weapon (and body) needs to be moving more quickly to keep up with you?

[Ron3]

For those of you that are debating weather you should shoot on the move, record a video of yourself actually moving while trying get good hits, even if the targets are at relatively close range. You will be surprised.

This made me chuckle a bit.

I do practice shooting on the move. If I move slowly and steadily (deliberate walk I guess you could call it) I do "okay" at close range. Walking quickly and firing at a 15 yd target well..there will be torso hits, but I consider an A zone of 4 inches and B zone of 8 inches.

What made me chuckle was I sometimes feel disappointed in myself for not being better at this. But the truth is..it's hard for anybody and I should focus on shooting and moving but NOT at the same time. (unless target is really close)

[T2C]

For those of you that are debating weather you should shoot on the move, record a video of yourself actually moving while trying get good hits, even if the targets are at relatively close range. You will be surprised.

From 1998 until 2012, I had the opportunity to train LEO to shoot on the move at 15 yards and closer. Inside 15 yards good COM hits are possible with a service pistol. Shooting on the move inside 50 yards and getting COM hits is also possible with the patrol carbine.

Proper training addresses this issue.

[Voodoo_Man]

From 1998 until 2012, I had the opportunity to train LEO to shoot on the move at 15 yards and closer. Inside 15 yards good COM hits are possible with a service pistol. Shooting on the move inside 50 yards and getting COM hits is also possible with the patrol carbine.

Proper training addresses this issue.

"On the move"

Walk or run?

[T2C]

"On the move"

Walk or run?

More of a walk. An example of a pistol drill would be to draw, walk from the 15 yard line to the 7 yard line and engage the threat with 6 rounds in 7 seconds. Any shots made while not moving counted as a miss. The walk may be forward diagonal left or right or straight forward. The drills are also run by moving straight backward and backward diagonal left or right. The groups may not look pretty, but the drill can be successfully completed if the shooter applies himself. The score area on the body is generous at 8-1/2" x 15".

We also ran serpentine drills at various distances. The drills were designed for one or two officers, not a squad or tactical formation.

I haven't met anyone who could hit anything at a dead run. Our theory was that moving steadily was better than running full tilt, then stopping and firing. It keeps the heart rate steady and you don't present a stationary target.

I won't get too much into some of the other drills, but they were developed after 2 LEO in our area were shot and killed at residential doorways while handling calls that you would not dispatch a SWAT team, search warrant entry team or multiple officers to handle.

[vicious_cb]

From 1998 until 2012, I had the opportunity to train LEO to shoot on the move at 15 yards and closer. Inside 15 yards good COM hits are possible with a service pistol. Shooting on the move inside 50 yards and getting COM hits is also possible with the patrol carbine.

Proper training addresses this issue.

Im not talking about how well you can shoot on the move. Its the fact that you are walking at a snails pace to get those hits. I mean you never notice it while shooting but you actually slow down to like 2mph, which is slower than your average walking speed. You see it in competition all the time, when someone starts to focus on their sights their walk speed slows down dramatically while they are engaging the target and speeds up again when they come off their sights. Now think about it from the targets perspective, is shooting a 2mph really all that difficult?

Does SotM have its uses? Sure, in structure clearing if a threat pops up while you're in a door jamb its definitely better to SotM out of that door jamb than have your whole team bottlenecked. But in the context of this thread's scenario and in most scenarios SotM hurts accuracy too much while adding very little to your safety.

[Voodoo_Man]

More of a walk. An example of a pistol drill would be to draw, walk from the 15 yard line to the 7 yard line and engage the threat with 6 rounds in 7 seconds. Any shots made while not moving counted as a miss. The walk may be forward diagonal left or right or straight forward. The drills are also run by moving straight backward and backward diagonal left or right. The groups may not look pretty, but the drill can be successfully completed if the shooter applies himself. The score area on the body is generous at 8-1/2" x 15".

We also ran serpentine drills at various distances. The drills were designed for one or two officers, not a squad or tactical formation.

I haven't met anyone who could hit anything at a dead run. Our theory was that moving steadily was better than running full tilt, then stopping and firing. It keeps the heart rate steady and you don't present a stationary target.

I won't get too much into some of the other drills, but they were developed after 2 LEO in our area were shot and killed at residential doorways while handling calls that you would not dispatch a SWAT team, search warrant entry team or multiple officers to handle.

Interesting.

Ive done movement drills that are at dead run speeds, most competent shooters can get solid hits on target up to about 10 yards then it falls apart, normally.

Anything at distance, like 25 or 50 yards you have to be actually using the sights.