ECHO-2: My XM177E2 Clone build! (In Progress)

**ClassIIIGunsmith** · 10-08-15, 12:37

Originally Posted by halo2304

Searching for my options, I stumbled upon the Daniel Defense barrel you mentioned. AIM Surplus had them at one time, but no more. A member here had one for sale in the EE back in April, but it's been sold. Other than that, it would be a miracle to see one up for sale...at least, before I pin & weld the moderator to the barrel I eventually settle on. After I finish my upper, suddenly there'll be a dozen for sale.

I bought a 6720 upper off a guy with the intentions of chopping the barrel. Then it dawned on me, I have a 6520. I could simply "convert" it to a 6720 with the new upper and chop the barrel of my 6520. The foolishly sentimental part of me doesn't really want to do this because: Colt. Of course, AFTER I had bought the 6720 upper and while waiting for it's arrival, another gentleman put up for sale a 6520 barrel with everything but the gas tube and hand guards. Sadly, it was sold before I could scrounge funds to pick it up.

I feel this project is turning into something of a money pit. I've already bought two uppers. Because the first one was mostly stripped and in moderately battle worn condition, I decided to buy another one complete and in better condition. I also picked up some parts to finish the first one as well as a spanner-style nut for the receiver extension. I've also been looking for a more correct aluminum stock, original or copy. I found an original assembly from stock to end plate and with the spring and buffer, just needing a lower to mate with. The guy was asking $500. Too damn rich for my blood. I've seen a copy (Essential Arms) here and there, but they're all for the commercial tube. I don't know why, but I just throw up in my mouth a little at the thought of a commercial tube. I understand their place in the AR history, but I don't understand why they still exist. It seems like having the means to do it right, but using bailing wire and duct tape anyway.
I'll worry about it later.
Right now, I'm trying to figure out if the delta ring should be black or gray or if it should actually be flat and gray. I would like to be as correct as possible without going "full retard", price wise.
That's where I stand right now with this project. Hopefully some of it made sense. Now, if you'll excuse me, daddy needs a drink.

You know building retros are expensive because of the fact that most of the parts are no longer made. So when the parts dry up, the price for retros will increase which means that you are investing in more ways than just fun. Its cheaper and ok not having an exact replica with me because I'm a little bit of a penny pincher my self. But in general these retro projects are kinda money pits but definitely cheaper than the real ones that are more than +$25K but have more goodies.

**Renegade04** · 10-08-15, 15:50

Originally Posted by halo2304

Searching for my options, I stumbled upon the Daniel Defense barrel you mentioned. AIM Surplus had them at one time, but no more. A member here had one for sale in the EE back in April, but it's been sold. Other than that, it would be a miracle to see one up for sale...at least, before I pin & weld the moderator to the barrel I eventually settle on. After I finish my upper, suddenly there'll be a dozen for sale.

I bought a 6720 upper off a guy with the intentions of chopping the barrel. Then it dawned on me, I have a 6520. I could simply "convert" it to a 6720 with the new upper and chop the barrel of my 6520. The foolishly sentimental part of me doesn't really want to do this because: Colt. Of course, AFTER I had bought the 6720 upper and while waiting for it's arrival, another gentleman put up for sale a 6520 barrel with everything but the gas tube and hand guards. Sadly, it was sold before I could scrounge funds to pick it up.

I feel this project is turning into something of a money pit. I've already bought two uppers. Because the first one was mostly stripped and in moderately battle worn condition, I decided to buy another one complete and in better condition. I also picked up some parts to finish the first one as well as a spanner-style nut for the receiver extension. I've also been looking for a more correct aluminum stock, original or copy. I found an original assembly from stock to end plate and with the spring and buffer, just needing a lower to mate with. The guy was asking $500. Too damn rich for my blood. I've seen a copy (Essential Arms) here and there, but they're all for the commercial tube. I don't know why, but I just throw up in my mouth a little at the thought of a commercial tube. I understand their place in the AR history, but I don't understand why they still exist. It seems like having the means to do it right, but using bailing wire and duct tape anyway.
I'll worry about it later.
Right now, I'm trying to figure out if the delta ring should be black or gray or if it should actually be flat and gray. I would like to be as correct as possible without going "full retard", price wise.
That's where I stand right now with this project. Hopefully some of it made sense. Now, if you'll excuse me, daddy needs a drink.

Essential Arms has two different aluminum stocks.
ITEM C1 /C2 - 4 POSITION CARBINE STOCK
COMPLETE (COMMERICAL TUBE)

ITEM C2 - 6 POSITION CARBINE STOCK COMPLETE
(MILITARY TUBE)

They sell the complete kits. With the XM177E2, you will need a 2-position buffer tube (repros from Nodak Spud) to go with Essential Arms' mil-spec stock. You may even want to call Essential Arms to see if you can just get the stock body. The XM177E2 uses a Delta ring, not the flat ring. They were mostly gray. Mine is gray.

**elephant** · 10-09-15, 14:17

Originally Posted by ClassIIIGunsmith

You know building retros are expensive because of the fact that most of the parts are no longer made. So when the parts dry up, the price for retros will increase which means that you are investing in more ways than just fun. Its cheaper and ok not having an exact replica with me because I'm a little bit of a penny pincher my self. But in general these retro projects are kinda money pits but definitely cheaper than the real ones that are more than +$25K but have more goodies.

that is so true. I wanted original as possible. No reproduction. I tracked down an Colt A1 style grip that was NOS and had to shell out $75, a original Colt flat delta ring assembly cost $50, original car stock with 2 position buffer tube was $150 and a original Colt A1 style (tear drop f/a) upper I bought for $375 and I am still shy a barrel, lower, BCG but I know when this is finished I will sleep better at nights.

**halo2304** · 10-09-15, 22:37

My comment about this project being a 'money pit' was about how I've tied up money in parts I won't be using. I can and will eventually sell them, but in the meantime I don't really have the capital to buy other parts such as the stripped 6520 barrel that got away.
Speaking of barrels, anyone know a good source for a 12.5", 14.5" or 16" pencil barrel assembly with a carbine gas system that's also .625" at the gas port? I seems everyone does 11.5", .75" at the gas port or mid-length gas systems. I don't want to slouch on the barrel because once the moderator is pinned & welded, it'll be a bitch to swap it out. I'm still apprehensive about sacrificing my 6520 upper. I just like it the way it is despite the A2 upper receiver.
The butt stocks I'm seeing on the used market are as I said, expensive Colt stocks or the Essential Arms commercial stocks. It's a piece of the puzzle I can swap out later. Ess Arms' webiste leaves a little to be desired, IMHO, when they say to call for pricing. (Renegade, thanks for the info. I've seen E2 builds with gray deltas as well as flat rings.)

Sorry if I seem a little wishy-washy or scatter brained about this project. It seems to be my process when picking out parts to use. My AR9 pistol was the same way except I didn't talk much about it until after it was assembled. The retro parts I'm finding don't seem to be too much more expensive than modern parts, but then again, I'm not looking for New, In Wrapper items. The "experienced" parts add to the charm, IMO.

**militarymoron** · 10-13-15, 22:21

i bought the colt 16" light weight barrel from brownells and had it cut down. out of stock at the moment though: http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts...prod71164.aspx

also, essential arms was great to deal with on the phone. i purchased just their aluminum stock body from them as i wanted to use a regular buffer tube with 6 positions.

**halo2304** · 02-24-16, 21:08

[2/24/16 UPDATE]
I found a Daniel Defense 12.5" barrel, NIW and picked up a hand guard cap (free thanks to a friend) and a FSB with taper pins. Since I started this project, Brownells announced a partnership with NDS and will be offering A1 lowers as well as other retro parts. (Yay!) I still need to source a gray delta ring and a lock washer for the moderator. Even though it's going to be pinned & welded, I think it's a detail that is needed. I also need to find someone to mount the FSB. I know there's ADCO and Rainier, but not sure who else. As for pinning the moderator, I know a welder and have a drill press, so it doesn't seem like it would be too hard to do myself if I'm careful. I might wait to pin the moderator on and test it on my pistol lower.

Here's what I have so far, minus some smaller parts.