Still think ceramic armor is "better" than steel?

[AndrewWiggin]

Is it ever really accurate to say that one thing is categorically "better" than another thing? I mean, except beer. Beer is definitely better than not having beer. For drinking.

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While ceramic armor can stop some threats that steel armor can't and ceramic is sometimes marginally lighter (some steel plates are actually lighter than some ceramic plates of similar size), it is also thicker and less durable as well as significantly more expensive.

If .30-06 AP is a likely threat for you and if you can afford to replace a plate if you suspect it has been damaged, and if you expect that replacement plates will be available when you need them, ceramic may be a good choice.

If you don't think that armor piercing ammo is a high probability in your area, and if you intend to actually use your plates before they are needed, steel may give you more peace of mind.

Ceramic isn't quite as fragile as many would have you believe. If your plate carrier fell off your vehicle or if it is subjected to a bumpy road in your trunk, or if you trip and fall on a rock, it will probably still be fine. This test shows that a steel plate will still be fine and will survive much more than you can.

[lymanbishop]

Steel can blow spall up in your face. The anti-spall coatings are getting better but in my opinion as a mechanical engineer that has been in the armor industry for over 10 years, you need polymer / ceramic composite armor. Its light, durable and can handle multi-hits. There's a reason cops and military don't use steel. You can buy some at my site www.hoplitearmor.com 855-ARMOR-01

[AndrewWiggin]

Yeah, the reason is that they use our money to buy their armor and if they suspect damage, they can simply replace it immediately with another taxpayer purchased plate. Cops who buy their own armor often choose steel because of its durability. Private citizens who purchase armor often do so with the expectation that if they ever need it, there won't be a way to purchase a replacement in the event it is damaged.

The word "spall" refers to fragments of steel that can be loosened from the BACK of a plate and that doesn't really happen with steel body armor. What you're referring to is fragmentation, which is completely absorbed by a good fragmentation coating. It takes so many rounds to delaminate the frag coating that a ceramic plate would be a bag of gravel before a steel plate started letting fragments out.

Both are legitimate options, with different pros and cons.

[lymanbishop]

Wikipedia; Spall are flakes of a material that are broken off a larger solid body and can be produced by a variety of mechanisms, including as a result of projectile impact, corrosion, weathering, cavitation, or excessive rolling pressure (as in a ball bearing). Spalling and spallation both describe the process of surface failure in which spall is shed.

Webster
Definition of SPALL
transitive verb
: to break up or reduce by or as if by chipping with a hammer
intransitive verb
1
: to break off chips, scales, or slabs : exfoliate
2
: to undergo spallation


I cringe when I hear talk of steel plates. But what do I know? I'm just a mechanical engineer with a decade of experience working with body armor.

[AndrewWiggin]

Sorry, not just the back of the plate, but the key is that "spall" refers to pieces of steel from the armor. What we typically see from steel body armor are pieces of bullet. In any case, spall and bullet fragments are captured by the fragmentation coating.

[lymanbishop]

Sorry, not just the back of the plate, but the key is that "spall" refers to pieces of steel from the armor. What we typically see from steel body armor are pieces of bullet. In any case, spall and bullet fragments are captured by the fragmentation coating.

They are caught by rhino liner, until their not. That's a risky game to play to run with heavy ass plates. Not trying to disrespect your choice, just trying to inform.

[AndrewWiggin]

Fragments are caught by the coating until so many rounds have struck it that a ceramic plate would have been a bag of gravel. And by the way, once fragments do start getting through, it still brats the snot out of being shot in the chest.

[JackFanToM]

The whole "many rounds" thing strikes me as a bit off. I understand that modern armor is designed to take "multiple" impacts, but it is my understanding that those multiples are in a single encounter. I imagine even steel plates should be replaced after an encounter...if it was my life, I wouldn't want to chance it that either steel or ceramic wasn't compromised somewhat after being hit. I would also assume that not too many individuals have more than a few encounters where they have been saved by body armor, so I'd imagine, unless you plan to go into combat you probably aren't overly concerned with having to replace your plates. As for SHTF scenarios, fun to talk about but highly unlikely, so I wouldn't plan my plate replacement around end of the world scenarios.

[lymanbishop]

Fragments are caught by the coating until so many rounds have struck it that a ceramic plate would have been a bag of gravel. And by the way, once fragments do start getting through, it still brats the snot out of being shot in the chest.

I have spoken. You have been warned. Best of luck.

[AndrewWiggin]

The whole "many rounds" thing strikes me as a bit off. I understand that modern armor is designed to take "multiple" impacts, but it is my understanding that those multiples are in a single encounter. I imagine even steel plates should be replaced after an encounter...if it was my life, I wouldn't want to chance it that either steel or ceramic wasn't compromised somewhat after being hit. I would also assume that not too many individuals have more than a few encounters where they have been saved by body armor, so I'd imagine, unless you plan to go into combat you probably aren't overly concerned with having to replace your plates. As for SHTF scenarios, fun to talk about but highly unlikely, so I wouldn't plan my plate replacement around end of the world scenarios.

Not all armor is equal. Some ceramic plates will take more than others, but some can be be penetrated if one round strikes within an inch or two of another. The odds of that might be pretty low, but it can happen pretty easily at close range.

I agree that getting shot shouldn't be a lifestyle choice and if a plate is hit it should be replaced. If you can. Many people buy armor for SHTF/WROL, though.