Loaded for Bear - Is 10mm Sufficient?

[sinister]

Jeebus.

Please, keep it on point.

If you don't routinely hunt, play, fish, or live in large bear country keep the "What if" arguments to a minimum. Of course people don't always walk around with a freaking FAL or M1 on their back when fly angling, hiking, or snowmobiling.

Biggest moose I ever ran into was at an inadvertant 50 feet -- armed with a walking stick and 4-weight fly rod. A micro 9mm or 228 wouldn't have made me feel any better.

Browns and griz have bigger claws and fangs -- moose have a certain panache all their own. Having a gun in bear country makes sense -- does it necessarily have to be as big as a pack howitzer for going about life?

[GJM]

Pictures from a recent attack:


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7f3_1462381273


Sent from my iPad

[Alaskapopo]

Jeebus.

Please, keep it on point.

If you don't routinely hunt, play, fish, or live in large bear country keep the "What if" arguments to a minimum. Of course people don't always walk around with a freaking FAL or M1 on their back when fly angling, hiking, or snowmobiling.

Biggest moose I ever ran into was at an inadvertant 50 feet -- armed with a walking stick and 4-weight fly rod. A micro 9mm or 228 wouldn't have made me feel any better.

Browns and griz have bigger claws and fangs -- moose have a certain panache all their own. Having a gun in bear country makes sense -- does it necessarily have to be as big as a pack howitzer for going about life?

Yet moose kill more people than bear up here. Last moose I saw was a mamma bedding down with her calves in my back yard two days ago. As with all wind animals respect them and give them space and you will generally have no problems at all.

Pat

[Eurodriver]

I have the opportunity to get a 10mm Glock 20 Gen 3 w/ 5 magazines, OEM sights, and 400 rounds of plinking ammo and 100 rounds of hollow points for $700 trade value (of something I don't really need and have two of)

I have two questions.

Is that a decent deal?

What benefits does a G20 have over a G19? I mean, I know 10mm vs 9mm, but the capacity is the same.

From reading this thread it seems like the G20 has no advantage over the G19 as far as ballistics are concerned?

[soulezoo]

I have the opportunity to get a 10mm Glock 20 Gen 3 w/ 5 magazines, OEM sights, and 400 rounds of plinking ammo and 100 rounds of hollow points for $700 trade value (of something I don't really need and have two of)

I have two questions.

Is that a decent deal?

What benefits does a G20 have over a G19? I mean, I know 10mm vs 9mm, but the capacity is the same.

From reading this thread it seems like the G20 has no advantage over the G19 as far as ballistics are concerned?

Not quite. That's like saying the .44 magnum has no advantage over the .357 mag. I think that is a relevant comparison. The advantage is ~380 ftlbs energy at muzzle for the 9mm and over 700 ftlbs energy for the 10 on hotter loads.

If that is a low mileage g20, then yes, that is a decent deal. The ammo alone being worth maybe $250 or so on the low side. Basically like paying a normal price with 3 free mags thrown in. 10mm ammo is expensive. That is the real downside to owning a 10.

[Eurodriver]

Thanks for that. So what would one use a G20 for vs. a G19? It appears to be inadequate for dangerous animals per this thread, and I'd grab the 19 100% of the time for biped threats.

[Coal Dragger]

You could use it for handgun hunting. Should be very useful for deer sized game.

[soulezoo]

Thanks for that. So what would one use a G20 for vs. a G19? It appears to be inadequate for dangerous animals per this thread, and I'd grab the 19 100% of the time for biped threats.

That question falls into the "to each, his own" category that is simply personal to the user. In other words, really no right or wrong answer. Frankly, I prefer the 10 for bipeds. Makes me feel better. That is all the justification I need. Of course yours is different and that is ok by me certainly.

As far as dangerous game goes, I'd rather have something stronger than the 10 for griz and above for the same reasons I'd rather have the 10 than a 9 for smaller critters. Again my choice and am not critical of others who choose differently.

That said, I am entirely comfortable with the 10 for black bear and cougar. I would use it on gators too. But being the smartest guy in Florida, you already knew this. ;-)

I have used the 10 on a nice broadside shot on a deer that dressed out about 180. (Columbia blacktail are not large deer) That was about a 50 yard shot and the deer ran about 20 yards before collapsing.

[AKDoug]

Pictures from a recent attack:


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7f3_1462381273


Sent from my iPad

It happened about 50 air miles from me, in an area I frequently hunt. The full story isn't out yet, but I heard it was killed with a handgun. I will update when I find out more. They evac'd to a lodge that a friend of mine owns. Oddly enough, in comments made on another forum, the lodge owner says he's switching to a Glock in 10mm really soon. When I found out why, I will post.

[Uprange41]

Thanks for that. So what would one use a G20 for vs. a G19? It appears to be inadequate for dangerous animals per this thread, and I'd grab the 19 100% of the time for biped threats.

I can't speak for anyone but me, but I carry my 21 on hiking/backpacking trips in black bear land, and setting it up for .45 Super, .460 Rowland, or getting a 20 is on the docket to fill that role (admittedly, has been for a couple years now). I probably wouldn't opt to use it as a primary defensive gun for anything larger, but I also haven't done any honest research into the ballistics of heavy/hard service cartridge loads, or the dynamics of brown bear and moose encounters. Black bears are the biggest things around here, but they aren't the baddest, and I can accept a less powerful cartridge that I can still employ effectively against armed bipeds.. which are my biggest concerns when I'm out on trails or camping.

So, the answer really depends on where you live and what's around. It's a good hunting gun, though, as mentioned.

Also, this thread has been a very interesting read. I try to stay out of the few constructive "bear gun" threads, as brown bears are out of my lane.... Thanks TacMedic for putting this out there.