New here.

[soulezoo]

^^^^ agreed.

Except perhaps to gain some knowledge on the platform, but then backhandly disparages the platform.

Dave, I am going to guess that you're a "seasoned" citizen at this point. The posts sound like someone whose experience lies some 40-50 years ago... and has not refreshed his knowledge based and thinking based on lessons since. In other words, stuck in the past with outdated thinking. I don't mean that in a way to sound insulting.

[26 Inf]

Something's very odd about this thread or the OP is horrible at explaining himself.

Either way, given his distaste for an M4 carbine, I find it odd that he would join a site aptly named, M4Carbine.net.

On the other hand, kudos for caring enough to buy a 22 trainer that mimics and issued weapon he doesn't, at this point, particularly care for. Most cops (I assume) wouldn't do that.

[26 Inf]

Dave,

At one point we were coming from the same place - I loved the M-14, hated the M16, while I was in the service, probably because I never had to carry and use an M-14 in the jungle

I started LE with the DA revolver, and while not kicking and screaming, initially I did not wholeheartedly embrace the auto-pistol as a duty weapon. Much of this was due to the fact that I had spent a great deal of time honing tactical skills with the revolver - if you have to reload every 6 rounds, you better figure out a way to get it done quickly and surely, every time. Within a couple months of serious work with the Model 639 I was wondering why I had resisted. It has progressed from there.

I resisted the initial pull of the patrol rifle. As an LE trainer, I fully knew the propensity for most cops to never practice unless paid/required to do so. That coupled with the increased down range danger area with the AR in an urban street environment, made me an advocate of the pistol caliber carbine (Marlin Camp Rifle, and for a short time Ruger) for things beyond shotgun range.

Things change, and if we are going to be relevant and useful we have to have an open mind. The AR has replaced the M14 in service rifle competition. Cartridge design has made great strides, and' gasp, today I rarely clean a personal, non duty weapon, before I've fired several hundred rounds through it.

Rambling to the point, keep an open mind. I still have a couple wheel guns, but at last count over a dozen auto pistols. There will always be an M1 in my safe, as well as a bolt gun or two, but the rest is filled with them damn AR's I couldn't abide a decade ago.

Enjoy.

[Ryno12]

On the other hand, kudos for caring enough to buy a 22 trainer that mimics and issued weapon he doesn't, at this point, particularly care for. Most cops (I assume) wouldn't do that.

On the other hand, that's nowhere near what he said in the OP & it shouldn't take numerous posts from other members to try to decipher what he meant.

He's comparing an M1A to a Walther Colt 22LR AR. He says it feels like a toy. Well, it essentially is.
Switching to something new? Yep, that might feel odd at first too.

So what's the question??

[MegademiC]

On the other hand, that's nowhere near what he said in the OP & it shouldn't take numerous posts from other members to try to decipher what he meant.

He's comparing an M1A to a Walther Colt 22LR AR. He says it feels like a toy. Well, it essentially is.
Switching to something new? Yep, that might feel odd at first too.

So what's the question??

I think your missing it.

Op sounds "seasoned" as one guy put it, and probably not good with computers.

He uses an ar at work.

He bought 22 trainer to learn because the gun is way different than what he's used to.

I think he know he needs help and doesn't know where to begin, so he comes to m4carbine.net. makes sense to me.

OP, I suggest you get some professional training, nothing will teach you like a mentor right there. Stick with it, I'm sure you'll pick it up in no time.

[plain old dave]

OK, I'm finally in front of a proper computer and not a phone. I'm a Navy Reservist in a unit that specializes in Force Protection for Fleet Ballistic Missile submarines, and one of our arms is the M4A1. Being a (civilian) revolver and lever action guy, nothing on the tinker toy makes sense. The M1 and M14 are at least evolutionary in nature, but the AR just plain doesn't feel like a gun.

Maybe some personal background is in order; I joined the Navy back in 1990 and just went over 20 good years as a Active Duty Sailor and Reservist, including three tours at an HSL/HSM squadron. Have always thought hobbies should be enjoyable, so for guns I have gravitated into Victorian/Edwardian era stuff; a Remington 81 is a bit too modern for my taste. As a GMG/AO, I have been working on inelegant arms for decades, but never really had to SHOOT them til this unit. Shot gun, no big deal, outside the terrible fit and finish and mechanism that feels like it has gravel in it, not much difference between an M500A1 and a Winchester Model 12. Beltfed, point, pull trigger. Easy. M9, only real difference between it and my EDC Smith 1905 .32-20 is the decocker (which still leaves me uneasy (hammer drop to me STILL =Bang). Missed Expert by ONE POINT only having shot the M9 twice in my life.

But the AR. I will be very candid. I don't like them, and will have this trainer for sale the MINUTE I retire. Times may change, but physics doesn't. 147 or 168 grain bullets have more energy and killing power at any given range, and .308 bullets make bigger holes. But for now, I need to be able to show up on orders and deliver the goods; no notice, no problem. If I could find a local expert that wouldn't try and feed me the kool-aid (AR is the greatest weapons system EVAR), I would certainly be interested.

[Ryno12]

Much better, thanks.

When you are referring to the AR being a toy, are you talking about your 22LR or your duty M4's? Or both?

...and you're not that old. Surprised this is your first experience with an AR since you have over 20 years in the military.

[Mr. Goodtimes]

I smell troll... OP EDC'a a 1905 smith in 32-20? Right....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[plain old dave]

Much better, thanks.

When you are referring to the AR being a toy, are you talking about your 22LR or your duty M4's? Or both?

Both.

...and you're not that old. Surprised this is your first experience with an AR since you have over 20 years in the military.

Spent most of my career as an AO; in the squadron world, we FIX the guns the A-Dubs shoot. At Orlando, we shot the Colt Service Model Ace and no long arm.

Still, I'm looking forward to learning. Knowledge never hurts.

Edit: my EDC 32-20.

Stiff handloads from a 1950s vintage Lyman reloading manual put those 115 grain flatpoints right close to 38 Special +P. Gun was priced right too.

[strambo]

My first time in a combat zone, I was issued 2 guns I didn't like (a DA/SA auto and an AK47). Not only did I get over it, I dedicated myself to getting very good with them.

Now I see any combat or personal defense weapon as a tool and have no strong preference. They each have strong points and weak points is all. I don't like the M9 enough to own one, but I've carried one overseas in OIF and OEF and can run them very well. As to the decock issue, next time you do it look at the transfer bar, you'll see it rotates 90deg putting a chunk of metal between the hammer and firing pin making it impossible to fire.

Objectively, an AR with a light and RDS will blow something like an M14/M1A out of the water for general military/security work. It is lighter, more ergonomic, higher capacity, less recoil, and ease of accessory mounting.

Ignore your personal opinion on it. Set that .22 AR up like your duty gun, go to a carbine course and learn to run it like a top.