Were WWII 1911s reliable?

[Straight Shooter]

Ive had the chance to fire many WW2 guns, and was issued a 1911 my first two years in the USMC. Even documented the firing of an 1911 made in 1917 that was carried, and "used" by the lady's uncle who was a Sgt. in the Army during WW2. He brought the gun home. This particular piece, a friend and I tore down, looked at it, re-assembled it. Now, this pistol had a G.I. mag that had been loaded with G.I. ammo for over 50 years. We filmed me firing this pistol with that mag, and another with modern White Box ammo. Both shot way low for some reason, but was still 100% with even the old mag/ammo.
All the other 1911's Ive used, reliability was not the issue, at all. Ive seen a few that were accurate even by todays standards, but mostly the ones we were issued were worn slap out and not accurate for shit. As for lack of training..YES..thats a huge issue. In the early eighties, pistol training in the Corps was...lacking, to say the least. Most techniques used now were a decades away from being invented. As I had owned a Series 70 for years prior to entering service, and was, and still am a huge fan of Col. Cooper...I was "up" on its use and how to run it. WAY ahead of everybody else.
Were I to ever use an old G.I. gun for personal SD..Id get one that was rebuilt and tight, put on aftermarket sights, re-spring it entirely with Wolff springs, and use new Wilson or Tripp mags, and put on aftermarket grips.

[glocktogo]

Ive had the chance to fire many WW2 guns, and was issued a 1911 my first two years in the USMC. Even documented the firing of an 1911 made in 1917 that was carried, and "used" by the lady's uncle who was a Sgt. in the Army during WW2. He brought the gun home. This particular piece, a friend and I tore down, looked at it, re-assembled it. Now, this pistol had a G.I. mag that had been loaded with G.I. ammo for over 50 years. We filmed me firing this pistol with that mag, and another with modern White Box ammo. Both shot way low for some reason, but was still 100% with even the old mag/ammo.
All the other 1911's Ive used, reliability was not the issue, at all. Ive seen a few that were accurate even by todays standards, but mostly the ones we were issued were worn slap out and not accurate for shit. As for lack of training..YES..thats a huge issue. In the early eighties, pistol training in the Corps was...lacking, to say the least. Most techniques used now were a decades away from being invented. As I had owned a Series 70 for years prior to entering service, and was, and still am a huge fan of Col. Cooper...I was "up" on its use and how to run it. WAY ahead of everybody else.
Were I to ever use an old G.I. gun for personal SD..Id get one that was rebuilt and tight, put on aftermarket sights, re-spring it entirely with Wolff springs, and use new Wilson or Tripp mags, and put on aftermarket grips.

I think that applies to any 60+ year old GI gun. I picked up a 43 Inland M1 Carbine and it was pitifully unreliable. Installed a Wolff spring kit for the whole gun (including mags) and it ran flawless. As you re-spring it, you also have a chance to clear out decades old lubricants that have long since turned to varnish. I used a lot of 0000 steel wool on that gun and the gunk removed was amazing.

[Straight Shooter]

I think that applies to any 60+ year old GI gun. I picked up a 43 Inland M1 Carbine and it was pitifully unreliable. Installed a Wolff spring kit for the whole gun (including mags) and it ran flawless. As you re-spring it, you also have a chance to clear out decades old lubricants that have long since turned to varnish. I used a lot of 0000 steel wool on that gun and the gunk removed was amazing.

Agreed 100%...the cleaning is critical, there is 50-60 + year old gunk in these guns!

[SeriousStudent]

http://www.gunlab.net/wp-content/upl...anufacture.pdf

A fascinating read. Thank you for posting that.

[BigBuckeye]

I am not near my bookshelf but I have a VERY good book on this topic...I believe it is "weapons of the US Military during WWII" or something close to that. The book is fist hand accounts of soldiers from WWII speaking solely on their weapons. Long story short....pretty much 100% of the comments on the 1911 were of it being loved and the .45 of being a sledgehammer. By the way..,no surprise....everyone loved the Garand too.

[T2C]

It seems one needs to spends quite a few dollars to get a 1911 these days that isn't a plain jam o matic or at best something you can't trust your life to.

Obviously 1911s of the 1940s were mass produced side arms without the custom fitting most good 1911s get today.

Did they work well? If so, how? Was it the lack of hollow point ammo?

What about in mud and dirt?

It must be pure dumb luck, but I've purchased a few 1911's over the past 30 years that were not "jam o matics" and I shoot the daylights out of them. I carry a P938 (quasi 1911 clone) during the summer months and a full size 1911 during the heavy clothing months with confidence they will work if needed. A properly built 1911 will feed HP ammunition without issue.

The new polymer pistols are very reliable, but there is nothing like a 1911 IMHO.

[DirectTo]

The new polymer pistols are very reliable, but there is nothing like a 1911 IMHO.

The 1911 is a fine gun without a doubt, but they can't really be compared to modern polymer wonder guns. Two different platforms designed at two very different times. A well designed 1911 should have no problem with modern JHP ammo and be more than capable as a defensive weapon, but just about anything is going to weigh less on the hip and offer more capacity, even in .45 ACP. In the grand scheme of things, anything aside from a gamer gun should be reliable and powerful enough with modern ammo to serve defensively after a initial shakedown. Anything beyond that is just preference.

[ww2farmer]

My first 1911 was a 1943 production Remington Rand that was a beater in every sense of the word.....little finish left, minor pitting on the frame and slide, sounded like a rattle when you shook it. I paid $300 for it over 20 years ago. When I got it, the firing pin was broken ,so I changed that and the spring, and then I couldn't get through a full mag without a malfunction. I fully disassembled it, and the three mags it came with. Let every part soak in a bucket of fuel oil for a day, wiped it dry, reassembled it and the mags with new springs............and shot the piss out of for the next 20 years without very many malfunctions............except for when I used Remington UMC 230gr FMJ, for some reason it HATED that ammo. I don't know how many rounds it had through it before I got it, but I personally put two WW2 surplus spam cans of USGI ammo through it over the years (one brass case WW can, one steel case ECC can) a case of wolf, a case of winchester white box, untold #'s of misc mfg 50 rd boxes of 230gr ball ammo, and thousands of my own 230gr plated reloads. It was never a tack driver, but under 10 yards put them where they needed to be. It was my glove box, tractor cab, and walking around fixing fences gun for all those years....basically my EDC. I think those old GI 1911's would run and run............if they were taken care of, and, much like anything else, wouldn't if they were neglected. I could have very easily had a bad taste in my mouth from it, and with 1911's in general had I not rolled up my sleeves and dove into it, and if a dumb dirt farmer like me with a few basic things and enough knowledge of them to only be dangerous with could make it run, I think anyone could.

Speaking of that gun...... I am not a collector, and know these things were not going down in value, so I decided to retire it, and part ways with her before I broke it,lost it or something worse happened to it. I sold it 6 months ago with the 3 GI mags it came with for $1200. I was always happy with it (after the initial shake down), but I am also happy with what I got back out of it. Three guns have taken it's place. A S&W 9mm Shield as my EDC, a Ruger SR1911 as my range toy 1911, and a Rock Island GI 1911 as my farm gun. All three of those have been 100%, and it's nice to have some newer stuff that I don't feel guilty about beating on. My only other 1911 as of now (I will buy more) is a Colt 01911A1 WW2 replica I bought when they came out in the early 2000's because it was a close to a "new" Colt GI style pistol as my farm hand budget would ever allow.

[Ironbutt]

The 1911's I used in the Marines from 1966-70 were all reliable. I'm getting old, but I don't remember any malfunctions. They were probably the same guns that my Dad used in WW II & they were probably old then.

None of them had any finish left, the slides were loose by todays standards & they weren't going to win any matches, but they always worked. We kept them clean & lubricated, but otherwise we treated them like crap. After a range day, or coming in from training, we'd all detail strip them, put all the parts in a bucket of dry cleaning fluid, scrub the parts with a toothbrush, a little oil & put them back together. And, no, we didn't keep our parts separate. Whatever extractor, barrel, mainspring housing, etc you picked out of the bucket, are the ones that went in your gun.

[T2C]

The 1911 is a fine gun without a doubt, but they can't really be compared to modern polymer wonder guns. Two different platforms designed at two very different times. A well designed 1911 should have no problem with modern JHP ammo and be more than capable as a defensive weapon, but just about anything is going to weigh less on the hip and offer more capacity, even in .45 ACP. In the grand scheme of things, anything aside from a gamer gun should be reliable and powerful enough with modern ammo to serve defensively after a initial shakedown. Anything beyond that is just preference.

I won't dispute the polymer handguns are better service pistols for the rank and file, they definitely are. Magazine capacity is a huge advantage over a single stack 1911. I own a few Glocks that I shoot regularly and I think they are fine pistols. I still shoot better El Presidente scores using a 1911 with factory 230g fmj than I do shooting a Glock 34 with reloads barely making minor power factor. I guess it's a matter of what you cut your teeth on when you started shooting semi-automatics.