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Thread: Old Medic Pack

  1. #1
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    Old Medic Pack

    I know this thing is old school and I was about to move its contents to a spare backpack that's built similar to an Army medium sized ruck, just smaller and chunk this. But then I got to thinking about all the individual pouches that I'm going to lose because no one makes a packs that are this well organized. At least not for less than $200... Albeit ancient looking.
    So my question is this.

    1. Should I break like items up in ziplock bags (I have some huge ones) and move my "combat lifesaver" supplies to a pack easier to carry around? (I have several spare packs)
    2. Does anyone have a load plan they could share? I tried some old TM's but no luck. I'm good on my trauma kits on my chest rigs. Docsherm provided me a list of trauma items and I stick to that. But this is like a spare first aid bag plus.
    Not just GSW or other trauma. I have stuff to replen my chest rigs ifaks like spare ACE bandages, spare moleskin, plastic tape etc. but I also have different size bandages. Think Army first aid kit in the green plastic box + stuff you'd find in your medicine cabinet at home. Acetaminophen, cold medicine, antibiotic ointments, water treatment, alcohol pads, epipens (not for me) soap, space blankets EMT shears, hydration tabs, scent free cream for sore muscles.... So you can see it's not my typical ifak/trauma kit. But it's not meant to be. So I was thinking I could bounce my load plan off what was supposed to be in here just to make sure I didn't miss anything. I do need to get some new splints. The kind you roll up. Or is there a list of items for this type of scenario?

    The idea here was to have a med kit that I could grab-n-go without having to empty drawers or go through the cabinets should we need to leave the house sooner than later.




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    Last edited by RobertTheTexan; 05-04-17 at 14:10.
    "Texas has yet to learn submission to any oppression, come from what source it may."
    ~ Sam Houston

    “The liberties of our country, the freedom of our civil constitution, are worth defending against all hazards: And it is our duty to defend them against all attacks.”
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  2. #2
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    First, organization is key with an aid bag. Everything has its place, and not without its space.

    Second, for general purpose use, most people are best suited to keeping aid bags simple, contents within their scope of training, and having items that can fill multiple roles.

    IE A SAM splint can be a splint, a pelvic binder, a cervical collar, and can be stored as a protective lining in a pouch. A Nalgene bottle can be used as a junctional TQ. Etc.

    I shot you a PM, and will gather my thoughts on this tonight or tomorrow and post something.

  3. #3
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    Fantastic - thanks GTF!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    "Texas has yet to learn submission to any oppression, come from what source it may."
    ~ Sam Houston

    “The liberties of our country, the freedom of our civil constitution, are worth defending against all hazards: And it is our duty to defend them against all attacks.”
    ~ Sam Adams

  4. #4
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    Staying within your certification is essential. Don't carry stuff that you have no training on. Keeping stuff simple is crucial as you are going to stabilize and evacuate to a location where a trauma surgeon is available. To this day we have medics in the field trying to play God when a basic EMT produces a better outcome by simply stabilizing the patient and load n go to the trauma center.

    FWIW, your kit looks better than a lot of bags that I see on engine companies.

  5. #5
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    I still work with Active Duty guys. I will be sure and ask for their load plan as soon as I see one of them in the Motor Pool.

  6. #6
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    I'm gonna tackle this as best as I can, and try to keep it neat and to the point. Medicine, like everything, has differing opinions. Your needs may be slightly out of line with what I'm thinking, as I'm approaching this with the mentality of a "BLS Only Jump Bag".


    Quote Originally Posted by RobertTheTexan View Post
    I know this thing is old school and I was about to move its contents to a spare backpack that's built similar to an Army medium sized ruck, just smaller and chunk this.
    Go for it. Sew velcro inside the ruck if need be and either drop the coin on inserts, or home brew them with old BDUs. Cut them up, sew them into 6x6 pouches, and sew some velcro on. Depends on how arts and crafty you want to get.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobertTheTexan View Post
    But then I got to thinking about all the individual pouches that I'm going to lose because no one makes a packs that are this well organized. At least not for less than $200... Albeit ancient looking.
    If you keep it, your bag is fine for this role.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobertTheTexan View Post
    So my question is this.

    1. Should I break like items up in ziplock bags (I have some huge ones) and move my "combat lifesaver" supplies to a pack easier to carry around? (I have several spare packs)
    Yes. I keep a small aid bag in my Jeep that was the top pouch from an Eberlestock ruck. It's built to manage MARCH-PAWS for one critical/two priority patients with a pocket BVM tossed in.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobertTheTexan View Post
    2. Does anyone have a load plan they could share? I tried some old TM's but no luck. I'm good on my trauma kits on my chest rigs. Docsherm provided me a list of trauma items and I stick to that. But this is like a spare first aid bag plus.
    Most pre-hospital emergencies are medical complications vs trauma. The good news is that there's about **** all you can do for most medical in the pre-hospital environment, and trauma is fairly straight forward.

    I'm writing out a packing list now. I'll edit this eventually and post what I carry, and what I recommend and why.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobertTheTexan View Post
    Not just GSW or other trauma. I have stuff to replen my chest rigs ifaks like spare ACE bandages, spare moleskin, plastic tape etc. but I also have different size bandages. Think Army first aid kit in the green plastic box + stuff you'd find in your medicine cabinet at home. Acetaminophen, cold medicine, antibiotic ointments, water treatment, alcohol pads, epipens (not for me) soap, space blankets EMT shears, hydration tabs, scent free cream for sore muscles.... So you can see it's not my typical ifak/trauma kit. But it's not meant to be. So I was thinking I could bounce my load plan off what was supposed to be in here just to make sure I didn't miss anything. I do need to get some new splints. The kind you roll up. Or is there a list of items for this type of scenario?
    36" SAM splints are a God send. Get at least 2 of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobertTheTexan View Post
    The idea here was to have a med kit that I could grab-n-go without having to empty drawers or go through the cabinets should we need to leave the house sooner than later.
    This is gonna be pretty tough, because we can "what if" all day. I'll try to make an easy to carry, easy to use packing list that will cover the basics, but the crux is going to be portability.
    Last edited by GTF425; 05-04-17 at 16:17.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krazykarl View Post
    Staying within your certification is essential. Don't carry stuff that you have no training on. Keeping stuff simple is crucial as you are going to stabilize and evacuate to a location where a trauma surgeon is available. To this day we have medics in the field trying to play God when a basic EMT produces a better outcome by simply stabilizing the patient and load n go to the trauma center.

    FWIW, your kit looks better than a lot of bags that I see on engine companies.
    Thanks Krazy. It's pretty basic. I try to stay in my lane. Especially with things that could cause more harm than good. So I pack the stuff I know I can use. I've been first on scene at some pretty horrible accidents and quickly figured out what I can and cannot do. Wait. I meant as a a soldier driving down the road, or as a civilian rolling up in a bad car wrecks or motorcycle wrecks. I am by no means an EMT guy.



    Quote Originally Posted by Averageman View Post
    I still work with Active Duty guys. I will be sure and ask for their load plan as soon as I see one of them in the Motor Pool.
    Thanks AM. I appreciate it. I think GTF is going to get me squared up.
    "Texas has yet to learn submission to any oppression, come from what source it may."
    ~ Sam Houston

    “The liberties of our country, the freedom of our civil constitution, are worth defending against all hazards: And it is our duty to defend them against all attacks.”
    ~ Sam Adams

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobertTheTexan View Post
    I think GTF is going to get me squared up.
    Shot you a PM.

  9. #9
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    For public consumption:

    Older Ranger Medic Handbook. A big book of "Not My Scope" for most, but fantastic reference material if you know what this is. I have the newest edition as a textbook, and the non-ALS material is pretty much the same.

    http://www.patriotresistance.com/Ran...ok_2007_1_.pdf

    Get these:

    Tactical Combat Casualty Care: Lessons and Best Practices https://www.amazon.com/dp/1502430614..._9teezbNE46Q0F

    Wilderness First Responder: How To Recognize, Treat, And Prevent Emergencies In The Backcountry https://www.amazon.com/dp/0762754567..._VueezbQFJ4PM4


    None of this replaces quality training. Get into a CPR/First Aid class, and if you're seriously looking for "tactical" medicine, most TECC classes don't require EMS creds or previous EMT training.

  10. #10
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    First, that's a great bag. It's the old M5, which was a classic. We used them, and you can still find them in the field here and there.

    Second, regarding load-outs and organization, if you can find a copy of the Special Operations Medical Handbook, they have a section with some suggested load-outs. If I recall, they are ALICE-centric; at the time, Pararescue carried a full ALICE with a medical load. I have a handbook somewhere I was issued, I will see if I can find it and get the load-out contents and organization.

    While the old mantra "two is one, one is none" rings true, there are areas of overkill. The caveat being if you plan on this being a mounted bag (i.e., you don't carry it but instead grab stuff out of it), then weight is not as important.

    You don't need BVMs, cervical collars, any of that stuff. A mouth-facemask, sure, a BVM, no. KISS reigns supreme. Remember, stuff has expiration dates and can be heat-sensitive, so rotate stock, ESPECIALLY meds.

    The old Army green plastic boxes are great for breakables, gallon-size zip-locks are great for other stuff.

    You have snivel gear in your list (cream for sore muscles, etc). Separate all the snivel gear into a totally different section.

    Remember, you are not gearing up to fix anything. You can't fix anything in the field, all you can do is mitigate and prolong a status quo until definitive treatment.

    Did I say what a great bag that is? I'd love to have another.

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