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Thread: 20 inch AR group size too large??

  1. #1
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    Question 20 inch AR group size too large??

    These are from a Windham “20 inch Gov’t. Rifle” with a LaRue MBT and no optics.

    Do I have a lemon? Shouldn't my groups be smaller? I'm waiting to hear back from WW...



    Last edited by Chef BRD; 07-20-17 at 17:46.

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    With iron sights? From my perspective, having bad vision, seems fine. If you're really anal about the barrel's potential I'd say put a scope on it, get some match ammo and a lead sled before you go swapping barrels


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    My 7 iron is more accurate than my capabilities. Same with my AR.

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    Thanks for your reply...

    Yes, with as issued iron sights and my 61 y.o. eyes.
    Perhaps, I'm expecting too much.

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    What's the extreme spread of those groups?
    Anything within 2" I'd accept using a normal a normal at with m855. Even a bit larger could be ok.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chef BRD View Post
    These are from a Windham “20 inch Gov’t. Rifle” with a LaRue MBT and no optics.

    Do I have a lemon? Shouldn't my groups be smaller? I'm waiting to hear back from WW...
    Shooting position? Gun supported or rested in some way?
    Your level of experience and ability, formal marksmanship training?
    It's almost certainly you, nothing to do with the gun or ammo.

    Try as solid a rest or support as you can make, with as small of a target as you can align the sights to.
    2012 National Zumba Endurance Champion
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    I too have the WW government which is now scoped. But with the factory sights (rear on carry handle), I could easily punch a nickel size group at 50 meters with a full magazine using a single sandbag. Possibly you (eyesight, etc). I've never tried your listed ammunition through my WW. The only two I've run are the basic Winchester Q3131 and Wolf Gold. I do want to run some 70+ grain at 200/300 meters or so to see how it does. I turn 67 soon but fortunately I still have 20/10 vision thanks to LASIK back in 2004/5. I have a feeling you just need to dial it in a bit more and perhaps refine your technique. Hard to say if not there. But if your vision is correctable, I'd likely make that my foundation from which to build accuracy and consistency. Good luck. Funny thing: When I first got the Windham and was zeroing the hard sights, the only adjustment I made was a tiny windage movement to the left which gave me about a 1/4" improvement at 50 meters. Left it right there. Could barely detect any movement on the center rear sight line. To say the least, I was impressed and pretty happy about that.

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    Looks good to me based on the ammo used.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ST911 View Post
    Shooting position? Seated Gun supported or rested in some way? Sandbags on bench
    Your level of experience and ability, formal marksmanship training? Military / private sector
    It's almost certainly you, nothing to do with the gun or ammo. Perhaps...not my first rodeo

    Try as solid a rest or support as you can make, with as small of a target as you can align the sights to.

    See above

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    Nice shooting. Put on a good scope and I bet you will get the same groups at 100yds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MegademiC View Post
    What's the extreme spread of those groups?
    Anything within 2" I'd accept using a normal a normal at with m855. Even a bit larger could be ok.
    Please refer to the modified pics above.

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMMA View Post
    Nice shooting. Put on a good scope and I bet you will get the same groups at 100yds.
    I don't know...I'm thinking about selling the upper for one from White Oak Armament.
    Does anyone who competes in NRA Service Rifle care to offer their opinion on the groups?
    Last edited by Chef BRD; 07-15-17 at 12:02.

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