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Thread: American Bar Association Asks States to Adopt Firearm Confiscation Laws

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eurodriver View Post
    It would be your style to defend someone joking about murder.

    Hey, as long as they agree with you right?

    Fairly confident I could find a post of you decrying the intolerant left when they "joke" about killing gun owners or Cis white males.

    Are you over the age of 50?
    Seriously, I quickly realized that his remark was over the top joking around.

    Take a cue from the title of the song and Get Over It

    Better yet, take a look at the lyrics and adopt them as your anthem:

    I turn on the tube and what do I see
    A whole lotta people cryin' "Don't blame me"
    They point their crooked little fingers at everybody else
    Spend all their time feelin' sorry for themselves
    Victim of this, victim of that
    Your momma's too thin; your daddy's too fat

    Get over it
    Get over it
    All this whinin' and cryin' and pitchin' a fit
    Get over it, get over it

    You say you haven't been the same since you had your little crash
    But you might feel better if they gave you some cash
    The more I think about it, Old Billy was right (you could delete these offensive lyrics and the song still hangs)
    Let's kill all the lawyers, kill 'em tonight

    You don't want to work; you want to live like a king
    But the big, bad world doesn't owe you a thing

    Get over it
    Get over it
    If you don't want to play, then you might as well split
    Get over it, get over it

    It's like going to confession every time I hear you speak
    You're makin' the most of your losin' streak
    Some call it sick, but I call it weak

    You drag it around like a ball and chain
    You wallow in the guilt; you wallow in the pain
    You wave it like a flag, you wear it like a crown
    Got your mind in the gutter, bringin' everybody down
    Complain about the present and blame it on the past
    I'd like to find your inner child and kick its little ass

    Get over it
    Get over it
    All this bitchin' and moanin' and pitchin' a fit
    Get over it, get over it

    Get over it
    Get over it
    It's gotta stop sometime, so why don't you quit
    Get over it, get over it

    Get over it
    Last edited by 26 Inf; 08-23-17 at 09:28.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteyrAUG View Post
    The only problem I have is how often a "charge" of domestic violence carries much the same weight and restriction of rights as a "conviction" of DV. That combined with "false claims" of DV being almost SOP in any divorce case where custody or support is going to be contested.
    Yep, it sucks to be charged with ANY crime.

    Unless a police report was made at the time, is the judge hearing the case going to be able to summarily grant an ex parte order telling the other party to turn in their weapons?

    That does sound good as an unsubstantiated internet talking point, though.

    As FromMyColdDeadHand posted: If we want to keep our toys and cool stuff we need have a way to keep guns out of and take guns away from crazy people. Some people objectively should not have guns. We need to figure out a way to keep them out of the hands of people that will hurt others or themselves. Considering that suicides are a major cause of gun deaths, there are a lot of gun deaths that could be avoided and potentially a lot of lives saved. How to do that is a really tough question.

    I guess my problem is that I have actually arrested guys (and gals) for DV and trust that the system works the vast majority of the time.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpmuscle View Post
    See, when you say gun deaths or gun violence et al, what you really mean interpersonal violence. Atleast that which is not of the self-inflicted variety.

    At any rate how do you propose we keep 2 ton missiles on wheels out of the hands of would be harm doers? Freedom is scary I know.

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
    No, what I mean that intrapersonal, not interpersonal deaths are the key. 60% of gun deaths per year are suicides. People always talk about the 33,000 people per year killed by guns, never mind that 18,000 or so are suicides. Suicide is a mental health issue that won't be fixed by gun policy, but if the NRA had two brain cells they would be actively trying to reduce the number of overall gun deaths. Let the automotive industry worry about it when people start driving at high speed into bridge pilings to kill themselves.

    Gun deaths are driven by gang and suicide related.
    The Second Amendment ACKNOWLEDGES our right to own and bear arms that are in common use that can be used for lawful purposes. The arms can be restricted ONLY if subject to historical analogue from the founding era or is dangerous (unsafe) AND unusual.

    It's that simple.

  4. #34
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    I've had 3 coworkers going through divorce get slapped with versions restraining/protective orders. 2 were for DV and 1 for child abuse. All 3 fought them and had to spend $$ proving their innocence. IMO that is BS. Until these new orders are fact/evidence based methods to restrict folks constitutional rights I'll pass. Laws need to be set up to minimize judicial activism as much as possible. Not enable it. Loosely worded laws offer lawyers wiggle room to defend/attack and make $$. I can live with that to a degree. What I can't/won't live with is judicial activism that limits the rights of people until they prove their worthiness if said rights.

    Want to help victims of DV? Do something to the folks beating their spouses aside from slaps on the wrist. What % of DV calls are for repeat offenders? Would those calls still com if the offender was removed from the picture? Figuring out a way to put those assholes in jail, in GP to be taught a lesson is a far better path IMO.

    Suicides, as much as I may come off as an asshole, are irrelevant to the gun issue. People who want to off themselves will do so whether they have a gun or not. If a lack of gun access would have a severe impact on suicide rates Japan should be almost suicide free. Instead AFAIK they are still very much ahead of the USA in suicides per 100k residents. Pull the guns and they jump, hang, slot, pop pills, inhale gas... Want to help suicide candidates? Get them psychological help aside from pop this pill and call me in the morning.

    Want to have an impact on murder? Get murderers off the streets. What % of murders are committed by known criminals with long violent histories? Why are they out among the decent folk??

    Our legislators are like little children. I have nothing to play with. I want a new toy. All the while every time you open a closet an avalanche of toys comes out.

  5. #35
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    Increasingly, however, there is consensus that guns should be kept away from those whose behavior suggests that they would be dangerous to themselves or others if they possessed a weapon.
    Everything predicates on that. And because the average person accepts this unlawful pretext, everything else follows. But regardless if this consensus is accurate (and it isn't), it imposes guilt before the fact.

    Domestic violence is guilt after the fact. If we don't have laws regarding that, we should.

    I see this whole proposal as politics masqueraded as something reasonable.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by 26 Inf View Post
    Seriously, I quickly realized that his remark was over the top joking around.

    Take a cue from the title of the song and Get Over It

    Better yet, take a look at the lyrics and adopt them as your anthem:

    I turn on the tube and what do I see
    A whole lotta people cryin' "Don't blame me"
    They point their crooked little fingers at everybody else
    Spend all their time feelin' sorry for themselves
    Victim of this, victim of that
    Your momma's too thin; your daddy's too fat

    Get over it
    Get over it
    All this whinin' and cryin' and pitchin' a fit
    Get over it, get over it

    You say you haven't been the same since you had your little crash
    But you might feel better if they gave you some cash
    The more I think about it, Old Billy was right (you could delete these offensive lyrics and the song still hangs)
    Let's kill all the lawyers, kill 'em tonight

    You don't want to work; you want to live like a king
    But the big, bad world doesn't owe you a thing

    Get over it
    Get over it
    If you don't want to play, then you might as well split
    Get over it, get over it

    It's like going to confession every time I hear you speak
    You're makin' the most of your losin' streak
    Some call it sick, but I call it weak

    You drag it around like a ball and chain
    You wallow in the guilt; you wallow in the pain
    You wave it like a flag, you wear it like a crown
    Got your mind in the gutter, bringin' everybody down
    Complain about the present and blame it on the past
    I'd like to find your inner child and kick its little ass

    Get over it
    Get over it
    All this bitchin' and moanin' and pitchin' a fit
    Get over it, get over it

    Get over it
    Get over it
    It's gotta stop sometime, so why don't you quit
    Get over it, get over it

    Get over it
    Brb. Grabbing snippets from FTP by NWA to post "over the top joking around" stuff on M4C.

  7. #37
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    Never conflate fear with disassociation.
    The two are mutually exclusive. And not always interdependent.

    Some things just aren't worth the time or energy.

    I will say this, people love to get on the "but muh First Amendment" and "take a joke y'all" train when its something they agree with but can't seem to do that when the subject is something they don't.

    It's this game of "gotcha back" that I outgrew in kindergarten. People can say what they like as long as they own it. I just don't have to participate.

    More on point, the ABA can make all the recommendations they want but it still has to be passed into law. I think the way DomVio is trained and handled could use a lot more refinement and investigative work. But those laws were passed and voted on.

    For every guy who worries about a shouting match with his old lady, there are a few that don't mind raking her face.

    And for those, I have no respect whatsoever.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by FromMyColdDeadHand View Post
    If we want to keep our toys and cool stuff we need have a way to keep guns out of and take guns away from crazy people. Some people objectively should not have guns. We need to figure out a way to keep them out of the hands of people that will hurt others or themselves. Considering that suicides are a major cause of gun deaths, there are a lot of gun deaths that could be avoided and potentially a lot of lives saved. How to do that is a really tough question.
    Once guns are gone, replace "gun" with "knives"

    The root cause it's not that guns are available, it's that they are ill. Let's attack the root cause.

  9. #39
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    I do not think we give ourselves enough credit.

    For a nation with only over a quarter billion people yet with more guns in private hands to the point where individual states are more armed than some nations; we do pretty good on gun violence.

    I refuse to believe there are so many 'mentally ill' people in this country.

    Ignorant? Stupid? Just plain no good?

    Sure. But outright mental illness is very specific. And a lot of grey area hits that it becomes subjective and based on consensus.

    There are no Pre-Crime divisions. I cite Sandy Hook as the absolute model for why bad things are so unavoidable at times.

    The shooter purchased no weapons. All were stolen from his mother. She had taken him to see counselors who saw fit to give him psychotropic medication.

    And he still committed heinous gun crime. People will say it wasn't strict enough but the only way to have stopped that was chaining him to a bed in a psych ward. The psych people did not deem it worth doing. If someone is motivated enough....they are going to commit violence. Look at the bi-weekly truckings and stabathons.

    So sadly the answer isnt always "get the guns and lock up the crazy people".

    It seems so simple but the solution is that liberty is inherently dangerous.....

    ...but it also gives you the option to shoot back.

  10. #40
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    Well said.

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