JFK docs to be released

[Outlander Systems]

I still don't know if E. Howard Hunt was telling the truth or Rickrolling us all...

In his own words, he could not. I have not seen any shows, etc where the exact "... angle, the range, the moving target, the time limit, the obstacles, everything" was duplicated under controlled conditions, and the shot made, but may have simply missed them. If Hathcock couldn't do it, under repeated attempts, then it's damn close to a lock few if anyone could either.

That leaves us with a few possibilities, LHO didn't just get lucky once, he got winning the lottery lucky several times in that event, Hathcock is lying, or Hathcock didn't actually attempt it, but the source is obviously quite solid (on paper) and I have not seen anyone question it to date.

[Kain]

In his own words, he could not. I have not seen any shows, etc where the exact "... angle, the range, the moving target, the time limit, the obstacles, everything" was duplicated under controlled conditions, and the shot made, but may have simply missed them. If Hathcock couldn't do it, under repeated attempts, then it's damn close to a lock few if anyone could either.

That leaves us with a few possibilities, LHO didn't just get lucky once, he got winning the lottery lucky several times in that event, Hathcock is lying, or Hathcock didn't actually attempt it, but the source is obviously quite solid (on paper) and I have not seen anyone question it to date.

When was Hathcock trying it? I ask because while the man was a legend of a sniper, he did return after his final tour in nam injured and the books that I have read he lost a bit of his ability due to his injuries, not to take anything away from his abilities, but let us be honest. If he attempted to replicate the shots following that then one could imagine he might not be able to be as proficent as he could have been in his prime.

[WillBrink]

I still don't know if E. Howard Hunt was telling the truth or Rickrolling us all...

Anything is possible. Per above, I have not seen any shows, etc where the exact "... angle, the range, the moving target, the time limit, the obstacles, everything" was duplicated under controlled conditions, and the shot made, but may have simply missed them. If anyone has a source on that, would like to see it. The source here is, well, you know, but ol Jessy was legit UDT and I'd be surprised if he was not as good, if not better, than LHO with a rifle:

JFK Assassination Oswald CBS Mannlicher Carcano Rifle Test 1967



Crazy Jesse:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSWSgcuYqDo

We have that exact rifle in the museum. The LHO was just really lucky that day does not seem to sit well with expert level shooters I have spoken with who also know that rifle. For me personally, the debate over the gun itself and such was not the final straw, and I'm able to possibly believe he did it. That he planned, it did it, etc alone, not so much. I highly recommend people read the book listed.

[yellowfin]

Here's what Carlos Hathcock couldn't replicate from the shooting, from what I've read about it at least: having the rifle being recovered at Oswald's home when he was arrested somewhere else, and having the bullets pulled from Kennedy's car being pistol caliber and NOT 6.5mm diameter.

Anyway, the list of people who wanted Kennedy dead is long. It really was a matter more of who got to him first. Quite honestly the one most capable of doing it who had a lot to gain was LBJ. He certainly had the ability to twist arms and grease palms to get it done and have nobody talk about it.

[Firefly]

You know....thinking about it...

Did Carlos Hathcock really want to go on record as saying "Hell yeah I could've taken that shot. Even 300 yards further away, at night, and in a hurricane. Coulda popped his head like a grape and even got Jackie O too!"

That's like asking some Ranger teams if they could have robbed the bank in Hollywood.

No right thinking person would say they could do illicit stuff that they probably could do.

It's the James Yeager types who loudmouth about having a "Ph.D in killing".

A lot of these people were regular human beings who probably had a lot to put behind. That's actually a bit tasteless to ask of Carlos Hathcock.

Oswald was semi competent and had a zeroed rifle. He shot at a guy from not a terrible distance in a convertible limousine who was going at christmas parade speed in a slightly more trusting and innocent era.

Just saying.

I mean shit....that guy in Dallas killed some police with a shitty ass AK in 5.45. Nobody is questioning that.

But one wacko hits a sitting duck and everyone is all X-Files.

But....I guess we will see. They redacted that 9/11 report and it really didnt change anything. Saudi Arabia didnt get carpet bombed.

I dont want to be crass but thats like somebody asking Ron Jeremy if he could get up in the world's fattest woman. He probably could but.....damn, dude. Damn. You dont ask people questions like that with the intention of printing it.

But JMHO

[usmcvet]

I think people just dont like to accept that all it takes is one loony toon to ruin your whole afternoon.

This is my feeling too. 88 yards isn’t a long shot.


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[Honu]

even if it was some conspiracy thing (not saying I think it is) it would be long gone and the release of the docs would be on other things

if it was a mucked up investigation kinda like the current vegas thing it was intentional and is a rabbit hole with some gopher holes crossing its path and is doing just what was intended

either way we will never know the truth of it just like the current vegas mess

I still say it very well could have been a situation where he as helped along and pushed into things and then covered up or buried

[yellowfin]

Oswald was semi competent and had a zeroed rifle. He shot at a guy from not a terrible distance in a convertible limousine who was going at christmas parade speed in a slightly more trusting and innocent era.

Just saying.

I mean shit....that guy in Dallas killed some police with a shitty ass AK in 5.45. Nobody is questioning that.

But one wacko hits a sitting duck and everyone is all X-Files.

I sort of semi-agree with that. Here's why I don't swallow it verbatim as given to us. Why then if it's that simple do all the lying, covering up, secret squirrel crap? Why have the guy you think did it killed on the spot and scream in his face as he's dying (and maybe refuse to actually save him) did you do it did you do it!?!? Why the secret files? Why the inconsistencies? If something's true and simple then you tell the simple truth and there's no other direction to it. I work in banking. I look at records of stuff, payment histories, credit reports, etc. and stuff either adds up 100% or it doesn't. If you're hiding something or going loopty loop with it then stuff looks weird and if it looks weird either it has an explanation you'll tell me or it has another one you don't want to. Don't lie to me, it doesn't work.

Yes, SOMEONE or A COUPLE SOMEONES had an easy shot. Now if we're talking about the simplest possible explanation of any of this, the guy several say had his M16 slip and put the bullet in Kennedy, my money's on LBJ telling him to do it. Who the hell has their rifle pointed in the direction of someone and accidentally slips a safety off THEN has an AD? Shot a 3 gun match just last week and can tell ya several times that putting my safety on and off sure as heck wasn't something done without me thinking about it--and that's me as a weekend shooter, not even someone paid to have a rifle in my hand 9-5 for a paycheck.

[WillBrink]

This is my feeling too. 88 yards isn’t a long shot.


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I recall first shot was 88, but final shot was closer to 300, but i read conflicting stuff on that. No one thinks that shot was impossible, but on a moving target, with that rifle, with that shooter, in that time frame, is very difficult for many to swallow, and many of those, as experienced as it gets with the craft.

[usmcvet]

I recall first shot was 88, but final shot was closer to 300, but i read conflicting stuff on that. No one thinks that shot was impossible, but on a moving target, with that rifle, with that shooter, in that time frame, is very difficult for many to swallow, and many of those, as experienced as it gets with the craft.

You could do it if it was your mission.



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