UPDATED 2/9/18 Zenith / MKE Z5RS (MP5) SBR review: A love story

[Pappabear]

Love love love me some MP5....


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I guess you do !!

[Rayrevolver]

With Federals ammo rebate it pains me to spend money on anything other than ammo right now.... But I found an older ATI/MKE 94P with a 3-lug on gunbroker for what seemed like a steal. Hopefully get it next week and hope its not a train wreck.

I absolutely love the full stock and wide handguards but in the short term going to have to find an SB Tac brace and use it as a pistol. I just need a way to mount a light and suppressor so I can plink at night. The MP5K had to have that keymod rail as I just couldnt figure out another way to get a light on it.

If you are in Maryland, then you will understand this picture. A local guy did this and I am going to either try and build it myself or ask him to fab me the same thing. Once you can do this then you can legally SBR an MP5 here.

[Todd.K]

That picture makes an argument for a pinned silencer...

[6933]

MP5 Goodness...Love It. German, that is. Just ribbing ya'.

All these posts of the goodness are killing me! F you Josh.

Can't wait for my 51 w/sear to get out of jail. Have 2 SP5K's set up by TSC for F/A with burst lowers already. Not going to shoot until sear at home. So, I'm left jealous of y'all. Hoping by May to have sear.

[JoshNC]

One more.....a Teutonic trio.

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[6933]

One more.....a Teutonic trio.

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Annnnnd you are officially not getting any HK E gun help from me. BTW; found 4 more NOS 21 barrels for Mike to turn to 21e; already there waiting for him. Let me know if you want one. Will be under $5K per barrel.

[fred]

I shot an MPX years ago when they first came out, seemed like an AR / MP5 hybrid. It's nice to see so many options for 9mm carbines / SMG types, especially the EVO Scorpion- which is solid yet inexpensive option. I wish I could have gone that route financially, but I knew I had to have an MP5.

And yeah, you're not kidding about burning through 500 rounds with a quickness...

Thank you for the report sir, it is much appreciated, I was wondering how the Turkish imports were but hadn't really dug into it yet. I have been mulling one of these as my first SBR. I love the CZ but being a lefty think the left side safety would get pretty uncomfortable whilst burning through many rounds of 9mm; the SIG seems stout but doesn't have the cachet of the MP5 clone. Very happy for you and the other guys who have secured one!

[noonesshowmonkey]

Bruh.

I opened this thread expecting insane fuddery.

What I found was an honest to skydaddy love letter to the MP5 that was pitch perfect with a bit of tongue in cheek humor and a gawt dayum coloring book.

Thanks, duder.

I needed that.

For a moment, I started to think about selling my Prius to fund an MP5.

[nick84]

Damn I really enjoyed reading this thread. Thanks to all who took time to share. Those MP5's are stellar. My personal love affair with the gun started with Die Hard as well, but I really learned to want that surefire integrated light version when Elian Gonzalez got deported...ahh those were the times. And of course I couldn't leave out the most accurate depiction of Marines to ever light up the screen...The Rock, of course.

All kidding aside, if I knew what was good for my wallet I'd stay out of this forum. It's just going to have to do though for the next year or so, unfortunately. Here's hoping the market will stay strong for these. If I'm not mistaken, didn't Palmetto State say they were working on a clone as well? Or did I completely make that up?

[kaltesherz]

UPDATE:

Now that I'm around the 4000+ round mark, I thought I'd check back in and let you know how it's holding up...

(Plus I really wanted to show off my sweet new Star Wars sheets).

SPOILER ALERT- IT'S FREAKIN' AWESOME



RELIABILITY:

After my initial review, I had an issue with having a FTF with the last or second to last round in the mag once a range session, then I realized I had a bad mag somewhere that was the likely culprit (I preload all my mags at home and usually bring 6-10 at a time). So I brought some masking tape with me to the range so I could mark the Gremlin mag and maybe replace the spring... and it hasn't had an issue since. 2000 rounds later it excels at converting my ammo stash into empty brass. I don't know how or why, but I've run every type of FMJ/JHP I could find through it trying to get it to choke again with zero issues. I've even run some steel and aluminum cased stuff without a hiccup. I usually carry 147gr HSTs, but I stocked up on 124gr HST's for "serious use" as it's zeroed for 124gr FMJ as that's my usual training ammo.

WEAR AND DURABILITY:

I haven't noticed any advanced wear or durability issues... in fact the only real wear I can find is a little bit of finish rubbed off on the bolt carrier, and some on the ejector. That's pretty much it. Even the original extractor spring, the notorious weak link of HK roller locked goodness, is running strong. I haven't checked bolt gap yet, but everything appears to be running as it should, MKE clearly made and finished it well and it shows (aside from their factory stamp on the magwell, which looks like it needs 3D glasses to be read).






FLASH HIDER:

I always liked the look of flash hiders on MP5's, but told myself getting one would be overkill... adding unnecessary weight and cost ($100-150) just to look cool. Then I noticed the way I grip the forearm (I have long arms, which is what happens when you're half Chilean and half baby Giraffe), it puts my thumb uncomfortably close to the muzzle. And a flash hider would prevent my thumb from going downrange, so I finally had my excuse!





There's 2 basic designs for FH: the original HK version and the B&T. Both are attached via the 3 lug adapter. The HK version is by far the most common and has 2 Generations, the only difference being the older variant has a larger and easier to use latch- which was discovered to be TOO easy to unlatch and sometimes caused them to come loose and get lost... or shot off (this is why we can't have nice things). The B&T is more modern with a 5 prong open design and comes on and off like a 3 lug suppressor. It's pretty neat. That said it's a freakin' huge and too big for my Surefire, so I went with the HK and opted for a US made copy of the Gen 2. I got it from HKparts.net and was impressed with how well made and finished it came, plus it lacks annoying "USA" markings. Once mounted there was a small (maybe 2mm) of lateral play, but with the Surefire light on the forearm contacts it enough to take out all movement and the whole set up is rock solid.



Another benefit of the FH is it keeps the carbon and blastwear to a minimum on the Surefire bezel. With a bare muzzle it adds a fair amount of carbon every range trip, and a lot won't come off- not to mention it didn't take long to actually start removing the finish. The FH drastically reduces the carbon, makes clean up way easier, and so far zero finish wear. I used a new bezel when I added the FH and comparing the two (with similar round counts) shows a clear improvement.



Plus did I mention it freaking looks cool? Oh, and it might help reduce muzzle flash too. Whatever.



FRONT SIGHT POST:

When shooting outdoors the original plain black front sight worked well, but when shooting indoors sometimes it was hard to get a crisp sight picture- especially when shooting black targets. I decided to try upgrading it and found that XS makes a "drop in" replacement with a tritium insert and a small white outline around it. When I got it I discovered that it needed a bit of fitting as the base was too thick, but luckily my GF is a watch maker and busted out a small file set, and after a few min got it on. It's sightly larger (wider) than the original front sight, but makes a nice and crisp sight picture. Plus the tritium is makes it easy to pick up in low light, and rear inserts aren't needed- my cheek weld automatically lines them up with no effort with either fixed or folding stocks.



HK NON F A3 STOCK:

The newer F A3 stocks seem a little long at times, so I was curious if the older non F stocks would be more comfortable. But since they've been out of production since the 90's they're hard to find in good shape and even in craptastic condition command a premium. I found one on the HKpro EE that was in pretty good shape for a great price, so I jumped on it like Elvis on a glazed ham. It was from a former Police gun, but didn't see that much use and only real wear was around the sling loop. It's actually harder to put on than my ATI F stock knock off- I have to depress the latch slightly to get it to go on completely, meanwhile the ATI copy slips on like your mom after a few drinks. Except unlike your mom, it still locks up tight. The shorter LOP and the non rubber buttpad is nice but I'm still debating which one I prefer in the end... if I decide to keep the pre F stock I'll probably have it refinished. The earlier ones had all metal latchwork and are easy to take apart/refinish, but sadly mine is the later production with polymer parts so there's a risk something will break when taking them apart/together for refinishing.



Here you can see all 3 stocks from longest LOP to shortest.



If you take out the A2, it's easier to see the LOP difference



SLINGS:

Since I'm clearly trying too hard to make neutered 9mm carbines relevant, I needed a good sling. If I was truly trying to bring back the 80's I'd throw on an HK 3 point- or worse a 90's 1 point abomination. So a adjustable 2 point it is, and I've been using BFG Vickers slings since I was PV1 Kaltesherz in 2007, so I looked into my options on that route. BFG makes everything a growing boy could ask for when it comes to slings, and instead of the usual HK sling hook (which can rattle or worse- scratch up the Uber finish of my gat), they have something called a ULoop.



It's a simple coated metal wire that attaches easily to slings, almost tailor made for HK front attachments. While I could have just got a standard Vickers sling and threaded on a ULoop, I decided to use their website to order a custom sling from them. Usually the Vickers slings have the adjustment loop is made out of a different color webbing so they can easily be identified (for black slings the loop is grey), but with the custom option I could order an all black sling, and who are you kidding- who doesn't want a murdered out sling? If you're going target-indicator-black, you gotta own it. Oh, and I got the ULoop sewn in too, that way it'd be a little more streamlined and less clutter.

My custom sling showed up quickly (around a week), and on my A2 fixed stock setup could only be described as TITTIES. Fast, comfortable, and slick. That set up is definitely the all business way to run an MP5, whether you're raiding a LA drug house circa 1994 or mag dumping a pickup in Utah last month- it just screams "Please try me, I want paid time off and the wife's been asking to go to Cabo".



Then I put it on one of my A3 stocks and discovered because the rear sling loop was on the rear receiver, when shouldering while slung the webbing would frequently bunch up by my face. Not a deal breaker, but pretty annoying. A lot had to do with the thicker, stiffer webbing used by BFG in their slings, so I decided to try a sling made out of softer nylon, so I picked up a MagPul 2 point. It was much better, and after playing around noticed that I could eliminate the problem entirely if I slinged my MP5 more like a SAW than an M4- i.e. over my support shoulder vs under it. Not really practical, but it works.



CONCLUSION:

I love this thing. It goes with me every time I hit the range and never gets old. I find it really easy to get solid hits on steel out to 100m or so while standing, and even new shooters are face shooting paper targets in no time. MKE has a long history of making military grade durable guns and it shows. I know 9mm PCC market is getting a little crowded, with a lot of MP5 options showing up or due to show up, but I feel MKE's durability and reliability plus Zenith's excellent customer service this makes it a no brainer. Yes, it's pricey... but it works and works well. Did I mention it's sexy as all get out? Little Timmy and Suzie don't need a college fund, just a recruiters card anyway right?