Case body resizing issue

[markm]

Another vote for the case gauge.

Best advice I ever received when starting to load rifle.

I think guys here should own one even if they don't reload because you can check factory ammo... or ammo with dents to make sure they'll chamber correctly.

[sinister]

A case gage (unless cut with a minimum reamer) will only show if the shoulder was pushed back to safe headspace and if the case is short or long, requiring trimming.

A small-base die will bring the case closer to original factory brass exterior dimensions -- who doesn't like shooting factory ammo loaded with virgin cases?

Your chamber is your ultimate gage -- if cases slide in, then fall out naturally when you tip the muzzle up you're good. If you have to leverage them out (or push with a rod) your die isn't sizing the exterior dimensions enough.

Some claim using a small base die overworks brass -- but most will lose the cases to neck splits or just plain not finding them in the grass before they're worn out.

[T2C]

I'll second the recommendation for a Small Base Die if a Full Length Die is not getting the job done. I had an AR-10 that required a small base die to size the brass for proper feeding.

[Cokie]

Case gauge ALL THE WAY. Takes all the nonsense measurements out of the way. And get rid of the expander ball, and buy a neck expanding die. Expander balls are brutal on your brass/necks, and leave too much runout in the neck.

It's an extra step, but the neck expander die is worth it if you are serious about your loads.

I am interested in this neck expander die. What are your recommendations for products, and is it as simple as FL sizing and then taking the cases and expanding them in the new die?

Also sinister, What you say sounds like what happens with my own once fired brass (machine gun brass is a different story). Do I just drop the case in under its own weight and let it fall out? That sounds like the least involved method of getting a case in the chamber, nice and simple if it works.

I am gonna sound like a cheapskate, but I have spent so much on reloading stuff this year, when I already had most everything, I figured springing for the headspace gauges would be a better solution than a case gauge. Someone told me reloading would save me money hahahahahahahaha. More like cost me but my pistol reloads are pretty accurate so its worth it so far. I just want to get the rifle dialed in.

So recommendations are Small base sizer, Case Gauges, and a neck expanding die? At least those all aren't too expensive.

[fedupflyer]

Its called an expander mandrel.

Look at 21st Century reloading.

http://www.xxicsi.com/products-1.html



Use the Hornday comparator to set the headspace for your rifle and then use a case gauge to verify.



I also recommend a neck tension gauge.

https://ballistictools.com/store/cas...h-gage-224-308

[sinister]

...sinister, What you say sounds like what happens with my own once fired brass (machine gun brass is a different story). Do I just drop the case in under its own weight and let it fall out? That sounds like the least involved method of getting a case in the chamber, nice and simple if it works.

So recommendations are Small base sizer, Case Gauges, and a neck expanding die? At least those all aren't too expensive.

A small base die makes the most sense if you own at least two ARs -- one chambered for .mil 5.56 and one chambered with a commercial reamer, and/or if you use range-recovered brass or surplus brass of unknown origin (perhaps fired from a SAW).

The giveaway is if brass won't pass the test described. A full-length die sizes a case, but not down to original virgin dimensions (especially about a quarter-inch from the case head, just above the extractor groove).

A drop-in case gage is a quick QC check for headspace shoulder-bump length (short or requires trimming-to-length). A too-long case may stick in your chamber at the case mouth when a bullet is seated.

[Cokie]

I forgot to mention I resized a case and cut the entire neck off to make sure the case was not too long and hitting the chamber. The case behaved the same in both situations.

[masan]

Cokie,

It sounds like you already have the proper tools to measure your headspace (and that you are sizing that plenty). A drop in case gauge will also allow you to quickly check headspace, if you feel that you need to do so.

From what you have described your full length sizing die is not sizing the case enough just above the case head. This can be a common occurrence with semi-auto rifles. A small base die will likely resolve this issue. Measuring the diameter of the case body with calipers is accurate enough, we do it in Benchrest all the time. Ideally you want the body just above the base to size by about 1 thou (.001).

As to the expander die versus the expander ball, I believe that the expander die with a properly sized mandrel will give you better results than the expander ball in your FL die. Neck turning and a bushing die will yield the best results but neck turning is a special kind of hell (I turn about 500 cases each winter for the coming season) and I would not wish it on anyone.

21st century, KM Tools, and Sinclair all make Die Bodies and Mandrels.

Be sure to read the sizes on the mandrels before buying. In my experience it is also a good idea to mic them yourself, even the best tool makers have a bad day.

Finally, you may find that a crimp die (with a light crimp) will be necessary/advantageous for your situation.

Good Luck,
Josh

edit:
if pics will help feel free to ask, im not waking up the wife by digging out stuff to take pics now LOL

[markm]

I am interested in this neck expander die. What are your recommendations for products, and is it as simple as FL sizing and then taking the cases and expanding them in the new die?

Yes. I think I have the RCBS neck expander die. The reason for the die is that I removed the expander ball from the die since it's so rough on brass. (neck stretch & runout)

I get straighter necks that need less trimming. Most of the time I put the brass in my Giraud and only get a chamfer... with no trimming at all.

[VinnAY]

I second the small base dies. I had a batch of Blackout that I got to the range after having used the Red dies on, with no problems previously, but these just wouldn't chamber. Got a case gauge and they don't fit. Si went with the RCBS small base and I've never had a problem since. I use them on Blackout and .308, my 223/556 rifles seem fine without needing a SB.