Bitcoin & cryptocurrency

**jerrysimons** · 12-11-17, 17:51

Originally Posted by pinzgauer

Gold has value, no doubt. And uses, no doubt. It's tangible.

Is it an investment? only relative to currencies you buy it with.

It pays no interest. No dividend. Does not split.

Bury an ounce of gold, and in 50 years you'll have... an ounce of gold.

Any value change is only relative to currencies and whatever the effect of scarcity from the commodity aspect. If you are betting there will be less of it, then it's value will go up. Yet they mine 2500 metric tons each year. That's 88.1 million ounces. Some is lost each year, but not near what they mine.

You can invest in gold futures- speculating on it's future value relative to a currency. But you can't invest in gold bars. You can use it to hold your wealth though. That's in a strict interpretation of investment- purchasing something that you are expecting to produce a profit, dividend, or other result.

But if you are really talking about value relative to inflationary currency, then we can squint can call it an investment as you expect to get more dollars for it in the future then you paid for it. But then again, do those future dollars buy any more? The "ounce of gold buys a tailored Saville row suit" rule says no.

So I've gone a different direction... was thinking about what do I need if currency inflates/collapses. Is it gold? Nah, coins are to high value to buy what I would want to barter for. So maybe Silver? Then I realized: Any situation when the banking/dollar system is defunct, ammo in common calibers would be a better barter unit than silver or gold.

- It's in units that would be useful ("I'll give you a box of 5.56 for a gallon of dried peas")
- It has utility on it's own that justifies carrying the weight.
- It's easily verifiable, and determining if it's counterfeit likely not to be an issue.
- It's likely to cost more in the future than it does now (on average)

So everytime I get the spidey sense that I need to be picking up some gold/silver coins, I buy a case of 5.56 and 9mm.

I even keep some steel case, as if we ever got into book of eli days, steel case will be worth almost as much as normal. Yet it's far cheaper (at times) now to buy.

Yep, crazy, probably.

That is what I have told people for a long time, if society collapses people are going straight to a barter system of goods with immediate "intrinsic value." Gold will be a shiny rock and bitcoin just 1s and 0s inside powerless memory banks.

But we ain't there yet, so back to bitcoin.

**GH41** · 12-11-17, 18:09

Originally Posted by zombiescometh

Made a small investment in bitcoin, ethereum, and litecoin with coinbase.

If interested in using coinbase they do have a referral program.

https://www.coinbase.com/join/5a2d59c80ac6f100dc3b3c4b

If you use the link above and buy $100 worth of currency we each receive $10 worth of Bitcoin.

To the mods if that's not allowed let me know and i will edit it out.

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So.. let me see if I understand you correctly... You are offering us a chance to get something for nothing?? Why doesn't coinbase just buy a couple of trillion dollars worth of their currency and pocket all of the bitcoin? Because it is nothing more than a sales pitch. No different than the guy telling me.. "For a hundred bucks I'll tell you how to make millions flipping houses you buy with other people's money. Why doesn't keep his secret and the promised windfall profits to himself? Because it is bullshit.

**zombiescometh** · 12-11-17, 18:47

Originally Posted by GH41

So.. let me see if I understand you correctly... You are offering us a chance to get something for nothing?? Why doesn't coinbase just buy a couple of trillion dollars worth of their currency and pocket all of the bitcoin? Because it is nothing more than a sales pitch. No different than the guy telling me.. "For a hundred bucks I'll tell you how to make millions flipping houses you buy with other people's money. Why doesn't keep his secret and the promised windfall profits to himself? Because it is bullshit.

Not at all.

If someone decides they want to try out crypto currency and decide to use coinbase to buy and sell and they decide to use my link that's awesome if not that's ok to.

Just one of the many exchange options for people interested in crypto currency.

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**Jer** · 12-11-17, 19:18

Originally Posted by GH41

So.. let me see if I understand you correctly... You are offering us a chance to get something for nothing?? Why doesn't coinbase just buy a couple of trillion dollars worth of their currency and pocket all of the bitcoin? Because it is nothing more than a sales pitch. No different than the guy telling me.. "For a hundred bucks I'll tell you how to make millions flipping houses you buy with other people's money. Why doesn't keep his secret and the promised windfall profits to himself? Because it is bullshit.

You do realize that coinbase doesn't own Bitcoin, right? There trading a commodity just like any other third-party would at this point. To buy a trillion US dollars worth of Bitcoin would require starting with a trillion u.s. dollars. This is the concept you don't seem to grasp. Coinbase is not inventing something out of thin air but giving you a exchange by which to purchase it. Nobody owns Bitcoin. Not coinbase not the Winklevoss twins not the US government. Nobody. Therein lies the beauty of Bitcoin and all other cryptocurrencies.

It amazes me how many people are so quick to negatively judge something of which they haven't the foggiest idea. Rather than sitting back and reading and possibly learning or, heaven forbid, going out on your own and independently researching it to learn something about it. It's just easier to crap on the idea since it represents change.

**HackerF15E** · 12-11-17, 21:32

More important than the ins and outs of any particular crypto-currency is the ability to secure and transfer wealth beyond the reach of governments.

It will be a world-changing technology once it becomes ubiquitous.

**sgtrock82** · 12-12-17, 07:09

Originally Posted by HackerF15E

More important than the ins and outs of any particular crypto-currency is the ability to secure and transfer wealth beyond the reach of governments.

It will be a world-changing technology once it becomes ubiquitous.

Not so. Bulgaria confiscated a shit pile of bitcoins, and are now super excited that they might actually have some money.

**sandsunsurf** · 12-12-17, 13:03

Originally Posted by sgtrock82

Not so. Bulgaria confiscated a shit pile of bitcoins, and are now super excited that they might actually have some money.

Yes and the U.S. government seized a bunch, also. But there are easy ways to store cryptocurrency offline or even as paper, to use later. It’s kind of the users’ mistake to store their currency online. (Like how I lost mine at VaultofSatoshi and Cryptsy).

Obviously, a government can make it hard or even near impossible to use cryptocurrency, I’m just saying that as it becomes more ubiquitous, it’s harder and harder for a government to do that and the currency becomes more usable, and thus more stable.

**WillBrink** · 12-12-17, 13:23

Originally Posted by sandsunsurf

Yes and the U.S. government seized a bunch, also. But there are easy ways to store cryptocurrency offline or even as paper, to use later. It’s kind of the users’ mistake to store their currency online. (Like how I lost mine at VaultofSatoshi and Cryptsy).

Obviously, a government can make it hard or even near impossible to use cryptocurrency, I’m just saying that as it becomes more ubiquitous, it’s harder and harder for a government to do that and the currency becomes more usable, and thus more stable.

Really wish I understood the whole cryptocurrency thing better. I feel left out, but everything about it sets of my alarms for an easy way to lose $. Is there an objective resource to get up to speed knowledge base wise? I'm cluless.

**sgtrock82** · 12-12-17, 13:31

Not to be argumentative as Im trying to wrap my head about how this is suppose to work, is created and what aside from "faith" gives this thing legs. So far ive heard its awesome because its totally electronic and no banks but apparently not only is keeping it online risky by your testimony but it can be printed out.... like more worthless paper. Except now it can be printed by anyone? And of course the "its beyond the reach of gov't" which it also clearly isnt nor are world govts about to watch their currencies tank to stand up a currency that is touted as supposing to be private and free from their intrusion.

Again There are huge gaps in my knowledge of these things. I really just want to understand it as Ive been asked about it constantly and have no good answers. Its just seems a bit "fantastic" to use the term in a not so positive fashion.

**zombiescometh** · 12-12-17, 13:41

Originally Posted by WillBrink

Really wish I understood the whole cryptocurrency thing better. I feel left out, but everything about it sets of my alarms for an easy way to lose $. Is there an objective resource to get up to speed knowledge base wise? I'm cluless.

TechCrunch has some good info, but there are lots of sources and lots of opinions. Just have to research a lot and decide for yourself.

Granted these options are still volatile but just as a reference i just started with a small investment two days ago and I'm currently at double what I invested. And I realize that it could all go into the negatives for me at anytime but im about 50% hoping it keeps going high enough to make a great profit and 50% wanting to keep a hold on to it just to see what happens in the future with these types of currency.

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