Getting bigger while cutting fat - possible? Also - diet

[Eurodriver]

I am an ectomorph. I’m currently at 13.8% body fat and I am achieving that on a diet of McDonalds, Burger King, and stuffed crust from Pizza Hut. I say this not to piss off all the big guys but just for informations sake.

I’d like to get that below 10%. Ideally 8. I know what kind of effort is required to get from 10 to 8, which is why my real goal is 10%. It’s a totally arbitrary number but I can get there and I want to be there.

However, I’d also like to grow. I have learned that nearly everything revolves around diet though. I am eating 3500 Cals a day (not hard when it’s McNuggets) based on my fitness pal and getting nowhere. Because it’s all junk.

I have no idea how to cook. I’ve had beer tonight so kinda drunk. But I’ve been working on this for a while and seen some progress but not as good as I should. So much misinformation.

I am good with working out. Let’s focus on diet.

Do I eat carbs? Stick to Paleo? Ketosis? Basically is my biggest question. How do I know what macros to follow or how many Calories to consume? I’m kind of shooting in the dark. The scale doesn’t help because if I’m gaining weight it could be muscle or fat.

My diet lately has consisted of:

Breakfast:
3 scrambled eggs
1 Apple & 2 Oranges & 1 Banana
2 sausage patties
6 sausage links (about 700 cals total)

10am Protein shake (24g w 110 cals) if I worked out that AM.

Lunch: grilled chicken or steak. Broccoli. Peas. Carrots. 500 cals. 54gr Protein. 15gr carbs.

Dinner: This is where I **** up. Usually 16-18oz of ground beef prepared as taco salad without taco shells. Maybe 600cals.

I eat the same meals every day except Saturday afternoons when I go get teriyaki chicken after Yoga.

[jpmuscle]

Bro.....


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[E_Johnson]

Following with interest as a fellow hummingbird metabolism club member.

[jpmuscle]

Following with interest as a fellow hummingbird metabolism club member.

It’s not super complicated. You need to eat more. After a point you’ll identify what your maintenance intake is. But you have to track calories and your workouts. From there it’s a matter of manipulating your macros.

Hard gainers like you guys have it a bit easier because imo since you have a bit more leeway with your consumption with respect to staying leaner.

But it all comes down to nutrition. You might need 3500 calories. You might need 4500 it just depends. Don’t bother stepping on a scale to track just keep tabs on what you see in the mirror and the plates on the bar.


As for burning fat and building muscle unless your some genetic freak of nature or on gear you can’t help but add fat as you increase muscle mass. Hence why folks bulk then cut.

All said and done though the answer to how much you need to eat is as much as it takes (clean food obviously). Past that follow a structured strength training program and mix in some HIIT and you’ll be GTG.


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[Diamondback]

Nothing to contribute, but tagged to subscribe on behalf of a friend with similar problems, and see if anything comes up than can be leveraged for my own oddball case. (Large bones of a meso, rounded/stocky soft tissue of an endo, generally hard to gain OR lose outside of a certain range, usually 10-20lb. from summer low to winter high.)

[BuzzinSATX]

Food-wise, I believe you would benefit much by eating more whole grains and legumes. Organic brown and wild rice, quinoa, steel cut oats, Black/kidney/garbanzo beans...also sweet and white potatoes (boiled/baked/grilled). Use lots of seasonings like the Ms Dash shakers, soy/worsteshire/hot sauces, and experiment with your favorite ethnic spices (I use a lot of Thai, Indian, and South American centric spices). Avoid much MSGs.

Buy a cheap rice cooker/steamer (makes cooking grains soooo easy!) and you are golden! They are all easy to cook and will add lots of fuel and fiber to your system.

Gaining weight-wise...I’m gonna ask “Why?” Brother, I’m an endomorph who wishes I was an echomorph!

If you can gain strength without gaining much mass, that’s the best! Look at Bruce Lee. He was an extreme example, but that guy was the strongest dude, pound for pound, of anyone I can think of. Check out videos of his famous “1 inch punch”, and look up the stuff Chuck Norris used to say about him and the heavy bags he used to hit.

Good luck!

[usmcvet]

Nothing to contribute, but tagged to subscribe on behalf of a friend with similar problems, and see if anything comes up than can be leveraged for my own oddball case. (Large bones of a meso, rounded/stocky soft tissue of an endo, generally hard to gain OR lose outside of a certain range, usually 10-20lb. from summer low to winter high.)

This is an option too.


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[Eurodriver]

So it’s been like 2 weeks since I made this thread. I’ve kept track of every meal I’ve eaten and gone to the gym every M-F since. I’ve done no cardio, just weight lifting, due to an injury.

I am averaging a bit under 2,000 calories a day over those 2 weeks. My weight has stayed exactly the same. To the pound. However I’ve noticed a little less stomach jiggles and a little more arm and shoulder definition.

I am playing around with it day by day. My macros are about 190g of Protein, 100g of Carbs and 87g of Fat. I know I can shed fat super quick going Keto (I did it a year ago) but I also know that I can’t keep that up forever. There’s at least once a week I will eat fried chicken wings or something.

What’s odd is that my weight hasn’t fluctuated at all. My BMR is about 1950 for my height and weight and yet I am working out for over an hour five days a week eating essentially my BMR in calories. Should I drop the calories or what?

[TexasGunNut]

So it’s been like 2 weeks since I made this thread. I’ve kept track of every meal I’ve eaten and gone to the gym every M-F since. I’ve done no cardio, just weight lifting, due to an injury.

I am averaging a bit under 2,000 calories a day over those 2 weeks. My weight has stayed exactly the same. To the pound. However I’ve noticed a little less stomach jiggles and a little more arm and shoulder definition.

I am playing around with it day by day. My macros are about 190g of Protein, 100g of Carbs and 87g of Fat. I know I can shed fat super quick going Keto (I did it a year ago) but I also know that I can’t keep that up forever. There’s at least once a week I will eat fried chicken wings or something.

What’s odd is that my weight hasn’t fluctuated at all. My BMR is about 1950 for my height and weight and yet I am working out for over an hour five days a week eating essentially my BMR in calories. Should I drop the calories or what?

Sounds like you're on track. You're not going to see the needle move in two or even four weeks. I like your calories and macros so keep running, tracking and see how YOU respond. Trust your eye if the jiggle meter seems better. As long as the scale tells you you aren't gaining you can actually recomp in the early stages. After a few more weeks assess where you are and adjust accordingly to meet your goals. If you aren't progressing drop some carbs and/or fat to see if you lose some pounds. You need to find a way to fuel your body that you can live with long term. Invest the time now so you can get your diet on autopilot and move on to more important things. Like a second home in the mountains.

My youngest son is built like you. It took him a solid year to dial in his diet, macros and exercise to gain mass and lean up. But he has his own IMDd page and tons of prime a$$ chasing him. In the beginning he had to really restrict his calories just to get his body to budge. Last I checked he is running 3400 calories to maintain 180 lbs LBM. Again, you are different and your goals are different. He works out 2-3 hours per day but that's his job. Point is, if he quit working out it would take weeks for his BMR to drop and it took many weeks of work for his BMR to go up.

My angle on this is that I work with my mind. If I'm not sharp I don't perform and if I don't perform I let a lot of people down. That, I will not do.
My meat is the support system for my brain. If my body is average I can't expect my brain to be above average. So I found a way over the years to determine what made me tick. Then I fine-tuned, modified and applied. As I've aged I've had to adjust but I have constantly improved my cognitive output over the years by tracking, measuring and applying what works for me. It's nice to have my wife drool over my manly chest but let's be honest; she really loves my mind.

I'm not average because I decided years ago to be the best possible version of ME. You don't strike me as someone content to be average. The last 5% of excellence is harder to reach than the first 95% of mediocre. But it is more than worth the effort.

Keep me posted on your progress.

[WS6]

Sounds like you're on track. You're not going to see the needle move in two or even four weeks. I like your calories and macros so keep running, tracking and see how YOU respond. Trust your eye if the jiggle meter seems better. As long as the scale tells you you aren't gaining you can actually recomp in the early stages. After a few more weeks assess where you are and adjust accordingly to meet your goals. If you aren't progressing drop some carbs and/or fat to see if you lose some pounds. You need to find a way to fuel your body that you can live with long term. Invest the time now so you can get your diet on autopilot and move on to more important things. Like a second home in the mountains.

My youngest son is built like you. It took him a solid year to dial in his diet, macros and exercise to gain mass and lean up. But he has his own IMDd page and tons of prime a$$ chasing him. In the beginning he had to really restrict his calories just to get his body to budge. Last I checked he is running 3400 calories to maintain 180 lbs LBM. Again, you are different and your goals are different. He works out 2-3 hours per day but that's his job. Point is, if he quit working out it would take weeks for his BMR to drop and it took many weeks of work for his BMR to go up.

My angle on this is that I work with my mind. If I'm not sharp I don't perform and if I don't perform I let a lot of people down. That, I will not do.
My meat is the support system for my brain. If my body is average I can't expect my brain to be above average. So I found a way over the years to determine what made me tick. Then I fine-tuned, modified and applied. As I've aged I've had to adjust but I have constantly improved my cognitive output over the years by tracking, measuring and applying what works for me. It's nice to have my wife drool over my manly chest but let's be honest; she really loves my mind.

I'm not average because I decided years ago to be the best possible version of ME. You don't strike me as someone content to be average. The last 5% of excellence is harder to reach than the first 95% of mediocre. But it is more than worth the effort.

Keep me posted on your progress.

THIS! x1000!!!! I work in healthcare, which, by and large, is filled with slobs, as an industry, in my experience and opinion. I just got calipered at 14.5% the other day, and 200.6#, at 5'10.75" in sockfeet. That is soft as **** in my book. I used to hang out around 10%, but like I said...healthcare. SO, anyways, whittling it down. I don't know many guys who roll around at single digit body fat who work in a job where fitness doesn't matter. I plan to be one of them. If you're similar, then you know exactly what this means, or will, by the time you get there, for sure. It's a pain but worth it.