Shooting in the desert

[Tuukka]

This happened about 20 minutes from my house. It was a terribly stupid incident and hopefully someone will get nailed. Part of the problem that isn't addressed is how certain agencies and groups have attempted to restrict our shooting areas in AZ. Even though we have lots of open area, a lot of the land cannot be used for shooting.

We have a pretty nice range (General Joe Foss Shooting Complex) that isn't too far from that area as well, but after various management issues and other problems it was taken over by the county and is now only open 2 days a week for 6 hours a day. It's sad.

We had over 2000 shooting ranges back in 2000, now its down to IIRC 600.

Also many ranges have more noise and time restraints due to people / housing creeping on them, then complaining about noise...

So, more people take to sand pits etc, which is not increasing the range safety at all. Yes dumbassery can happen on a proper range as well, but shooting at a location not really meant for it brings its own challenges.

Also now shooting on someones land with their permission, is not really possible anymore if you intend to do it more regularly etc. As they dont want certain areas to come sort of unofficial ranges.

They did introduce a term called "minor shooting range", which can be set up with a note to our central Police authorization. The only problem is that it takes the environmental permit that regular shooting ranges need = tens of thousands of Euros for the studies, range setup to capture bullets etc so they dont have environmental effect.

So in essence a big cut on proper ranges in the last 15+ years and making it more difficult ( impossible ) to shoot on someones land with their permission...

[Leaveammoforme]

Odds are great that she was shot by someone in her own group, that's usually how these stories end. Poor news reporting when they can't even say if she was just hiking, or part of a group that was shooting.

That was my first thought as well. I had read that the group heard "the" shots. While it's still unknown if the shots heard were "the" shots, I'd say it's pretty safe to assume that they were.

If this is the case, whoever fired the shots was close to the group. They wouldn't have heard some random round cooking across the desert. Joe Blow Public hears shots as "Bang, bang" not "Zip, pop".

[TMS951]

I live in the North East, I wouldn't even know where to go to shoot on public lands.

We shoot at gun ranges an on private property. I never ever had a problem finding multiple places to go shoot growing up. Now I just shoot on my own land.


Sadly most gun owners are total retards. We all know this and its why we are here and not TOS. Personally while I'm big on gun rights I don't have a real issue with shooting on public lands being restricted because to mall ninja is bump firing out in the the great wide open. A good fix would be designated areas on public lands with back stops.

[markm]

I am leaning towards a tragic accident caused by gross negligence. I thought of you when I read the article. I shot the USPSA Nationals in Vegas years ago. The berms were probably 30 feet tall with pretty much nothing for miles behind them. I wondered at the time if there were people behind the berms miles away.

We're very fortunate to have access to private land right now. I dread the though of having to shoot at spots like the one where this incident took place.

[AKDoug]

From the reports I have now heard, I may be wrong in my assessment.

IG- I can not believe that nice range is only open 12 hrs a week. That is criminal. I drove by it a few years ago when visiting my parents in Surprise. Looked like a great place.

[RVTMaverick]

Hey Tuukka,
I had NO Idea Shooting was so Big in Finland? But why such a Huge cut down, from 2000 to 600? Dam... can't be from all housing development, is it?

FWIW: My old boss while I was living in Sweden is Finnish.. Jyrki, Great guy, Dude is Funny as all get out and a great Story teller!
The Job I had while living in Sweden, They had a Shooting club, they even had a Shooting Range under the Building I worked at, although it's in a very small section... Thinking back now, the building IS SO HUGE, it could have been made into an incredible Rifle range under the building too.... Man,.. what it Could have been!

Peace Jeff

We had over 2000 shooting ranges back in 2000, now its down to IIRC 600.

Also many ranges have more noise and time restraints due to people / housing creeping on them, then complaining about noise...

So, more people take to sand pits etc, which is not increasing the range safety at all. Yes dumbassery can happen on a proper range as well, but shooting at a location not really meant for it brings its own challenges.

Also now shooting on someones land with their permission, is not really possible anymore if you intend to do it more regularly etc. As they dont want certain areas to come sort of unofficial ranges.

They did introduce a term called "minor shooting range", which can be set up with a note to our central Police authorization. The only problem is that it takes the environmental permit that regular shooting ranges need = tens of thousands of Euros for the studies, range setup to capture bullets etc so they dont have environmental effect.

So in essence a big cut on proper ranges in the last 15+ years and making it more difficult ( impossible ) to shoot on someones land with their permission...

[Iraqgunz]

It makes me sick and it's total shitshow incompetence. I guarantee you that if they hired on some people and charged a reasonable fee that it would be fine. I know some guys tried to book it up for range training events and they made it so difficult that they just sid phuket and went elsewhere.

From the reports I have now heard, I may be wrong in my assessment.

IG- I can not believe that nice range is only open 12 hrs a week. That is criminal. I drove by it a few years ago when visiting my parents in Surprise. Looked like a great place.

[RetroRevolver77]

I used to go to range that was about 50 miles outside the city. It was in the middle of some state forest reserve on 5K acres. The state even built a really nice covered bench range, pistol range, trap shooting area- the works. Things gradually started turning bad about a decade ago, seems the younger shooters were dragging trash out there to shoot at along with unsafe firearms handling. Eventually the state shut it down. My point, in the absence of range officers, you become a range officer yourself. If you see people doing stuff that is unsafe or leaving trash everywhere- then tell them to pick it up, correct them for unsafe firearms handling. Otherwise you will eventually lose access to that range.

[Averageman]

A high school friend of mine was out hiking in the desert with the Cub Scout Troop he belonged to in like fifth grade and out of nowhere he was shot in the head.
He barely lived on the way to the hospital and he didn't attend school again until he was a Sophomore.
He said he always thought it was more than an accident.

[GH41]

I used to go to range that was about 50 miles outside the city. It was in the middle of some state forest reserve on 5K acres. The state even built a really nice covered bench range, pistol range, trap shooting area- the works. Things gradually started turning bad about a decade ago, seems the younger shooters were dragging trash out there to shoot at along with unsafe firearms handling. Eventually the state shut it down. My point, in the absence of range officers, you become a range officer yourself. If you see people doing stuff that is unsafe or leaving trash everywhere- then tell them to pick it up, correct them for unsafe firearms handling. Otherwise you will eventually lose access to that range.

Same problem here. The nearest public range is about an hour from me. It is on a 15k acre state/federal preserve. Paved, decent benches and covered. No range officers though. I don't go there by myself. The last time I went by myself there was an old timer with a 40+/- women. Probably his daughter. She was obviously mentally retarded. The old guy called a cease fire and went downrange to change targets. She was fiddling with magazines and looking through the scope on their 10/22 while he was downrange. I was saddened and shocked at the same time. I know the old guy was trying to spend time with his daughter but he should have taken her downrange with him. Common sense should always prevail. Another day some idiots put 10-12 5 gallon buckets on top of the 100 yard berm and proceeded to do repeated mag dumps with an AK. I reported them to the rangers. It's just a matter of time before they shut it down.