Why not more DI guns?

[Moose-Knuckle]

Parts are easy. For now. Barrels, bolt groups, pistons, FCG parts, etc are available from demilled LE trade-in rifles. And compared to the pre-2007 time period they are inexpensive and plentiful. It was nearly impossible to source parts in the US forvmany years. I’m stocked up on parts for multiple generations of future shooters in my family.


Please tell me you own at least one Swiss 55x. With your penchant for HKs, AUGs, etc it is a travesty for you to lack a Swiss 55x in your collection.

Did you ever try to procure Swiss parts from stocking dealers in Canada?

I picked up a very early 556 and tossed the abortion of handguards they put on there for a OEM 55x set I got from a dealer in Canada, this was in 2007.

[Moose-Knuckle]

No need for people to agree. Its a fact, AR15 receivers pretty much never wear out. From the owner of Battlefield Las Vegas:

- Charging handles will "stretch" allowing the locking lever and spring to fly out

I'm going to assume these are OEM/USGI charging handles and not after market ones like BCM, Geissele, etc.?

- USGI mags have outlasted all of the other brands. We use UGSI (Brownell's with tan follower) and on a mag for mag basis, they have outlasted Pmags and a few of the other mags that we get from mfg'ers with new weapons. We don't have to worry about various generations with different weapons like the MR556, SCAR, F2000, Tavor or a couple of others that use AR15/M4 magazines.

Now that is interesting. Makes me glad that I have focused on USGI mags over the years instead of the rest, while I have the others (PMAGs/Lancers) I've always concentrated on USGIs.

There is a YouTube video where Mrgunsngear took a tour of Battleground Vegas and interviewed one of their head armorers, he had high praise for the SCAR 16 over AR's.

Would like to see the Battleground Vegas guys do a post/vid of MBRs (M14 vs. G3 vs. FAL vs. SCAR 17 vs. AR-10, etc.).

[Pikey]

You're talking about two different things, maintenance and durability. For maintenance with the AR you just need spare parts and armorers tools to get it to 100K rounds. With the AK- you just shoot it to get it to 100K rounds. Now for "durability", well durability is being able to survive a ten meter drop test onto concrete. Something the AK can do without falling apart but I am honestly not sure about the AR in that same drop test scenario.





Maybe you and I read things differently.

From the article;

"-Some of our M4's have well over 200,000 rounds down range. Barrels have been replaced, gas tubes have been replaced, BCG's have been replaced but what sets it apart from the AK47's is that upper and lower receivers continue to function. AK's get to about the 100,000+ round count and rails on the receiver will start to crack. It's an easy fix with tig welding but they crack.

- We get about 20,000 rounds out of bolts before we start experiencing issues. The headspace gauge will start getting closing on NO-GO but not close on field. We will lose a lug on the bolt. The bolt will start skipping over rounds in the magazine and fail to insert a round. We use LMT and Daniel Defense bolts and some will actually go longer but at about 20,000 rounds is when we will start to see issues appear.

- Gas tubes will erode away at the FSB after 12+ months

- Charging handles will "stretch" allowing the locking lever and spring to fly out

- Hammer pins and disconnectors on the 8.5" full-auto's will break after approximately 4,000-5,000 rounds regardless of the buffer weight."


So according to the author, on the AR you need to replace nearly every part on the rifle except the upper and lower receiver several times over just to get it to 100K rounds. Some parts especially on the shorter barreled AR's, the hammer pins as noted in the article start need replacement every 5K rounds, then mentions bolt carrier groups needing replacement every 20K rounds, then replacing gas tubes, charging handles, springs, barrels etc. Yet the same article states the AK goes to 100K rounds before you might have your first repair, which requires tig welding the receiver rails. Now I imagine barrels need to replaced at some point as no barrel lasts forever but that isn't mentioned for what they are doing with them. So I guess you can say running both weapons on straight full auto, the AR lasts 5K rounds before it starts needing it's first repairs while the AK lasts 100K rounds before needing it's first repairs. However as I personally believe, the future for weapons development is the AR18 and it's derivatives that everyone else developing.



7n6

Don't kid yourself. AK parts break and where out too. A barrel will not last 100k on any weapon. AK bolts break as well. Try replacing that or the barrel on an AK.

[crusader377]

Don't kid yourself. AK parts break and where out too. A barrel will not last 100k on any weapon. AK bolts break as well. Try replacing that or the barrel on an AK.

The AK and AR were fundamentally designed with different maintenance philosophies in mind. The U.S. Army always was a technically higher skilled army than the Soviets with much more robust maintenance functions at the unit level. Typically U.S. equipment does require regular maintenance but has a much longer service life than comparable Soviet/Russia designed equipment which needs less maintenance but may trade some long term durability.

If I can use car engines as an analogy. The U.S. may design car engines to last 300,000 miles. This engine is of higher performance than its Russian counterpart, however this engine needs the oil changed every 5,000 miles and belts changed every 50,000 miles.

In contrast the Russian engine is of lower performance but is designed to run without any maintenance at all. However this engine can only last 100,000 miles before it has to be completely rebuilt or simply scrapped.


So at the end of the day, which one is more reliable?

[JoshNC]

Did you ever try to procure Swiss parts from stocking dealers in Canada?

I picked up a very early 556 and tossed the abortion of handguards they put on there for a OEM 55x set I got from a dealer in Canada, this was in 2007.

I never really had to. I am flush with Swiss SIG parts as a result of chasing them for 18 years or so.

[Slippers]

I never really had to. I am flush with Swiss SIG parts as a result of chasing them for 18 years or so.

Yeah, you have so many that some are over here at my house.

[JoshNC]

Yeah, you have so many that some are over here at my house.

Hahahaha. True.

[RetroRevolver77]

Don't kid yourself. AK parts break and where out too. A barrel will not last 100k on any weapon. AK bolts break as well. Try replacing that or the barrel on an AK.

I've honestly never heard of a bolt breaking on an AK but I keep a few spares just in case. I believe the Polish military was testing barrels up to around 60K rounds. Barrels obviously are a pain in the ass to change out on the AK but they still do it which is why all the components are marked with numbers for inside dimensions to fit the corresponding barrel journals.

[eodinert]

which is why all the components are marked with numbers for inside dimensions to fit the corresponding barrel journals.

I've built a few AKs and I've never seen anything like this. Where are these marks? Every AK has these? Really?

For your reference file:
9216925.jpg
7414232.jpg

[RetroRevolver77]

I've built a few AKs and I've never seen anything like this. Where are these marks? Every AK has these? Really?

For your reference file:
9216925.jpg
7414232.jpg

Most quality components are going to have uniform heat treatment but some manufacturers have been found to have questionable heat treatment which I don't use. The recent Zastava rifles have been noted to have heat treatment issues for instance, not sure if that has since been corrected but it was the reason I sold mine off.

Anyway, the journal codes I'm referencing are the four digit codes on the barrel itself, it represents the journal marking measurements. The barrel components are measured and sorted into bins according to the size of the ID of each individual component. When they build them they go by those codes and only use the parts from the pre-sorted bin corresponding to the barrel journal diameter codes. Most of these codes are found on the higher end former com block manufacturers.

Here's a picture of the four digit codes running from left to right from one of my spare 74 barrels;

Attachment 51643