Realistic Expectations

[shadow93]

With my completion of my AR pistol I moved my Sf light and my LPVO off of my DD M4V5 and to the pistol. The pistol now more closely represents my work rifle except for length. This leaves me with a DDM4V5 with just Magpul MBUS Sights and a PA AFAB muzzle device and besides furniture otherwise stock. I've been wanting to get into more precision work but haven't wanted to take the plunge into a bolt action .308 yet like I would eventually like to do. If I make my M4V5 into a pseudo SPR for the time being what kind of reasonable accuracy expectations can I expect with a stock midlength gas system'd 5.56 barrel? If I dropped a bipod and say a Viper HS LR 6-24x50 FFP scope on it and started experimenting with some different rounds what can I expect?

[ALCOAR]

Expectations for what? Certain sized groups at 100yds, 200yd, etc.? Putting rounds on torso sized steel at max effective range for the 5.56? Going for the MarkM & PB special shooting to 1300yds?

I'm not a benchrest/comp shooter, so that aspect of precision I'll let someone more qualified to answer, however I'll share some thoughts on shooting for precision at long range.

My own experience has shown DD barrels to be easily among the leaders for most accurate CL barrels I've shot. Combine that with a mid powered variable optic, Geissele trigger, Atlas or Harris type bipod, and your already great DD FF rail...and bingo, you got a rifle that will allow to learn how to read wind, dope your rifle/scope for long range targets, and learn the fundamentals of LR shooting technique, hopefully prone.

The above rifle with a nice 600-800yd range with various different .223/5.56 loadings is the perfect instrument to start your endeavor into longer range shooting. As you go along, stay at the same 600-800yd ranges, but stop using the 77gr. OTM/75gr. HPBT rounds, and challenge yourself even further by using 50-60gr VMax loaded projectiles which helps hone your wind reading abilities even more. Also, all this allows you to see first hand the magic of long range ballistics (mirages/bullet trace/bullet glint if your lucky/bang.........ding/etc) which is huge in my experience to fully understanding what's all in play.

With the proper Indian, I'd guess your barrel is a 1.25-1.50 moa shooter across a multiple 10rd group eval. With the perfect hand load, it might even achieve close to MOA.

[shadow93]

Trident, thanks for the response. Essentially that would be my plan for the rifle, starting at 100-150 yards as thats what my closest range has and moving back as I get better. It would be a "cheaper" way for my to learn it as opposed to buying the .308 bolt gun and learning from that as I don't currently stock 308 like I do 5.56.

[vicious_cb]

Echoing what Trident is saying, when I first started shooting precision ARs I would compare my groups to shit people posted on the internet and wondered why my groups we're not as tight as theirs. After talking to people like Molon who live and breathe shooting for groups with the AR, 1.5 MOA consistent 10 shot groups @100yds with factory ammo is pretty damn good.

When people post sub-MOA groups its most likely bullshit. Those are cherry picked groups. Unless you are shooting with an expensive stainless precision barrel with custom reloaded ammo tuned for the gun, dont bother chasing sub-moa with the AR. Lower your expectations, 1.5 MOA is plenty good to hit man sized target out the realistic effective range of a 5.56 AR.

[shadow93]

What would be a reasonable scope magnification for 5.56 rifle then? The 6-24 I mentioned earlier might seem a bit high but I could move it to a .308 gun later at least.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Pappabear]

A 1-6 or 1-8 Vortex would suite you fine. It would take you well past where you currently go. Even a 1-4 would be fine, even an ACOG.

Good luck with your gun. Much good info already given.

PB

[shadow93]

I've got a 1-4 Steiner on my pistol already. I'm looking to have a higher base magnification if I go this route with this rifle.

[turnburglar]

For a SPR style rifle I would look at the 3-9 catagory. With a 32mm objective it will be more nimble than a 42 or 50mm optic, and keeping the rifle nimble is what 556 is all about. Of course if you are planning on buying a 308 later and just want the optic now, I get why you wouldnt buy twice. I had a 10x SWFA and liked it alot. Planned to buy a 308, and transfer it over.... but as history will show I never ended up buying that 308. After owning it for a while I decided to sell it and get a 1-8. Couldnt be happier. I feel like the LPVO was made for the AR.

[vicious_cb]

Expectations for what? Certain sized groups at 100yds, 200yd, etc.? Putting rounds on torso sized steel at max effective range for the 5.56? Going for the MarkM & PB special shooting to 1300yds?

I'm not a benchrest/comp shooter, so that aspect of precision I'll let someone more qualified to answer, however I'll share some thoughts on shooting for precision at long range.

My own experience has shown DD barrels to be easily among the leaders for most accurate CL barrels I've shot. Combine that with a mid powered variable optic, Geissele trigger, Atlas or Harris type bipod, and your already great DD FF rail...and bingo, you got a rifle that will allow to learn how to read wind, dope your rifle/scope for long range targets, and learn the fundamentals of LR shooting technique, hopefully prone.

The above rifle with a nice 600-800yd range with various different .223/5.56 loadings is the perfect instrument to start your endeavor into longer range shooting. As you go along, stay at the same 600-800yd ranges, but stop using the 77gr. OTM/75gr. HPBT rounds, and challenge yourself even further by using 50-60gr VMax loaded projectiles which helps hone your wind reading abilities even more. Also, all this allows you to see first hand the magic of long range ballistics (mirages/bullet trace/bullet glint if your lucky/bang.........ding/etc) which is huge in my experience to fully understanding what's all in play.

With the proper Indian, I'd guess your barrel is a 1.25-1.50 moa shooter across a multiple 10rd group eval. With the perfect hand load, it might even achieve close to MOA.

BTW Mr. Dent, do you happen to have the pics of your DD barrel accuracy test? The picture links are dead in your old thread when I tried to look it up again.

[ALCOAR]

Sure thing brother, but if I may ask first...check the thread below to confirm that all my pics are dead photofukit links. A few months ago when I was switching to Imgur, I checked some of my old threads and to my disappointment they were totally wrecked by huge chucks of dead pic links. However flash forward to a few weeks back when Photofukit announced new management and the reversal of the several hundred dollar yearly hosting fee....so I figured might as well see if the pic links in the threads are back up and working. Sure enough, the few I checked all had the original photos posted instead of the previous dead links. Now this might be a case where only I can see the pics or something since their mine, but I don't think so.

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread...LW-5-56-barrel

If you can't see the pics, then just let me know, and I'll redo the original thread but this time with Imgur pic links.