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Thread: SBR questions...

  1. #1
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    SBR questions...

    So I'm setting up a trust using Quicken WillMaker. Been doing a fair amount of reading here, at TOS and elsewhere but I thought I'd throw this out here since the opinions on this forum generally seem to be better informed. I have a Stag that I bought as a lower and then later put a Stag upper on it. I now want to SBR it. A couple of questions: WillMaker wants me to list property that belongs to the trust. Should I go ahead and list the Stag as property of the trust, or should I send in my Form 1 first? And when can I purchase a short upper for it? Do I have to wait for the ATF approval to come back, or can I just buy one (assuming I can find one) since it's only an upper and the Stag is currently in a legal, complete non-NFA configuration? I own a couple of other complete AR's. If it makes any difference I could store the upper at a non-gun-owning friend's house until the approval comes back. Finally, when does the engraving need to happen? Can I have it done any time after ownership of the Stag is transferred to the trust? Does it need to be done before assembling the SBR? Thanks for helping an NFA newbie out...

  2. #2
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    You can list the Stag as property of the Trust now if you want to. I would not wait any longer than when you receive the stamp. Once the stamp is received it is definately Trust property and should be reflected in your Trust schedules.

    You will get mixed answers on when you can purchase a short upper. My personal recommendation is to wait until you have a properly registered lower (MG, SBR, Pistol) before purchasing the short upper.

    I normally have my engraving done as soon as I mail the Form 1. I do not recommend assembling the SBR without the engraving being done first. Also keep in mind that if you have the stamp before getting it engraved that you can't leave the lower with just anyone. New rules must be followed with NFA items leaving your possession.


    The above is just my opinion. TIFWIW

  3. #3
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    I too am considering going the RLT route, simply because my current posting abroad precludes ready access to my CLEO back home, and a Trust would would allow me to save time by submitting the paperwork while I am still overseas. Trouble is, there is a lot of surface-deep information out there, but very little in-depth guidance without retaining costly legal counsel. (Military lawyers have no idea what an NFA Trust even is, and civil experts routinely quote $600 for such a service.)

    Obviously, the Quicken WillMaker method would seem to provide a much better return on investment, but lacking an exemplar or reference Trust document leaves me with no idea what "right" even looks like. I am a previous Class III owner, but have no experience with setting up a Trust. Are there decent examples available online, or M4CN members here that might be willing to provide sanitized copies of their own RLT paperwork via private e-mail, perhaps? I don't want to overlook some obscure detail that seems trivial now, but which could result in significant headaches years down the road.

    Chief
    Stand your ground; don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here. -- Captain John Parker, Lexington, 1775.

  4. #4
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    Just my HO, but I would NOT rely on a computer program for a trust. I used an attorney and am damn glad that I did .

  5. #5
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    I had the exact same question and decided to call BATFE last week to clear it up.

    I explained that I was submitting a Form 1 to apply for making and registering an SBR via a trust. I asked if the firearm (existing lower) should be listed on the 'Schedule A' sent in along with the declaration of trust upon submitting the application. He said no, you are applying for ATF approval on making an SBR and that item would not be trust property until the trust is approved to own/register the property.

    I recommend doing your own research, but that was my experience for what it's worth. Hope it helps.

  6. #6
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    There's nothing that says a trust can't own a title I firearm, so I don't see why it couldn't be listed as a trust's asset prior to form 1'ing it.

  7. #7
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    Thanks for the info and suggestions. I will certainly do some more research. It seems pretty straightforward, but I'm thinking I might see about getting an attorney to review it after generating the document from WillMaker.

    Chief, if you're willing to wade over into TOS, there is a long stickied thread there in the general NFA forum regarding Trusts. On page 13 (of 53 currently), a user named SWATH has posted images of the trust document that he used (generated using WillMaker and revised after consulting an attorney).

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