SBR, More than one upper

[mtk]

So this was a case where the defendant didn't have ANY lower registered as a pistol or SBR (and thus no possible lawful use for the short barreled upper)?

I just want to clarify because that changes the significance of this case.

Yes, that is the one, and it really doesn't change the situation all that much.

He had no lawful use for that upper and got convicted as a result.

If you've got a spare lower and enough spare parts to assemble it, and the only uppers you have on hand are the spare SBR uppers, you too have no lawful way to assemble that collection pf parts. Now you're relying on the existence of your registered SBR as a defense.

Is it a longshot? Yep. No doubt, it would take a near perfect storm of shit to come your way to find yourself in that situation. But as you're sitting in court, hearing the jury foreman say "Guilty, your Honor," I don't think the irony of whatever longshot it took to result in your felony conviction would be of any comfort.

It's a risk-reward thing. The ATF has shown itself to be quite happy to pick the low-hanging fruit. There is just very little payoff given the potential risk. Keep in mind that Federal Prosecutors have a roughly 93% conviction rate in court....

[mtk]

Yeah. How did ATF come to be involved with this Kent person? I can't remember if I'm familiar with this case or not.

I'm not too sure, but I think it was a War on Drugs thing of some sort. No matter really, somehow he ended up in The Man's crosshairs and the system did its thing.

Now, I'm quite certain your reply will be, "I have no reason to bring The Man into my life..." and you'll most likely be quite correct in 99.9% of cases.

It's that 0.01% we're discussing here, which turns out to be about equal to Russian Roulette on the repercussions scale.

[markm]

Now, I'm quite certain your reply will be, "I have no reason to bring The Man into my life..."

No. I don't have any uncommited SBR uppers. The more people that get 10 years in prison, the less people I have to compete with for AR parts and such!

[dbrowne1]

Yes, that is the one, and it really doesn't change the situation all that much.

He had no lawful use for that upper and got convicted as a result.

Right, whereas somebody who has both Title I rifle lowers and at least one SBR lower or pistol lower DOES have a lawful use for the short barreled upper. This guy didn't have a single SBR or pistol lower and he had only a Title I rifle lower to which the short upper could be readily and easily affixed.

I'm not surprised he got hosed but his case his clearly distinguishable from one in which a person has both Title I rifle lowers AND at least one SBR or pistol lower.

I think your cautious approach is wise but this case you're talking about doesn't support the theory that you're proposing.

[MX5]

Personally I wouldn't rely on anything you're reading whereas the poster indicates that he read it somewhere. I'm not picking on anyone or taking them to task. The intent of this forum (M4Carbine) is to discuss that of which you have first hand knowledge. To do otherwise is simply mimicking TOS(s) & just degrades this forum.

[NetJunkie]

When doing your Form 1 use the 4h box to list other calibers and barrel lengths. Not a big deal. You can only list one on the caliber and barrel length boxes, but you can add others to the 4h box.

[markm]

When doing your Form 1 use the 4h box to list other calibers and barrel lengths. Not a big deal. You can only list one on the caliber and barrel length boxes, but you can add others to the 4h box.

Huh?

I'm going off of memory here.. but doesn't 4h say something along the lines of "other markings that will appear on the firearm"? I.E. your engraving info?

[mtk]

Huh?

I'm going off of memory here.. but doesn't 4h say something along the lines of "other markings that will appear on the firearm"? I.E. your engraving info?

That box is for "other markings," not for the legally-required markings. Yeah, lots of folks put them in there anyway, but there is no need.

If you've got "Molon Labe" engraved on the front of the magwell, you put that info in 4h.

[mtk]

Personally I wouldn't rely on anything you're reading whereas the poster indicates that he read it somewhere. I'm not picking on anyone or taking them to task. The intent of this forum (M4Carbine) is to discuss that of which you have first hand knowledge. To do otherwise is simply mimicking TOS(s) & just degrades this forum.

So apparently you only want to see posts from Mr. Kent and one from some guy at Thompson Center since those are the only two people with first-hand knowledge on the subject.

By that logic, you could delete the entire NFA Forum since 99% of the stuff posted here doesn't meet that criterion.

[markm]

That box is for "other markings," not for the legally-required markings. Yeah, lots of folks put them in there anyway, but there is no need.

If you've got "Molon Labe" engraved on the front of the magwell, you put that info in 4h.

In either case, you wouldn't put other barrel lengths and calibers in there. That was my point.