AIM Surplus-PSL's!

[kal]

The above in bold runs counter to what you just posted. What you just posted is indeed the gist of it.

For heavens sake I should have just said 10 inches at 600 yards.

[Tomac]

A PSL is not a Dragunov, and is not a SVD Dragunov's equal in accuracy.
As a DMR, with decent, purpose built ammo (7N1), you should expect about what you would out of a standard M14 or FAL using standard ball ammo.
These are basically stretched out AKM's, with RPK squad auto type stamped receivers.

According to a Finnish sniper who's used both extensively the PSL & Dragunov in 7.62x54 are capable of the same inherent accuracy when using the same ammo. Of course the Dragunov has a much better short stroke gas system & better trigger w/a much lighter/faster hammer.
However, the biggest obstacle to realizing either rifle's accuracy is the lack of true lightweight (appx 150gr) match ammo.
When I owned a PSL (called the Romak-3 at the time) the best I could do w/the factory 4x scope & surplus Russian '188' ammo was 8 hits out of 50 slowfire at a std silhouette @900m which is exactly what NATO claims the SVD is capable of (16%@900m).
The NDM-86 Dragunov by Norinco in .308 is a different beast altogether. W/168gr match ammo it's capable of much better accuracy than a 20yr-old copy of a 40yr-old semi-auto w/chromed bore should be.
My personal best 3-shot group at 100m ctc using 168gr match measured .24". My best 4-shot ctc at 100m is .44". My best 3-shot at 500m is 4.5".
Once I tried rapid fire at 900m, 20 shots fired at a std silhouette w/no more than 4 seconds per shot except when changing the mag & I achieved a 50% hit ratio.
The SVD & PSL aren't sniper rifles in the Western sense but w/good ammo & a good shooter they're a viable threat further out than some people think.
Tomac

[Jay Cunningham]

Don't forget also that some are simply in love with the idea of them because they are different.

[Littlelebowski]

Don't forget also that some are simply in love with the idea of them because they are different.

Precisely. Gabe Suarez is building up a class around the PSL and the like. Never mind that the DPMS 308s shoot 200% better and cost marginally more, people just love the Sov-bloc stuff.

[kal]

Never mind that the DPMS 308s shoot 200% better and cost marginally more, people just love the Sov-bloc stuff.

I think the desire for systems other than the better shooting ar10 and derivatives are because of fear. Fear of unreliability in the ar10 platform, whether or not the fear is legitimate.

Reminds of a quote I read from Yevgeniy Dragunov, stating that the ideas that were to be incorporated into the design of the SVD contradicted one another. They wanted a light weight rifle, but an accurate rifle was to built as heavy as possible. The rifle was to be reliable, but the loose tolerances were going to affect the accuracy. And so forth...

Maybe some folk don't care about absolute accuracy? Maybe you're right, people love the societ bloc stuff....either way the result is the same.

[parker7777]

A few weeks ago I had the chance to shoot a psl at a local range. I took my SE M14 type rifle along for the trip. Long story short, the local range has a old steel ram on on a hill above the range that is about 430 yards from the firing point. The SE m14 with m118lr from a bi-pod was 100% on the ram with 3 shooters and 30 rounds. The psl with albanian ammo ( very cheap ammo .18c/rnd) was about 50%.

Considering the cost of the SE m14, optic(leupold m4), and ammo(I do not know the current commercial cost of m118lr) with the psl, supplied scope, and ammo--------I ordered a psl from and some ammo from AIM the other day.

They are great fun!

[Jack-O]

In order to maintain a site that is an effective database of good information, it is best to post information that you have first hand knowledge of.

and in that spirit...

I have seen fairly consistent 2" or better groups when using that surplus 7N1 that was on the market recently.

Dave Fortier has told me that he gets really good results with the wolf 200gr extra match load as well.

I do hear good things about the silvertip czech ammo as well, but I have always had major signs of overpressure with this ammo and sold all that I had.

it is a capable gun when used with good ammo.

[Littlelebowski]

If only it were easier to rebarrel with a heavier barrel or if we could stlll buy the Chinese .308 rifles for an affordable price....

[DRich]

... if we could stlll buy the Chinese .308 rifles for an affordable price....

Don't remind me about the NDM-86 I sold for $700...

Almost as bad as my father trading his '58 Vette for a '74 LTD because we needed a family car when I was a kid...

I have a PSL that will shoot an honest 2MOA at 200m with my handloads, assuming I do my part. Most brands of surplus that I've tried push it out to ~3MOA+, though. It's a fun rifle, but only a range toy for me.

[DrDoot]

Precisely. Gabe Suarez is building up a class around the PSL and the like. Never mind that the DPMS 308s shoot 200% better and cost marginally more, people just love the Sov-bloc stuff.

You can't buy a new, scoped DPMS in .308 for even close to $700.