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Thread: Got Testosterone?

  1. #951
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    Thanks to this thread I got tested. I'm 55 and discovered that I have both low T and low T4.
    Starting Testosterone replacement and Thyroid support.
    Looking forward to better quality of life all around.
    Thanks Will for the knowledge you share here on a regular basis!

    Eta: Testosterone 179, Free T4 0.75
    Symptoms: weight gain, moodiness, loss of muscle mass/strength
    I also have sleep apnea and will be starting overnight O2 therapy soon.
    Last edited by Buckaroo; 09-19-17 at 15:20.
    "It is better to be a Warrior in a Garden than a Gardner in a War"
    Let's use the First Amendment to protect the Second so we can avoid using the Second to protect the First.

  2. #952
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buckaroo View Post
    Thanks to this thread I got tested. I'm 55 and discovered that I have both low T and low T4.
    Starting Testosterone replacement and Thyroid support.
    Looking forward to better quality of life all around.
    Thanks Will for the knowledge you share here on a regular basis!
    I'm happy to assist. Report you low numbers, and report your treated numbers when you are re tested. Write down subjective symptoms, if any, while low (now) and keep track of them as each week passes until you're retested and see how/if they line up. Make sure doc you're working with is up to speed RE: the topics covered here for issues such as dose, dose schedules, etc all of which makes a huge difference and (sadly) few docs know that intel supplied in this lengthy thread, which is worth taking the time to read as an investment in your health and well being. If you simply go by what the doc tells you for dose, type, schedule etc, unless he/she is really up to speed (and as anyone here will tell you, that's a unicorn) you may end up no better, or worse than you began, so be informed. Word.
    - Will

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    “Those who do not view armed self defense as a basic human right, ignore the mass graves of those who died on their knees at the hands of tyrants.”

  3. #953
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    What if your PSA numbers go up, is that a bad sign?

  4. #954
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stranger45 View Post
    What if your PSA numbers go up, is that a bad sign?
    Maybe. Maybe not. Depends on your total PSA level and what your urologist finds when he does the rectal exam.

  5. #955
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hmac View Post
    Maybe. Maybe not. Depends on your total PSA level and what your urologist finds when he does the rectal exam.
    Also, my understanding if the velocity of change in those numbers, if they change at all, the most relevant variable.
    - Will

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    www.BrinkZone.com

    LE/Mil specific info:

    https://brinkzone.com/category/swatleomilitary/

    “Those who do not view armed self defense as a basic human right, ignore the mass graves of those who died on their knees at the hands of tyrants.”

  6. #956
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillBrink View Post
    Also, my understanding if the velocity of change in those numbers, if they change at all, the most relevant variable.
    Importance of velocity of change is highly debated. Many or most urologists believe it to be secondary to the actual PSA level and results of DRE. Increasingly fewer urologists would biopsy solely on the basis of PSA velocity.

  7. #957
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hmac View Post
    Importance of velocity of change is highly debated. Many or most urologists believe it to be secondary to the actual PSA level and results of DRE. Increasingly fewer urologists would biopsy solely on the basis of PSA velocity.
    Of course there's an ongoing debate over total PSA vs free, and the ratio there of and the strength of either in predicting PC. Regardless, we know PSA far from a perfect test and just a tool in the tool box among diagnostic tools for PC. Most recent paper I found would support what you're saying in terms of actually improving the screening and clinical management:

    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...78143914001525
    - Will

    General Performance/Fitness Advice for all

    www.BrinkZone.com

    LE/Mil specific info:

    https://brinkzone.com/category/swatleomilitary/

    “Those who do not view armed self defense as a basic human right, ignore the mass graves of those who died on their knees at the hands of tyrants.”

  8. #958
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    There's really no clinical debate. The bullshit over PSA is based on the possibility that a rising or elevated PSA might cause some unnecessary prostate biopsies. When it comes to cancer, I would rather overdiagnose than underdiagnose, and overtreat rather than undertreat. They're worried about spending money, urologists are worried about people dying of prostate cancer.

  9. #959
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    Cause and effect is unclear here, but men with low T and not treated, have an increased risk of developing autoimmune diseases;

    Clin Rheumatol. 2016 Dec;35(12):2983-2987. Epub 2016 Jun 20.

    Hypogonadism and the risk of rheumatic autoimmune disease.

    Baillargeon et al

    Abstract

    Testosterone deficiency has been linked with autoimmune disease and an increase in inflammatory markers, such as C-reactive protein (CRP), tumor necrosis factor, and interleukin-6 (IL-6). However, no large-scale longitudinal studies have examined this association. We examined whether untreated hypogonadism was associated with an increased risk of rheumatic autoimmune disease in a large nationally representative cohort. Using one of the nation's largest commercial insurance databases, we conducted a retrospective cohort study in which we identified 123,460 men diagnosed with hypogonadism between January 1, 2002 and December 31, 2014 and with no prior history of rheumatic autoimmune disease. We matched this cohort to 370,380 men without hypogonadism, at a 1 to 3 ratio, on age and index/diagnosis date. All patients were followed until December 31, 2014 or until they lost insurance coverage or were diagnosed with a rheumatic autoimmune disease. Cox proportional hazards regression was used to calculate adjusted hazard ratios (aHRs). Untreated hypogonadism was associated with an increased risk of developing any rheumatic autoimmune disease (HR = 1.33, 95 % CI = 1.28, 1.38), rheumatoid arthritis (HR = 1.31, 95 % CI = 1.22, 1.44), and lupus (HR = 1.58, 95 % CI = 1.28, 1.94). These findings persisted using latency periods of 1 and 2 years. Hypogonadism was not associated with the control outcome, epilepsy (HR = 1.04, 95 % CI = 0.96, 1.15). Patients diagnosed with hypogonadism who were not treated with testosterone had an increased risk of developing any rheumatic autoimmune disease, rheumatoid arthritis, and lupus. Future research should further examine this association, with particular attention to underlying mechanisms.
    - Will

    General Performance/Fitness Advice for all

    www.BrinkZone.com

    LE/Mil specific info:

    https://brinkzone.com/category/swatleomilitary/

    “Those who do not view armed self defense as a basic human right, ignore the mass graves of those who died on their knees at the hands of tyrants.”

  10. #960
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillBrink View Post
    Cause and effect is unclear here, but men with low T and not treated, have an increased risk of developing autoimmune diseases;

    Clin Rheumatol. 2016 Dec;35(12):2983-2987. Epub 2016 Jun 20.

    Hypogonadism and the risk of rheumatic autoimmune disease.

    Baillargeon et al

    Abstract

    Testosterone deficiency has been linked with autoimmune disease and an increase in inflammatory markers, such as C-reactive protein (CRP), tumor necrosis factor, and interleukin-6 (IL-6). However, no large-scale longitudinal studies have examined this association. We examined whether untreated hypogonadism was associated with an increased risk of rheumatic autoimmune disease in a large nationally representative cohort. Using one of the nation's largest commercial insurance databases, we conducted a retrospective cohort study in which we identified 123,460 men diagnosed with hypogonadism between January 1, 2002 and December 31, 2014 and with no prior history of rheumatic autoimmune disease. We matched this cohort to 370,380 men without hypogonadism, at a 1 to 3 ratio, on age and index/diagnosis date. All patients were followed until December 31, 2014 or until they lost insurance coverage or were diagnosed with a rheumatic autoimmune disease. Cox proportional hazards regression was used to calculate adjusted hazard ratios (aHRs). Untreated hypogonadism was associated with an increased risk of developing any rheumatic autoimmune disease (HR = 1.33, 95 % CI = 1.28, 1.38), rheumatoid arthritis (HR = 1.31, 95 % CI = 1.22, 1.44), and lupus (HR = 1.58, 95 % CI = 1.28, 1.94). These findings persisted using latency periods of 1 and 2 years. Hypogonadism was not associated with the control outcome, epilepsy (HR = 1.04, 95 % CI = 0.96, 1.15). Patients diagnosed with hypogonadism who were not treated with testosterone had an increased risk of developing any rheumatic autoimmune disease, rheumatoid arthritis, and lupus. Future research should further examine this association, with particular attention to underlying mechanisms.
    I suspect that might have cause and effect mixed up. But interesting.

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