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Thread: 38 Super

  1. #11
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    Oct 2008
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    Theoretically, the 9x23 would have higher terminal ballistics, but again, that's all based on the basis of its SAAMI spec vs. the 38 Super (which is often erroneously compared to a 10mm in the 40/10 comparison).

    As stated earlier, SAAMI specs are established based upon the worst case scenario and in the case of a 90 year old cartridge like the 38 Super, that's being able to load it in an old gun. The 9x23's pressure value is higher, I believe, but again...since it's about a decade old (+/-) it's got the advantage of being designed for modern guns.

    It's failure in mass production came down to, 'what do I get for my money?'.

    Do you get increased capacity over 38 Super? Eh...maybe 1 round on a 10 round mag for a 1911 due to the greater rim diameter of the 38 Super over the 9x23 (inspite of what folks think the 9x23 is semi-rimmed hence why there's 9x23 brass and 9 Supercomp = rimless 9x23). If THAT's the only reason though, reload 38 Supercomp (rimless 38 super) and adjust the extractor and done. If you want factory ammo in 38 Supercomp, Atlanta Arms & Ammo. Good enough for the AMU.

    Is the brass and/or ammo readily available? At its inception, no. Winchester was really the only source for ammunition and were not selling just the brass. When they did the price was super high compared to 38 Super and so for IPSC shooters buying brass by the 1-2k for recreational use why would they pay more? It wasn't until Starline started manufacturing the brass that it had a chance, but at that point, the damage and experimentation had been done. Even odd ball brass by top shooters like Todd Jarrett (Hornady's 38 TJ) didn't work for the same exact reason (lack of availability to the public affordably). For factory ammunition, while the 38 Super is not a very popular round with companies, again, Winchester was it.

    Flatter shooting is a non-issue as all the hot-rodded "straight" walled 9 variants are flat. 9x25 and 356 TSW aren't really in the discussion as they were VERY special cartridges and while arguably flatter than the straight walled cousins, you were down mag capacity and beat the crap out of the guns.

    9x23 is a solid caliber and if I had a Colt 1991 chambered in it, it'd be nice, so long as I had a brass supply. However, if I didn't, that pistol would be quickly getting a new barrel to either 9mm or 38 Super 'cause...I can buy ammo for it just about anywhere (9mm obviously more than 38 Super).

    Rich
    Last edited by uscbigdawg; 08-11-10 at 12:48.
    "Pressure is what you feel when you don't know what you're doing." - Chuck Knox

    For those that say USPSA/IPSC/3-Gun isn't tactical...speed is a tactic!

  2. #12
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    The 9x23 brass seems to be much stronger, with the winchester being stronger then the starline. From some pictures on the internet the web area appears to be quite a bit thicker, enabling it to withstand higher pressures. I think this is particularly important in guns like a 1911 where the original design doesn't have a fully supported chamber. I think a correctly setup older 1911 would be perfectly capable of safely running 9x23, more so then 10mm.

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