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Thread: The Official Why My DPMS, Del-Ton, Oly Arms, Etc. Is Better Than Anything Else Thread

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  1. #1
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    The Official Why My DPMS, Del-Ton, Oly Arms, Etc. Is Better Than Anything Else Thread

    Well apparently some of my most recent posts have hurt alot of peoples' feelings when I criticize their DPMS, Delton, CMMG, Oly Arms, you name it selection. The reason behind this post is simple. Many of us consider AR's to be fighting weapons. Not something that we show off to our friends, shoot dirt clods with and take cool pictures with in our latest tactical garb.

    Many of those who defend these substandard weapons will do so without listening to any reason or the voice of experience. So in order to prevent another 500 hundred if these threads from appearing I am starting this one. Here is the deal.

    1. If you want to post why you think your xxxxx carbine/rifle is better than Daniel Defense, Colt, BCM, Noveske, LMT or other known proven weapons be prepared to explain why.

    2. If you think that holding to the TDP or trying to produce a good quality weapon isn't important explain to us why. If you think that staking the carrier key or endplate is unnecessary please tell us why.

    3. If you have an exceptional tale of how your carbine/rifle has performed in high count training or otherwise please share it with us.

    4. If you feel that you can't wait for a good weapon and have to have something else now. Then explain why it's necessary.
    Last edited by Iraqgunz; 10-29-10 at 00:20.



    Owner/Instructor at Semper Paratus Arms

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    Semper Paratus Arms AR15 Armorer Course http://www.semperparatusarms.com/cou...-registration/

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    Master Armorer/R&D at SIONICS Weapon Systems- http://sionicsweaponsystems.com

  2. #2
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    My RRA National Match A2 trumps all because .............................






    it's mine
    Dan Miami, FL

  3. #3
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    Good idea gunz.

    I can say that after owning approx. 16 BM's over the last 20+ years that I have learned the short comings of this paticular brand. I dumped my last BM about 5 yrs ago for a LMT. After giving it to my wife I now have a Colt 6920 and can truly say that I am now completely satifised with my decision and it's performance. I will "blame" my long term BM ownership on two things; not having the education to make an informed, intelligent decision and listening to the gun shop BS. I'm feel I am now sufficently educated and have for years now ignored the gun shop BS that is so typical.

    I will offer some friendly advise to those who own the lower tier brands, recognize their place in the world of weapons. As bottom feeders. Not to say they will not serve "your" needs but, as 'gunz said, if you defend them as being "as good as" then offer proof. If it is just a range toy or safe queen then any number of lower priced brands should serve in that role. Otherwise I will need to see some hard, overwhelming proof that the lower end of the spectrum is "just as good as"

    Also, understand we/I am not talking about your car, wife, dog etc., we are discussing a mechanical instrument. Do not get butt hurt. If it fills your needs then good, if not, understand there are some fixes that will improves it's place in the world or you can do the same as I have, trade up. I did and am glad I did.

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    I think this thread can serve another function as well.

    It is "possible" that some of these brands are reacting to market forces, and have started tightening up their show a bit. I see that some manufacturers renowned for junk have at least started offering better material parts as an option, and I saw a photo the other day of a Del-Ton gas key that was properly staked. I know, kind of like Ahab's White Whale, but there it is....

    I know that I'd be happy if the AR market were completely flooded with "as good as" guns that really were "as good as".

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    Should posters share their experience or credentials as the begining of their post so as to allow the reader to gain insight to their viewpoint? I know that your (Iraqgunz) background clearly gives weight to your opinion versus me as a neophyte arguing the merits of brand X. Also experience or lack of adds/subtracts weight. Just a thought...

  6. #6
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    Sure, why not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Naxet1959 View Post
    Should posters share their experience or credentials as the begining of their post so as to allow the reader to gain insight to their viewpoint? I know that your (Iraqgunz) background clearly gives weight to your opinion versus me as a neophyte arguing the merits of brand X. Also experience or lack of adds/subtracts weight. Just a thought...



    Owner/Instructor at Semper Paratus Arms

    Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/SemperParatusArms/

    Semper Paratus Arms AR15 Armorer Course http://www.semperparatusarms.com/cou...-registration/

    M4C Misc. Training and Course Announcements- http://www.m4carbine.net/forumdisplay.php?f=141

    Master Armorer/R&D at SIONICS Weapon Systems- http://sionicsweaponsystems.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post

    It is "possible" that some of these brands are reacting to market forces, and have started tightening up their show a bit. I see that some manufacturers renowned for junk have at least started offering better material parts as an option, .
    Absolutely. With the Obamamania over and the gun business slow, the companies selling junk are starting to realize they are losing business because people know their product is inferior.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    I think this thread can serve another function as well.

    It is "possible" that some of these brands are reacting to market forces, and have started tightening up their show a bit. I see that some manufacturers renowned for junk have at least started offering better material parts as an option, and I saw a photo the other day of a Del-Ton gas key that was properly staked. I know, kind of like Ahab's White Whale, but there it is....

    I know that I'd be happy if the AR market were completely flooded with "as good as" guns that really were "as good as".
    I, on the other hand, have a Del-Ton that has a quasi-staked gas key. Yes, they did push the sides in towards the screws, but there was no contact with the screws. Obviously, they tried but didn't quite achieve the desired results. I now have a BCM BCG that has replaced the Del-Ton BCG. I am sure this are other "issues". When I purchased the Del-Ton, it was right after Obama took office, and I have since learned quite a bit by following threads on this site.

  9. #9
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    Bushy

    I recognize a few people here from another smaller forum I've posted a couple of times on but I've been lurking here off and on for a while so I thought I'd go ahead and post up my experience.

    I bought my Bushmaster on Nov. 12, 2008 and have since put about 1000 rounds down the pipe. My only issue with it have been a couple of stove pipes. Not bad but still unacceptable IMO. I see no reason why a rifle should ever really do that. The Colts I've seen in training never did that, or experienced any other issues, when digesting magazine after magazine of Wolf steel cased ammo. So in my quest to fix this issue and on the advice of others I sent money to BCM for a bolt carrier group and H buffer. They got here last week... and I didn't install them.

    I looked long and hard at the new parts, decided the Bushy wasn't deserving, and am placing an order for a BCM upper to go on my current lower.

    Some interesting notes on my BM from 2008:
    - Purchase Nov. 12, 2008
    - Approximately 1000 rounds through it.
    -The gas key was about 1/2 staked from the factory. That is, one side was touching the bolts holding the gas key (or really close) and the other half wasn't. Even on the side that's done a bit better it's nowhere nearly as well done as BCM or Colt carriers. I staked it by hand at around 250 rounds.
    -They didn't even try to stake the castle nut.
    -The bolt carrier is the newer style semi-auto unit that has a lot more metal in it than the original semi-auto carriers.
    -Came with a carbine buffer.
    -Has M4 feed ramps.
    -Trigger is heavy but crisp with no gritty feeling. It has very little slack to take up.
    -Chamber seems to be 5.56 Nato (55gr 5.56 accounts for well over half the rounds I've put through it).
    -It's WAY over gassed. This is to the point that it stings ones face and really burns the eyes to shoot NTCH without glasses on. In comparison I'd say that it's about half as painful (maybe 3/4 if it really gets the eyes) as getting hit by an 8% solution of pepper spray... fortunately it doesn't last nearly as long.
    Last edited by ldirel; 10-31-10 at 19:15.

  10. #10
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    The only issues I had with my Bushy was trying to run the upper on a FA lower. I replaced The semi BCG and she ran fine on SA, FA was a no go. I changed buffers and buffer springs with no luck. I think it was an issue with the gas tube. I put an LMT 10.5" upper on and it runs like a sewing machine.
    "Real men have always needed to know what time it is so they are at the airfield on time, pumping rounds into savages at the right time, etc. Being able to see such in the dark while light weights were comfy in bed without using a light required luminous material." -Originally Posted by ramairthree

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