Page 15 of 70 FirstFirst ... 513141516172565 ... LastLast
Results 281 to 300 of 1394

Thread: Comparison Chart of Major AR Brands

  1. #281
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Denver
    Posts
    647
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    And again, others bring up the TDP, not me. I specifically avoid even discussing it, and the "mil-spec" loaded word, as I do not believe that it is germane to the discussion. I frankly don't care where the list of requirements came from, I only care to list features that are offered and who offers them.
    I'd like to say thanks to Rob for doing putting this list together. You can look at the list as a 'who offers what for how much' list. So depending on your criteria for a M4(ish) gun, you can find a manufacturer that has what you want and look at overall value of what you are getting. There is great value in being able to do this.

    I don't see why people assume that this is a 'which is best' list. It is only listing desirable features and who offers what.

  2. #282
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    SE FL
    Posts
    14,228
    Feedback Score
    5 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by UVvis View Post
    I'd like to say thanks to Rob for doing putting this list together. You can look at the list as a 'who offers what for how much' list. So depending on your criteria for a M4(ish) gun, you can find a manufacturer that has what you want and look at overall value of what you are getting. There is great value in being able to do this.
    Thank you. This is entirely the point. I do want to make one edit to something you said though.

    It is only listing features some may find desirable and who offers what.

  3. #283
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    VA/OH
    Posts
    26,962
    Feedback Score
    32 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    Who has the TDP on this site and is thus able to verify that what is claimed to be TDP, is really TDP? Without this, it becomes "Second hand information WITHOUT a source." No?
    Some of the site sponsors on this forum have it. I also talk to other people outside of this forum that have access to it. One of the companies that I talk to about what the TDP says is Sabre Defence.

    There is also a difference between information that I post and information from someone that we do not know.



    C4
    Last edited by C4IGrant; 10-19-07 at 10:15.

  4. #284
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    VA/OH
    Posts
    26,962
    Feedback Score
    32 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by jbfurr View Post
    If I may, let me claify a few things about my earlier post.

    1. I am not "the" or "a" industry insider. My definition of an insider in this context would be someone who works for a manufacturer vs. someone who distributes or retails their products.

    2. I am new to this forum and apologize for posting a "secondhand" item without identifying the author. I wasn't aware that is a no-no. The author gave me permission to post the information provided I did not reveal the author or the company for which he works.

    3. I certainly did not intend to offend anyone or cause a fuss, so don't be too hard on me. I found the chart interesting and applaud the fellows that obviously went to a lot of trouble to gather the informaton.

    An industry insider would generally be someone that has the TDP in their hand. Someone that just distributes/retails a product would not fall into this catagory IMHO.

    Your industry insider could be an employee at oly arms. This persons opinion on how a fighting should be built would carry zero water around here.

    Unless the person that gave you the info wants share their name and the company that they work for, then please don't bother posting what they have to say.




    C4

  5. #285
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    VA/OH
    Posts
    26,962
    Feedback Score
    32 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by UVvis View Post
    I'd like to say thanks to Rob for doing putting this list together. You can look at the list as a 'who offers what for how much' list. So depending on your criteria for a M4(ish) gun, you can find a manufacturer that has what you want and look at overall value of what you are getting. There is great value in being able to do this.

    I don't see why people assume that this is a 'which is best' list. It is only listing desirable features and who offers what.
    Agree. The chart just tells you what the Govt calls out and which companies follow it (as best they can). If an option isn't of interest to you, then that is fine.



    C4

  6. #286
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    1,160
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by C4IGrant View Post
    Some of the site sponsors on this forum have it. I also talk to other people outside of this forum that have access to it. One of the companies that I talk to about what the TDP says is Sabre Defence.

    There is also a difference between information that I post and information from someone that we do not know.



    C4

    Thanks. I am surprised someone has not obtained it via FOIA or something.

  7. #287
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    851
    Feedback Score
    6 (100%)
    Thanks for posting this! It looks like as soon as I install the BCM BCG and CTR Carbine Stock MIL-Spec Package, my BM M4gery A2 will be good to go.

  8. #288
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Denver
    Posts
    647
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    Thank you. This is entirely the point. I do want to make one edit to something you said though.

    It is only listing features some may find desirable and who offers what.
    Thanks, that is more accurate.

  9. #289
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Long Island
    Posts
    308
    Feedback Score
    0
    that is a great chart . i am curious as to where HK, POF, and LWRC fit in on the chart . would like to hear your input .

  10. #290
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    2,626
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by TUNNEL RAT 33 View Post
    that is a great chart . i am curious as to where HK, POF, and LWRC fit in on the chart . would like to hear your input .
    They wont fit as the chart is for M4ish type weapons and the ones you listed are piston guns.

  11. #291
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    74
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by jbfurr View Post
    Two companies, Colt Defense and FN, have access to and use of the Government Technical Drawing Package (TDP), and literally sign away the life of their company that they cannot and will not use that TDP for anything other than government contracted builds.
    In regards to FN you are correct.

    Hate to pile on, but in regards to Colt that is incorrect. It is the Government that has purchased a nonexclusive license agreement (DAAF03-67-C-0108) for the TDP from Colt. Meaning it is the Government that has limited use of Colt's TDP.

  12. #292
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    74
    Feedback Score
    0
    Keep the discussion on track.
    Last edited by STAFF; 10-22-07 at 08:36. Reason: Not adding to the discussion.

  13. #293
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    SE FL
    Posts
    14,228
    Feedback Score
    5 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by TUNNEL RAT 33 View Post
    that is a great chart . i am curious as to where HK, POF, and LWRC fit in on the chart . would like to hear your input .
    It's something I've toyed with, but it would be a separate chart. Some of the items, like barrel steel and QC for barrel steel, would be the same. I'd probably have to add a column for piston type (short, long, whatever) as well.

    Frankly, the piston guns don't hold much interest for me so it's tough to get excited enough about them to take the time to do the research and compile the info.

  14. #294
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Denver
    Posts
    647
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Ekie View Post
    If Sabre Defence was to have aquired Colt's TDP in a legitimate fasion, they are not to be discussing it with you, as per the NDA:
    Is it actually Colt's or the Military's? Couldn't the military have it's own criteria for spare parts that includes the specs for all the individual parts?

  15. #295
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    16
    Feedback Score
    0
    I have a S&W M&PT with a BCM Bolt group and a H2 buffer, If I replace the upper with M4 feed ramps and upgrade the barrel with a LMT or BCM, how would that stack up?

    Bri

  16. #296
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    74
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by UVvis View Post
    Is it actually Colt's or the Military's? Couldn't the military have it's own criteria for spare parts that includes the specs for all the individual parts?
    No, the M16/M4 TDP is Colt's. For example, here is an award for some minor replacement parts, notice the clause stating that the TDP is subject to restrictions:

    https://aais.ria.army.mil/aais/award...R0309/0000.pdf
    Last edited by Ekie; 10-22-07 at 10:04. Reason: to add a reference

  17. #297
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    74
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    Thanks. I am surprised someone has not obtained it via FOIA or something.
    Colt's TDP is exempted from the FOIA, see Exemption 4, TRADE SECRETS:

    http://www.usdoj.gov/oip/exemption4.htm

  18. #298
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    1,160
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Ekie View Post
    Colt's TDP is exempted from the FOIA, see Exemption 4, TRADE SECRETS:

    http://www.usdoj.gov/oip/exemption4.htm
    "or something"

  19. #299
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    74
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    "or something"
    Yes, there are other methods, see Christianson v. Colt Industries.

  20. #300
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    SE FL
    Posts
    14,228
    Feedback Score
    5 (100%)
    Updated version posted.

Page 15 of 70 FirstFirst ... 513141516172565 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •