Sig 516 upper for AR

**Iraqgunz** · 01-11-11, 18:01

FWIW the CAG guys at the location where I was just at were still using the 416 and everyone of them had nothing but good stuff to say about them.

Originally Posted by 10mmAuto

I've heard from SF guys who were issued 416s that they got very mediocre accuracy out them (~4MOA), had sharp recoil, carrier tilt - the same problem most piston ARs have basically. Is this typical?

**Ed L.** · 01-11-11, 18:16

Originally Posted by 10mmAuto

Not bagging on the 416, just setting the record straight - CAG turned in their 416s in years ago.

There seems to be a lot of people repeating this rumor and have been for years.

**The Dumb Gun Collector** · 01-11-11, 18:18

10mm,

I think you may mean the AWG guys who were told to turn their's in during the big carbine debates a few years back. This is back when Sen. Coburn was jumping the Pentagon's ass for letting Delta and other guys carry the 416 while regular army were stuck with standard M4s. Soon after that the AWG guys were told to turn theirs in. I believe the Delta folks allowed to keep theirs (or they just ignored the whole thing).

I may be wrong about this. But this is the info I have seen.

**Ed L.** · 01-11-11, 18:19

Originally Posted by Greg Bell

I certainly agree with everyone here that piston ARs are pretty pointless for most folks. Even Larry Vickers, who helped HK develop the 416, says that pistons aren't really needed unless you are going below 16 or even 14.5. And further, if you aren't running suppresser or full auto, then you are missing a lot of the advantage.

I do think that people can go too far lumping all piston ARs in the unproven category. Most certainly are, but not all. The HK 416, especially, has a pretty impressive list of adoptees. It is hard to imagine Delta going through all that trouble to adopt a gun that is less reliable. The results of the dust tests, IAR competition, etc also seem to point to the the 416 being pretty dang reliable.

Again, I am in total agreement that most folks don't need piston ARs. But let's not go overboard.

Exactly right. Both Larry Vickers and DOCGKR have commented on this board how the HK416 outperforms the M4--but most civilian users and LEOs as well as many Soldiers and Marines are probably fine with an M4.

**GTF425** · 01-11-11, 18:27

Originally Posted by 10mmAuto

Not bagging on the 416, just setting the record straight - CAG turned in their 416s in years ago.

The Cool Kids I've played with had 416's. There are plenty of them seeing use in country by US SOF.

**Ed L.** · 01-11-11, 18:41

I will have to chime in that I am skeptical of the Sig 516 given that company's slide in quality over the last few years. Their handgun QC has cgone down the tubes and I really don't need to comment about the Sig250.

The Sig556 was a huge disappointment compared to a real 550 when just a bit of better thinking and QC on the part of the company could have made a big difference.

If you have a Sig 516 and it works well, that's great. Don't let people get you down.

I've gotten all types of criticism, ribs and abuse for shooting Bullpups. Larry Vickers turned me into a ribbing target for bringing a Steyr AUG to his class, and I even had two friends try to stage an intervention to get me to abandon bullpups. Since I ran an AR variant or another in the last few classes I took, I guess they succeeded.

**variablebinary** · 01-12-11, 01:49

Originally Posted by 10mmAuto

Not bagging on the 416, just setting the record straight - CAG turned in their 416s in years ago.

That was AWG, not CAG, and they didn't turn them in, they were taken away because big Army was dealing with a lot of drama at the time related to the M4.

I only know one person who was issued an M4 and didn't like it, and he was a Marine that hated the weight, and recoil.

Just about everyone else had mostly positive things to say about the HK416.

**10mmAuto** · 01-12-11, 01:53

Originally Posted by Iraqgunz

FWIW the CAG guys at the location where I was just at were still using the 416 and everyone of them had nothing but good stuff to say about them.

Got it, I obviously had bad information and assumed it was correct because Asymmetric Warfare Group turned theirs in around the same time CAG was rumored to.