AFM barrel review

[bkb0000]

Some people been asking about www.afmfirearms.com.. here you go.

I found these guys while surfing the web one night. The specs looked righteous, and the price was right.

CMV, chrome-lined, 1/7, HPT/MPT, 14.5 M4, for $250... and after talking to them, AVAILABLE! Which was pretty important in the early part of this year.

Having never heard of them before, I figured they might be new in the game/unknown/have good availability. This was in December 08 or January 09, right when things were still impossible to get ahold of.

Long story getting the barrels.. I ordered the barrels March 1 (i think), was given an ETA of two weeks to ship (NOBODY was shipping that fast). My card was charged $510 the following day. Waited 5 weeks, no barrels.. so i started calling. I'll never know how many times I called, leaving messages until the voicemail box filled up. Then I emailed, and emailed some more, and finally, after about 15 weeks, I emailed and demanded a refund or my barrels within two weeks. Got an email back in 4 days, saying my barrels would ship by the end of the week. They didn't, so i emailed again- and, seemingly coincidentally, got an email back in about an hour that ignored my previous email, telling me my barrels had shipped. The builds these barrels would have supplied had long since been completed with barrels ordered and received elsewhere, but I was still eager to see these..

About a week later, my barrels finally arrived. Upon opening the box, I carefully sifted through the mounds of bubblewrap to see how exactly they'd been wrapped (i've received barrels that were poorly packaged and had been damaged in transit before- the crown, naturally)- and noticed they'd packed them muzzle to muzzle with nothing in between. The threads on one of the barrels was slightly boogered up, and I'll assume it was from the packing job.


they were pretty well oiled up in a thin preservative that smells like wildflowers.. anybody know what it is? smells good..



I tapped the burrs on the threads back into place, and forced a muzzle device on.. cleaned that part up.

This is actually after de-burring. The pre-photos apparently didn't come out, for some reason. Upon eye-balling the bores, i noted that both had significant burring at the gas ports. one was worse than the other, so i chose this one to tear apart. I'd estimate the burr extended about .08-.09 into the bore before i scraped it out with an aluminum, then brass rod. The other bore isn't nearly as bad, but it's still there.


Not possessing electrical impedance or electrochemical analysis equiptment, i cannot verify steel grade, or of course whether it's actually HPT/MPI as advertised and marked..

but I can check what i can check.

bore measures 1 twist in 7"


M4 ramps


Chrome lined


1/8" Straight pins, rather than 2/0 tapers


No park under the FSB


Gas port's .061.. couple thous on the tight side, not a huge concern


I ordered F FSBs- this isn't marked, and it's shy of F, but still taller than A2, so dont ask me. It zero'd fine.



So far so decent... the burrs are gay, but the rest appears to be on par with LMT, which is probably what they're shooting for.

I at least colt-blue and grease- maybe the blue will help a little after the grease burns out. I've been meaning to get set up for park- I'm a busy guy, though.


Ream for tapers


M4 upper and delta assembly came in from Bravo while reaming, perfect timing


I pin, but I dont weld


Biggest damn crane fly i've ever seen in my life was hanging out on my drill press- he (she, probably) now lives in a jar of alcohol in my shop..


So about an hour later, grind polish and blue the tig weld my good friends at Heller Enterprises out of Saint Helens do for charity (i think they just like to see my stuff)


And we're ready for a trip to the range


No pics from the range... it was utter chaos there today, and I had several weapons that needed firing and just didn't think about it. Ammo was xm193, and the second and third shot of the first string landed about 4.5" higher than the first round- my guess is that first round caught hell from the burr. Zero went very smooth and the weapon fires fine, ejecting xm193 almost exactly 3 o'clock.

Bone-head move of the day- I forgot my allen set, and so was unable to mount a scope and do accuracy testing. It screwed my day for a few other weapons too- just more evidence that i need to get with the times and order up some QD scope mounts. BAH. Next trip to the range is Monday after tomorrow- I'll catch up then. 25m zero produced 3-shot groups within 1cm of each other, so it's at least 1 minute-of-man, which is really all we ask.

I did email AFM about the burrs and FSB size-

I have two things I want to bring to your attention-

*I specifically ordered "F" marked FSBs. They are not marked, and mic to 1.966", which is a lower shelf than F bases, but still higher than A2 bases- they're right in between specs. It's not low enough that I necessarily expect trouble zeroing the irons, but is definately not in spec. Do you use a proprietary FSB, or is this an oversight?

*Gas ports on both barrels were burred pretty bad. One worse than the other, with about 1/16th (visual estimation) of material protruding into the bore, the other about half that. Deburring with an aluminum scraper removed most of the material, but there's still a ring between 1/32nd-1/64th thick all the way around the port, indicating significant density.

Thanks,

Ben

the owner himself emailed me back (i think it's a pretty small operation)-

Ben,

Have you shot the barrels? We stand behind our barrels 100%, If you are not happy with your purchase, send them back. Our barrels are within the DoD, MIL-STD for the M4-A1 barrels and carbine. What "spec" are you speaking of? Because alot of people speak of mil spec. Mil spec or specification is a broad description of what is required. It has nothing to do with how it is made or what it is made of. The MIL-STD (military standard) will dictate what the raw material is, how it is manufactured and to what standard that it is made to. Our benchmark starts at MIL-STD. We have those same barrels on AM4-A1 carbines that we have sold to military and law enforcement with no complaints. I have several AM4-A1Carbines with over 20,000 rounds and a few with over 30,000. All still functional and maintaining their accuracy and reliability to the point that I would take them to war myself. To date, we have never had any issues with any of our barrels. Its actually quite to the contrary...we have many customers who purchase these barrels on their carbines made by AFM and they are extremely happy with their purchase. My suggestion is, if you are unhappy in any way, return the barrels for a refund. As long as they are in new unused condition. The parts that we do not manufacture, are all from current military vendors and made to MIL-STD. That means they are manufactured by other current military vendors for the DoD, and we stand behind every part we use from them. I am at a loss as to what your issue is. Are you emailing to display your knowledge of the manufacture of AR15/M16/M4's? Or are you asking for your maoney back? In any case, I am not trying to be rude, but need to know what you require.

Thanks, Mitch

The email was totally pointless, and insulting, so I sent a scathing email back.. to which he hasn't replied. I give him credit for that. I guess an email with "concerns" but no demands for money back are unusual- I emailed for the sole purpose of seeing if they'd offer to take them back or tell me to screw off- I got both.

I give a thumbs up to the barrels, based on what you get for how much you pay, if you'll inspect what you get and address any problems. I would NOT have fired without deburring- they was nasty, especially the one. Customer service blows- I think they're a brand new company, hopefully they'll get that part figured out.

-Ben

[87GN]

Nice write up...

I looked over their stuff about a year and a half ago at a gun show, I really was not all that impressed with the quality of the uppers and barrels on their tables, they did not jive with their verbal and written statements/claims.

[bkb0000]

Nice write up...

I looked over their stuff about a year and a half ago at a gun show, I really was not all that impressed with the quality of the uppers and barrels on their tables, they did not jive with their verbal and written statements/claims.

my ONLY experience with them has been these two barrels, and the ordeal of getting them. what didnt you like?

[Heavy Metal]

I wonder what Ned's Reamer would do to the chamber?

[87GN]

my ONLY experience with them has been these two barrels, and the ordeal of getting them. what didnt you like?

Kinda hard to remember. They were really talking their stuff up, but the uppers didn't seem to be all that. It's been a long time, I just walked away with a bad taste in my mouth. Sorry I can't be more descriptive.

[5pins]

Well I’m not impressed. They tell you that they are in stock, but their not. They tell you that they use MIL-STD parts, but they don’t. They claim that their barrels are HPT, but there not ( if they were then there would not be a burr at the gas port).

You are right about his email to you. Instead of answering a question from a customer he goes into a rant about how good his barrels are and ”To date, we have never had any issues with any of our barrels.“. Apparently you got the only two lemons they ever made.

I don’t think this guy and his company are shooting strait. Makes promises he can’t keep and claims that don’t hold up.

[bkb0000]

Well I’m not impressed. They tell you that they are in stock, but their not. They tell you that they use MIL-STD parts, but they don’t. They claim that their barrels are HPT, but there not ( if they were then there would not be a burr at the gas port).

You are right about his email to you. Instead of answering a question from a customer he goes into a rant about how good his barrels are and ”To date, we have never had any issues with any of our barrels.“. Apparently you got the only two lemons they ever made.

I don’t think this guy and his company are shooting strait. Makes promises he can’t keep and claims that don’t hold up.

hmm.. i'm pretty sure HPT is done before drilling- probably even before turning, a lot of the time, although that defeats some of the purpose. have you seen otherwise?

the FSB is the only thing that's not to spec, as far as i have the ability to see- i suspect it's an attempt to be both at the same time. A2 FSBs are 1.94, F bases are 1.98- this one was right smack in the middle. I had to turn the FSP up about two notches from flush, which is totally acceptable.

The port burrs are lame, for sure- but it's not insurmountable for a gunsmith/armorer, and when you consider (so long as they aren't lying about barrel steel and testing) everything else, it's worth the $75-$100 in savings. the unfortunate part is, as we can guess, any complete rifles, being sold to the general public, probably go out all burred to shit.

[Eric]

Thanks for the great write up and pics. It looks like they have the potential to be a good supplier, but their business practices may need some help.

[bkb0000]

I wonder what Ned's Reamer would do to the chamber?

glad you mentioned that- i'll be ordering one this week, along with his ".223/556? gage." before firing, i manually cycled a few rounds, just to see how it felt- and there's definately some drag. i havent had a chance to scrub out the chamber and try again, but i suspect it is, indeed tight.

[5pins]

I just assumed it was done after all the machining was done. I was under the impression that the barrel extension and gas port were done at the same time, and I don’t see how they could do a high presser test with out the barrel extension.

The burr is not a big deal. I was talking with a rep at Sabre a few month ago about a barrel I got with a burr at the gas port. He told me that they just shoot them out and it will not affect accuracy.