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Thread: So...is SCAR16 done for?

  1. #1
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    Question So...is SCAR16 done for?

    Was looking at a SCAR16 the other day, I like the light handling but with the news that Special Ops Cmd moving away from SCAR-L, and only getting SCAR-H from now on, it seems SCAR16 is done for? I don't think any other militaries are looking at it, and there's been no LE talk about it either.

    So is the SCAR16 (the 5.56mm only version) about the shortest living mil-spec weapon? Does that give you pause about buying or keeping SCAR16 as a personal rifle?

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    No. SCAR is great rifle....
    FFL/SOT

    Chuck Norris has to maintain a concealed weapon license in all 50 states in order to legally wear pants.

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    I have had my scar a little over 2 years now, and must admit it's a great rifle.

    However, the past couple of weeks I have been heavily debating selling it to fund a kac sr15 e3. I am just not as impressed by the scar 16s as I once was when I got it. Compared to my run of the mill ar's it doesn't do anything that makes it worth 2x the price, and from what I ahve read that's the way the military feels.

    I have now decided to hang onto the scar for one reason, I just think it's cool and would hate to let it go only to want one later on. I would really like to get an sbr barrel one day, and if/when that happens I think the scar 16s will really come alive. For me a piston driven short barreled suppressed rifle is the highlight of the scar platform.

    IMO, if you are looking for a 16" carbine, I would hesitate on buying the scar. If you are hoping for a great canidate to sbr, I think it is hard to beat the scar. The only options available now are having the factory barrel cut, but I like to be an optimist and hope some kind of factory or aftermarket barrel will be offered in 10.5". I think the scar 16s will continue to be a "fun" rifle for civilians to purchase and eventually the aftermarket will grow to support the rifle.

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    If production is stopped tomorrow and no one picks it up, I'd still keep mine. Great rifle and haven't regretted it for a second.
    Dave Merrill
    Instructor for MilCopp Tactical LLC.

    Rifle first. Rifle last. Rifle always.

  5. #5
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    It was determined that the SCAR-L gave no performance gains over the existing platform. Period.

    For what it's worth, there were numerous failures. Despite popular opinion on the internet, a carbine course is not hardcore, and not the final measure of a firearm. Under harsher conditions, things broke.

    I'm not saying not to buy one. Who am I to tell a man what to use his money on? I'm not saying it's a horrible gun either. I'm just stating some facts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NongShim View Post
    It was determined that the SCAR-L gave no performance gains over the existing platform. Period.

    For what it's worth, there were numerous failures. Despite popular opinion on the internet, a carbine course is not hardcore, and not the final measure of a firearm. Under harsher conditions, things broke.

    I'm not saying not to buy one. Who am I to tell a man what to use his money on? I'm not saying it's a horrible gun either. I'm just stating some facts.
    Please post links and specifics to your facts.....
    FFL/SOT

    Chuck Norris has to maintain a concealed weapon license in all 50 states in order to legally wear pants.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NongShim View Post
    It was determined that the SCAR-L gave no performance gains over the existing platform. Period.

    For what it's worth, there were numerous failures. Despite popular opinion on the internet, a carbine course is not hardcore, and not the final measure of a firearm. Under harsher conditions, things broke.

    I'm not saying not to buy one. Who am I to tell a man what to use his money on? I'm not saying it's a horrible gun either. I'm just stating some facts.
    I'm always interested in what a SME has to say even though it goes against popular conceptions.

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    I think that the SCAR 16 will be around for as long as there are not 5.56mm conversion kits for the SCAR 17. Even so, I don't think we've heard the last of the -16.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fjallhrafn View Post
    I think that the SCAR 16 will be around for as long as there are not 5.56mm conversion kits for the SCAR 17....

    That's what I was thinking too. Getting SCAR 17, and then can convert to 5.56x45 any time I want, and still have the platform for 7.62x51Nato. There might even be conversion to make it close to being DMR. All that versatility is lost with SCAR16.

    Even then, it's pretty sad that SCAR has come to this. If the Army carbine project doesn't select it, then the SCAR will probably be the shortest lived assault weapon design.
    Last edited by Bushmaster-M4A3; 06-27-11 at 23:15.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by NongShim View Post
    It was determined that the SCAR-L gave no performance gains over the existing platform. Period.
    I'd like some facts and figures to go with that input; don't get me wrong, if something better rolls along I'd get all high-school about that shit (I have no loyalty to any particular platform) but in my qualitative and quantitative views it is incrementally better than an M4A1 is about every category, sans gas system (neutral) and barrel profile (negative).
    Dave Merrill
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    Rifle first. Rifle last. Rifle always.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 99HMC4 View Post
    Please post links and specifics to your facts.....

    That yellow highlight on his name should be enough to accept without demanding specifics that he might not be able to post.
    Employee of colonialshooting.com

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by NongShim View Post
    It was determined that the SCAR-L gave no performance gains over the existing platform. Period.

    For what it's worth, there were numerous failures. Despite popular opinion on the internet, a carbine course is not hardcore, and not the final measure of a firearm. Under harsher conditions, things broke.
    Does the SCAR-L break any less than M4A1 in the field? Both shoot the same caliber, and use the same magazine, so it's probably difficult to achieve the 100% performance increase that Army is looking for.
    Last edited by Bushmaster-M4A3; 06-27-11 at 23:41.

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    I was never in a position to be issued this weapon, but I was in A-stan when the first SCARs made their debut in 2009/2010. Issues that saw on my last deployment included:

    1) Reciprocating Charging Handle - Although a desgin requirement for the contract, this was not popular with many end users. I cannot imagine that it would be considered in any M4 replacement contract.

    2) Fragile Stock - Everything from the hinge back seemed to be relative weak compared to the rest of the rifle. The issues with the stock latch breaking were not limited to civilian rifles. It was also not uncommon to see tape applied to the cheek raiser or other broken stock parts.

    Most of the people that I spoke to about the rifle described it as "different," but not necessarily better or worse that the M4. The SCAR H was much better received mainly because it accomplished the mission in a lighter package than it's 7.62 competition (which were not nearly as reliable or easy to support/maintain as the M4)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Templar View Post
    That yellow highlight on his name should be enough to accept without demanding specifics that he might not be able to post.
    If someone has a question about that, take it to PM, not the open forum.
    Employee of colonialshooting.com

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    Didn't know it was top secret. Don't really care at this point, I'm keeping mine next to my ARs. Regardless of what color screen names are highlighted in....
    FFL/SOT

    Chuck Norris has to maintain a concealed weapon license in all 50 states in order to legally wear pants.

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    My buddy at the Ranger Rgt says 1/75 was unhappy with it in service. Lots of broken parts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 99HMC4 View Post
    Please post links and specifics to your facts.....
    Just being able to have high round counts doesn't make a rifle solder proof.

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    USSOCOM PAO officer statement on 6/10/2011 - "The Mk 17 will fill an existing capability gap for a 7.62 mm rifle. The Mk 16 does not provide enough of a performance advantage over the M4 to justify spending limited USSOCOM funds when competing priorities are taken into consideration."

    From: http://kitup.military.com/2010/08/ki...l-grinder.html

    Pro guys can focus on "when competing priorities are taken into consideration."

    Con guys can focus on "does not provide enough of a performance advantage over the M4 "

    As for me, I'll stick to the Vulcan M4 because every one in the know knows that Hesse (sorry meant Vulcan) is the rifle used by those on the Tip of the Spear.

  19. #19
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    There are quite a few of us that were, and are, aware of things about the SCAR and the program that we are not able to share. It isn't perfect, just as *shock* most things aren't.
    When an Industry Professional or Subject Matter Expert does not jump to provide extensive documentation of an event or occurence, it's usually because the source or nature of the information is not for dissemination or they are held by a non-disclosure agreement.
    Jack Leuba
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    As accurate as needed, as fast as possible, as many times as it takes.

  20. #20
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    I know that happened with a platform my agency looked at to replace our ageing handguns. We found that platform that others on the West Coast and on this site love that we did not due to requirements that we tested. We are not aloud to say anything as well but that is the requirement if we want to test guns prior to buying them.

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