Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: educate me on compact or subcompact DA/SA guns

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    149
    Feedback Score
    4 (100%)

    educate me on compact or subcompact DA/SA guns

    I am looking for a compact or subcompact 9mm carry weapon and would like to keep the DA/SA trigger. I shoot it much better and my competition/training/home defense guns are all 9mm DA/SA.

    S&W 3913 - heard this is a really good gun, but the fact that it's discontinued makes me nervous about spare parts and magazine availability.

    Beretta PX4 subcompact - ??

    what else is out there?
    Last edited by GrandPooba; 08-14-11 at 20:13.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    E. Tenn
    Posts
    1,094
    Feedback Score
    0
    Sig P239
    Hk P2000sk
    Beretta 92 compact

    Smith used to offer other models of compacts but not sure what is in production at this time. There may be others as well but these are the first that came to mind.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    764
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by GrandPooba View Post
    I shoot it much better and my competition/training/home defense guns are all 9mm DA/SA.
    And what guns are those?

    A lot of people like having a different gun for every day of the week, but it makes most sense for your carry gun to be as similar as possible to the gun(s) you use most often outside of carry.
    "I have your number. Consider yourself warned."

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Here and there.....
    Posts
    548
    Feedback Score
    4 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by opmike View Post
    And what guns are those?

    A lot of people like having a different gun for every day of the week, but it makes most sense for your carry gun to be as similar as possible to the gun(s) you use most often outside of carry.
    +1

    You'll be a much better shooter/gun fighter if you stick with one platform and NOT have several different models. "Fear the man who decides to only have one gun......he'll know how to use it."

    I feel that the best DA/SA guns out there right now are the H&K series. Full sized models would be the P30/P30L or HK 45, compact models would be the P2000 and HK45c, and subcompact would be the P2000SK. Variant #3 is DA/SA with decocker which is usually the standard trigger configuration.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    149
    Feedback Score
    4 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by opmike View Post
    And what guns are those?

    A lot of people like having a different gun for every day of the week, but it makes most sense for your carry gun to be as similar as possible to the gun(s) you use most often outside of carry.
    yes, hence the fact that I specified that they all be DA/SA instead of a mix of striker fired, single action, and DA/SA stuff.

    All my shooting right now is done on the Beretta 92FS.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    764
    Feedback Score
    4 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by GrandPooba View Post
    ...... would like to keep the DA/SA trigger. I shoot it much better........
    While I own and carry a 3913, and it is an excellent carry choice, my experience with DA/SA is you will not be as accurate as you like with that first shot compared to an action like a Glock unless you are very close. Empirical data observed in a pistol class tells me the same thing. Lot's of first shot misses from the DA/SA shooters. Training will definitely help.

    The 3913 is a very good choice and I would not hesitate to buy one for carry if you are a DA/SA guy. The mags are limited to 7 rounds, but that is why I like it. The single stack allows for a very slim grip.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    1,627
    Feedback Score
    0
    CDNN has used S&W 6906's for cheap right now, and some retailers like Academy and Cabelas have Beretta 92 compacts, the first to be imported in about ten years. If you shoot mostly Beretta, it's worth giving them a look.
    Cyril: Oh now that's a breach of trust!

    Lana: Do you really want to open this can of trust-breachy worms after I just found you and my ex-boyfriend with a dead hooker in the trunk?

    Cyril: ...I do not.

    A Dream of the Dark Continent

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    149
    Feedback Score
    4 (100%)
    are all these S&W third gen semiautos like the 3913 and 6906 discontinued? The 92 compact would be great though though it apparently is quite difficult to find

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    KY
    Posts
    486
    Feedback Score
    1 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by GrandPooba View Post
    are all these S&W third gen semiautos like the 3913 and 6906 discontinued? The 92 compact would be great though though it apparently is quite difficult to find
    The Smith's are discontiued, but some may still be made for large LEO contracts like NYPD (but theirs are DAO).
    The 92C is $568 at Bud's...http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/75958
    Last edited by cathellsk; 08-15-11 at 10:17.
    "When you go home, Tell them of us and say, For your tomorrow, We gave our today."

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Here and there.....
    Posts
    548
    Feedback Score
    4 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by GrandPooba View Post
    are all these S&W third gen semiautos like the 3913 and 6906 discontinued? The 92 compact would be great though though it apparently is quite difficult to find
    Berettas are not what they used to be. Just like with Sig Sauer, the company cannot keep a high enough profit margin by producing expensive alloy frames while having a DA/SA mechanism and still compete in the polymer framed market. Sig and Beretta have outsourced many small parts, and they have started using cheaper quality aluminum alloy for frames in order to keep the prices down. The concequence is guns that have a shorter lifespan, and are more likely to break parts. M9 contracts are still using the high quality specifications, but those are not available to the public......just as contract M11s are not available to the public. The days of high quality alloy framed pistols that are priced under $1500 are over. Times change, and the competition has found a much more cost effective method of producing firearms that are equal or better to alloy framed pistols. Alloy framed guns cannot compete at the same price level and still be of high quality.

    The PX4 is a "so-so" gun. New Orleans PD has had a number of issues with them as far as long term reliability goes. By no means is the PX4 in the same realm as the Glock, M&P, or H&K series. I'll say it again......H&K at present offers the best overall DA/SA pistol platform in all calibers, variants, and sizes. They have also never experienced a "slump" in quality as S&W, Beretta, Sig Sauer, and Glock have. Decade after decade, H&K firearms are top of the line.

    This coming from a guy who has used nothing but Sigs for the last 12 years. If Beretta, or some other alloy/steel framed pistol is what you have your heart set on, most of those designs were at their peak in the early to mid 1990s. Try to find something in that time frame. My best Sigs range from 1988-1995, and the quality degraded after that as the market forces changed.
    Last edited by KhanRad; 08-15-11 at 10:44.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    138
    Feedback Score
    7 (100%)
    +1 HK/Sig

    I think slide safeties are a complete PITA.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Palo Alto, CA
    Posts
    3,378
    Feedback Score
    0
    The "best" current DA/SA are HK's, as noted.

    When I graduated from the Police Academy, I used a 92F on duty and a 3913 off-duty; likewise when we transitioned to the 4566, I continued to use the 3913--it is a great little pistol for CCW.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,416
    Feedback Score
    7 (100%)
    The 3913 is a great little gun. I still have mine, it lives in the utility drawer in my kitchen (next to the cork screw).

    If starting anew, I'd want to go with a gun that is still in production. Otherwise parts and magazines could be an issue.

    Currently, I'd look hard at the HK P2000K if I wanted to stay with DA/SA. They're a little more expensive but the quality is worth it in my opinion.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    102
    Feedback Score
    5 (100%)
    The P30 is about the size of a Glock 19..... Its the "fullsize" but its built compact.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    E. Tenn
    Posts
    1,094
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by DWood View Post
    While I own and carry a 3913, and it is an excellent carry choice, my experience with DA/SA is you will not be as accurate as you like with that first shot compared to an action like a Glock unless you are very close. Empirical data observed in a pistol class tells me the same thing. Lot's of first shot misses from the DA/SA shooters. Training will definitely help.

    The 3913 is a very good choice and I would not hesitate to buy one for carry if you are a DA/SA guy. The mags are limited to 7 rounds, but that is why I like it. The single stack allows for a very slim grip.
    I agree to a point, however someone who trains exclusively with a DA loses no accuracy when using the DA function. I know I used to be just as accurate and usually more accurate in DA than SA. The way the OP is describing himself I would guess he knows this as well. But again you are right, for the masses a Glock or M&P type trigger is easier to acheive accuracy with. The last few years I've not had the finances to maintain my DA/SA accuracy and have gone to Glocks and M&P's and have found it easier to maintain an accecptable level of accuracy with a much reduced training schedule.

    You are also on the money with the 3913, I've had a couple of them and they were very good CCW pistols.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    627
    Feedback Score
    7 (100%)
    I always liked the 3913LS and 3913NL, great ccw pistols.
    Last edited by titsonritz; 08-15-11 at 14:18.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    788
    Feedback Score
    0
    There's also the CZ PCR, P06, and the Rami

    I've got somewhere in the neighborhood of 3,000 trouble free rounds through my PCR, and it conceals well.

    The PCR is also known as the 75D compact, it's alloy framed with a decocker, snag free sights, and a loaded chamber indicator.

    the P06 is essentially a PCR missing the loaded chamber indicator but with a railed dust cover.

    the Rami is their subcompact line.
    Last edited by An Undocumented Worker; 08-15-11 at 20:35.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Here and there.....
    Posts
    548
    Feedback Score
    4 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by An Undocumented Worker View Post
    There's also the CZ PCR, P06, and the Rami

    I've got somewhere in the neighborhood of 3,000 trouble free rounds through my PCR, and it conceals well.

    The PCR is also known as the 75D compact, it's alloy framed with a decocker, snag free sights, and a loaded chamber indicator.

    the P06 is essentially a PCR missing the loaded chamber indicator but with a railed dust cover.

    the Rami is their subcompact line.
    I went through a CZ phase in the early 2000s. The good is that they have very good ergonomics and are accurate. The bad is that they tend to break parts on a regular basis, and require servicing often to retain their reliability outside of a static range. When their high end competition pistol models come from the factory with six(yes 6), extra slide stop levers and 3 extra trigger bar springs you know there is at least a couple of major problems with the design.

    For most shooters that will likely never go beyond 5000rds on a pistol, the CZ will likely do just fine. For those shooters who expect more......well it's a risk. Having a slide stop, trigger spring, or extractor spring crap out on you in a fire fight can get you killed. A 3rd generation Glock, M&P, or HK P30 will exceed 50,000 rounds on average before things run the risk of breaking.
    Last edited by KhanRad; 08-15-11 at 21:47.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Always in the mountains.
    Posts
    293
    Feedback Score
    0
    The 3913 is a good gun, but I have never liked slide mounted controls. The price on it may make you overlook imperfections like that.

    Aside from that, I'm very fond of my P2000SK in .40S&W. The recoil on it is very mild for a .40, so the 9mm should be very nice.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    1,627
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyohte View Post
    The 3913 is a good gun, but I have never liked slide mounted controls. The price on it may make you overlook imperfections like that.

    Aside from that, I'm very fond of my P2000SK in .40S&W. The recoil on it is very mild for a .40, so the 9mm should be very nice.
    I too think the slide-mounted safety/decocker is a weak point in the Beretta/S&W 3rd-gen designs, which is why my carry Beretta is a 92G. The decocker's spring-loaded and thus it's always set to 'fire'. On the rare occasions I carry my 92F, I carry it uncocked and unlocked just like the 92G.
    Cyril: Oh now that's a breach of trust!

    Lana: Do you really want to open this can of trust-breachy worms after I just found you and my ex-boyfriend with a dead hooker in the trunk?

    Cyril: ...I do not.

    A Dream of the Dark Continent

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •